| 00:02:33 | blackbeard420 | LOL vim³ looks awesome! |
| 00:02:48 | rayman22201 | lmao, I saw that on HN, and I didn't even realize it was written in Nim. |
| 00:03:14 | axion | I need some help. |
| 00:03:15 | dom96 | :o |
| 00:03:18 | axion | Lemme make a playground |
| 00:03:28 | rayman22201 | axion, you are correct. inject makes the variable "dirty". It injects it into the parent scope instead of gensyming a clean variable name. |
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| 00:05:46 | rayman22201 | wow, the dude wrote a Nim editor by wrapping libvim. Who is this guy and why isn't he on irc? lol https://github.com/paranim/paravim |
| 00:05:52 | axion | https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gaF |
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| 00:08:44 | rayman22201 | looking and thinking ^ |
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| 00:14:10 | rayman22201 | seems to just work? https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gaH |
| 00:15:15 | axion | nope... |
| 00:15:35 | axion | https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gaI |
| 00:15:50 | axion | oh wait...you mapped vec2 differently |
| 00:16:32 | axion | Yeah ok, that seems to work. Thanks! |
| 00:16:41 | rayman22201 | 👍 |
| 00:17:17 | axion | ideally i'd want the template to expand to 2 templates. no need for function overhead there |
| 00:17:25 | axion | wonder if that will cause any problems |
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| 00:20:41 | rayman22201 | like this? https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gaL |
| 00:20:41 | rayman22201 | feels like premature optimization. I would expect those functions to get inlined anyway? but you can do it I believe. |
| 00:21:02 | axion | Cool. How do I expand a template? expandMacros doesn't seem to be doing anything |
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| 00:21:45 | rayman22201 | good question... I'm not sure if we have a way to expand templates... |
| 00:22:17 | axion | Ah hmm |
| 00:22:22 | madprops | the nim package in ubuntu is practically useless if it's too old |
| 00:22:59 | rayman22201 | poke the ubuntu people to upgrade? |
| 00:23:32 | madprops | well no use if im running an LTS release |
| 00:23:35 | axion | If you care about stability, use a Debian derivitive. If you're a developer, don't. |
| 00:24:15 | madprops | would be ok if nimble could update everything somehow |
| 00:24:41 | Yardanico | choosenim exists :P |
| 00:25:02 | madprops | oh forgot about that |
| 00:25:55 | rayman22201 | I think expandMacros **should** work on templates, but I'm not sure |
| 00:26:17 | axion | Well I'd like to see an example of that working, because I am then doing something entirely wrong. |
| 00:27:06 | rayman22201 | oh, it's working for me? |
| 00:27:31 | rayman22201 | The output gets put in the compiler output, not the output of the program. |
| 00:27:49 | rayman22201 | https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gaO |
| 00:27:49 | axion | oh so you can't use nim playground to see it anyway? |
| 00:28:03 | rayman22201 | you can. click on the button that shows "Showing: output" |
| 00:28:11 | rayman22201 | it will switch to "showing: debug" |
| 00:28:14 | rayman22201 | it's a toggle switch |
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| 00:28:21 | axion | oh :) |
| 00:28:40 | rayman22201 | probably need better docs for that :-) |
| 00:28:42 | axion | No idea how I missed that. |
| 00:29:10 | rayman22201 | NP. it's not entirely obvious |
| 00:29:53 | axion | now it would be super nice if it worked recursively |
| 00:30:09 | axion | Because that would really be the only use for expanding a template...to see the final code gen |
| 00:30:34 | axion | ie; instead of printing the inner template calls...expand those too |
| 00:30:49 | rayman22201 | The VM is really sensitive to recursion, that's why it doesn't |
| 00:31:13 | rayman22201 | You can embed "expandMacro" statements in your macro to simulate it though. |
| 00:31:43 | axion | In Lisp we have macroexpand-1 (which this is doing) and macroexpand (which is what I want). Oh well |
| 00:35:11 | moerm_ | - Back - |
| 00:35:20 | rayman22201 | It's not a bad feature request? Start here: https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/blob/version-1-0/lib/core/macros.nim#L507, and then make a version that traverses the node and collects the reprs instead of just getting the single node. |
| 00:36:55 | rayman22201 | just be careful about the VM. it has a low recursion limit. I would probably unroll the recursion into a loop. |
| 00:37:20 | axion | Thanks. It'll be a while before I get to hacking on the language, but I do plan on bringing some niceties over from Lisp sometime soon. For now, just writing lots of code to really get to know the language |
| 00:38:32 | rayman22201 | fair enough. 😉 |
| 00:40:28 | FromGitter | <zetashift> Isn't there a switch that increases that recursion limit? |
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| 00:42:26 | rayman22201 | yes, but if you want to add a feature to the core of the language, you aren't going to rely on increasing the limit |
| 00:43:30 | rayman22201 | I was proposing adding to the std lib. As a nimble package / personal utility, sure, go ham lol. |
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| 00:45:14 | moerm_ | See you all tomorrow |
| 00:45:23 | * | moerm_ quit (Quit: Leaving) |
| 00:53:48 | FromGitter | <zetashift> gnight moerm_ |
| 00:54:35 | axion | rayman22201: interesting... |
| 00:55:08 | axion | if i change the procs to templates like you did, the expansion doesn't have the * for exporting them |
| 00:55:45 | axion | and i indeed do get compile errors when trying to access the members across modules |
| 00:55:53 | rayman22201 | sure enough... that's a bug. please report! |
| 00:58:36 | axion | I will, even though my bug reports don't seem to get any replies :) |
| 00:59:28 | FromGitter | <zetashift> limited manpower |
| 01:00:03 | FromGitter | <zetashift> I don't think that means they go unnoticed axion |
| 01:00:06 | axion | I'm not knocking on Nim, but I do think the 1.0 stability guarantee was a few years premature |
| 01:00:41 | leorize | stable just means that your code won't break in updates :) |
| 01:00:44 | rayman22201 | *cough* I agree *cough* pre-mature marketing *cough* |
| 01:00:48 | axion | Just in my first library I'm finding a lot of compiler bugs |
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| 01:01:16 | leorize | the original plan was to pause it until we got rid of all the bugs :) |
| 01:01:35 | FromGitter | <zetashift> I found it too, but more people using Nim (because of 1.0) might also mean more bugs being discovered |
| 01:02:55 | leorize | yep, 1.0 was the main gatekeeper for people to not use Nim, so in the end the decision was to tackle that :p |
| 01:03:00 | rayman22201 | The problem is, soooo many Hacker News junkies and the "trend followers" were complaining that they wouldn't touch Nim because it was "beta" and "experimental" forever. It was just another excuse to not use the language. |
| 01:03:05 | axion | That is a valid point. There are never no bugs. users.inc if you ever think so |
| 01:03:47 | FromGitter | <zetashift> I do hope Nim decides to do a like an 'Autumn of tooling' or winter of fixing bugs(which I guess is hacktorberfest) to work more on those areas |
| 01:03:49 | leorize | I find it interesting that no one complains about style insensitivity any more |
| 01:03:53 | FromGitter | <zetashift> YES |
| 01:04:37 | rayman22201 | lol. lets hope it stays that way :-P |
| 01:05:58 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> Personally, IRT the 1.0 stuff, I just wanted the grammar to be stable, that's why I waited |
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| 01:06:21 | leorize | it was stable |
| 01:06:24 | leorize | :P |
| 01:07:11 | leorize | since 0.19 IIRC |
| 01:07:12 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> Ok, well, I never heard or read that 🙂 |
| 01:07:21 | FromGitter | <zetashift> You were one of the few then Benumbed, I saw a lot of comments that couldn't introduce it in their team/work because of no 1.0 |
| 01:07:29 | FromDiscord | <Rika> oof |
| 01:07:33 | rayman22201 | It was FUD honestly |
| 01:07:37 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> Not saying it wasn't communicated, just that I didn't actually see a "no more grammar changes" |
| 01:07:41 | FromGitter | <zetashift> I don't think anyone asked if the grammar was stable :P |
| 01:07:58 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> And I came back because I assumed it was in 1.0, haha 😄 |
| 01:08:11 | leorize | it's still not stable btw :) |
| 01:08:54 | leorize | it's not like the language is gonna turn upside down in just a release :P |
| 01:08:58 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> Regardless, I'm using it seriously now though, if only for personal stuff |
| 01:09:14 | leorize | unless you're julia-lang, they messed up their 1.0 hard |
| 01:09:19 | FromGitter | <zetashift> How's the ride so far? |
| 01:09:21 | rayman22201 | 1.0 brought some kind of "stability guarantee" (whatever that means) lol. The best thing it brought was a more measured approach to maintaining backwards compatibility. Deprecation paths are taken more seriously now. |
| 01:09:52 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> That's really all you can ask for too |
| 01:09:58 | FromDiscord | <Rika> what happened with julia's 1.0? |
| 01:09:58 | rayman22201 | talking about Nim. I don't know jack about Julia. (sorry, got irc snipped) |
| 01:10:10 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> I just don't want my code that I worked so hard to to randomly break in odd ways 🙂 |
| 01:10:20 | leorize | julia removed all deprecated things when they release 1.0 |
| 01:10:35 | leorize | breaking a tons of libraries |
| 01:10:49 | rayman22201 | lol. fail |
| 01:11:20 | FromGitter | <zetashift> wasn't that because 0.6 was basically the road to 1.0 |
| 01:11:21 | FromDiscord | <Rika> how much time did they give for the deprecated things though |
| 01:11:25 | axion | https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/issues/13828 |
| 01:11:39 | FromGitter | <zetashift> so that basically the jump to 0.6 to 1.0 was non-existant |
| 01:12:02 | rayman22201 | Then again, we always kind of cared about backwards compatibility. Nim still tries to keep examples from a 3 year old book still working... |
| 01:12:22 | FromDiscord | <Rika> deprecated things should disappear some update no? |
| 01:12:33 | FromDiscord | <Rika> it just depends how much time itll take |
| 01:12:54 | axion | The people in my circle won't touch Nim because "it doesn't offer anything over Rust". Sigh |
| 01:13:06 | leorize | rust is the new hip thing now |
| 01:13:10 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> IMO they should warn, then error, with a switch to turn on the old behavior, then disappear, so far Nim seems to handle that pretty well from what I've seen |
| 01:13:26 | rayman22201 | yup. exactly what nim does |
| 01:13:39 | rayman22201 | sigh... Nim offers waaayyy better ergonomics than Rust |
| 01:13:40 | leorize | yea, we got that ever since packages testing was brought into CI |
| 01:13:51 | axion | I'm actually looking forward to Jai though, if it ever comes out of vaporware |
| 01:14:15 | rayman22201 | axion, for your usecase in particular, I don't blame you. |
| 01:14:22 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> Rust makes you scale a concrete wall with rusty nails pointing out at you for their learning curve |
| 01:14:42 | axion | rayman22201: what do you mean for my usecase? |
| 01:14:46 | rayman22201 | games |
| 01:14:46 | leorize | I just dislike their grammar |
| 01:14:51 | axion | Oh yeah :) |
| 01:15:00 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> Still plan on learning more of it one of these days, but Nim is actually pleasant to use most of the time, vs Rust or Go |
| 01:15:07 | leorize | though I haven't looked at rust for quite sometime |
| 01:15:17 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> Also the Nim community is nice, vs Rust, they tended toward the rabid side |
| 01:15:24 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> and Go people and their idoms... |
| 01:15:26 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> lord |
| 01:15:47 | FromGitter | <zetashift> I think that kind of happens when a community get's too big for it's own good |
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| 01:16:09 | leorize | once Nim is big enough you'll see that kind of things too |
| 01:16:09 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> agreed |
| 01:16:20 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> Which is why I'm ok that it's small right now! 😄 |
| 01:16:24 | FromGitter | <zetashift> haha |
| 01:16:32 | rayman22201 | Dr. Nim + arc gives Nim equivalent guarantees as Rust (arguably the potential to have even better guarantees.) |
| 01:16:55 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> and why I'm trying to contribute by writing useful libraries, even if I'm slow as hell at it atm |
| 01:16:57 | FromGitter | <zetashift> I hope they document those stuff for beginners. One thing Rust did really well is their book |
| 01:17:04 | axion | What is Dr. Nim, and what is CFG? I've seen both mentioned here this week a lot but I am clueless :) |
| 01:17:21 | rayman22201 | https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/blob/version-1-0/lib/core/macros.nim#L507 |
| 01:17:25 | FromGitter | <zetashift> book/documentation they made the entry really low even tho it's such a hard to learn language |
| 01:17:33 | rayman22201 | Dr. Nim is embedding a proof checker into Nim |
| 01:17:39 | rayman22201 | Ada Spark style |
| 01:17:45 | leorize | axion: CFG is control flow graph |
| 01:17:57 | FromGitter | <zetashift> Using Z3 |
| 01:18:18 | FromGitter | <zetashift> whoops forgot this: https://github.com/Z3Prover/z3 |
| 01:18:22 | axion | Ah yeah. I had to use z3 to solve a really complex control flow graph in my game engine. Good stuff |
| 01:18:55 | leorize | the compiler also got itself a CFG for destructors injection |
| 01:18:57 | FromGitter | <zetashift> I think it used Zevv's z3 bindings as a base? |
| 01:19:10 | leorize | though it's not used anywhere else yet |
| 01:19:24 | leorize | maybe we can finally fix `not nil` with it :P |
| 01:19:43 | leorize | @zetashift: yea |
| 01:19:43 | rayman22201 | CFG can also be used to optimize async :-) |
| 01:20:49 | FromGitter | <zetashift> Is DrNim slated for 1.2? |
| 01:23:36 | rayman22201 | not sure |
| 01:25:55 | FromGitter | <zetashift> Oh well I'm looking forward to it |
| 01:26:03 | FromGitter | <zetashift> Goodnight y'all |
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| 01:27:29 | rayman22201 | gn o/ |
| 01:27:38 | axion | rayman22201: Quick question. With your playground code, how come I'm not allowed to do `Quat.genAccessors(w, 0)` ? |
| 01:28:12 | rayman22201 | Quat is a type. UFC syntax doesn't work on types |
| 01:28:23 | axion | Ah ok |
| 01:28:25 | rayman22201 | a `typedesc` |
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| 01:32:55 | leorize[m] | rayman22201: ufcs does work on typedesc |
| 01:33:18 | rayman22201 | oh? then why doesn't axion's example work? |
| 01:33:38 | leorize[m] | someone even used that to simulate python's forced module qualifier in Nim |
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| 01:34:19 | rayman22201 | actually, you are totally right. I just tried it, and it works |
| 01:35:06 | rayman22201 | @axion. what error do you get? |
| 01:35:15 | rayman22201 | https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gb0 |
| 01:36:36 | leorize | the issue you might be facing is how untyped param don't bind too well with UFCS |
| 01:38:23 | rayman22201 | It's a template though, it's all untyped? |
| 01:38:44 | axion | error| cannot use symbol of kind 'type' as a 'param' |
| 01:41:17 | rayman22201 | axion. see my nim playground link. It works there. |
| 01:41:32 | axion | yeah i'm trying to find a repro. it doesnt in my code |
| 01:41:34 | axion | one sec |
| 01:42:54 | axion | Oh I see |
| 01:43:38 | axion | https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gb4 |
| 01:43:59 | axion | I changed `q` to `t` since it isn't specific to Quat now. Non-ucs works, but not ucs |
| 01:44:48 | FromDiscord | <Rika> you're getting symbol collision i think |
| 01:45:00 | axion | But only with UCS. weird |
| 01:45:12 | FromDiscord | <Rika> yeah works when you rename t to ty |
| 01:45:38 | axion | also works if for the below 3 calls using `t`, just not ucs |
| 01:46:14 | rayman22201 | oh yeah, in templates, it will replace the param everywhere. so "proc(t:t)" expands to "proc(Quat: Quat)" |
| 01:46:19 | rayman22201 | probably not what you want |
| 01:47:21 | axion | Yeah I wasn't going to stay with it. Was just trying to figure out why it only doesnt work with UCS |
| 01:47:43 | axion | tbh I'm going to convert this into a real macro anyway so I can iterate over a string of characters instead of having many calls |
| 01:49:55 | FromDiscord | <Varriount> Araq: Regarding macros for types, it's a shame the macro can't emit other data, like procedure implementations |
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| 02:03:59 | axion | How do I write a macro with `quote do` inside a for loop to generate N forms? |
| 02:04:22 | axion | Struggling to get it to emit any code here... |
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| 02:20:31 | rayman22201 | stupid example but here: https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gba |
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| 02:22:43 | axion | Thanks |
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| 02:26:41 | axion | What's wrong here? https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gbb |
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| 02:33:31 | rayman22201 | a is a runtime string. |
| 02:33:33 | rayman22201 | https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gbe |
| 02:33:47 | rayman22201 | that works, though might not do what you expect. (It prints the individual chars) |
| 02:34:49 | axion | Aha, so it has to be annotated as static. That is the answer to an hour of trying to emit _something_. |
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| 02:42:40 | rayman22201 | Glad I could help. |
| 02:43:07 | axion | Thank you for all your help today :) |
| 02:43:12 | rayman22201 | Static in macros is not the best documented feature... |
| 02:43:21 | rayman22201 | Np 😊 |
| 02:44:16 | axion | It's unintuitive behavior like this that has caused me to struggle with macros coming from Lisp where I am very familiar with them |
| 02:44:36 | axion | Like, why not produce any output at all if it's not static? A warning would suffice at least |
| 02:45:55 | Yardanico | dom96: sorry for pinging, but really want to know if there's any ETA to then next nimforum update will be rolled out? AFAIK the forum still runs the (frontend) version compiled in 2018, not sure about backend |
| 02:46:04 | Yardanico | s/then/the |
| 02:47:43 | rayman22201 | It's hard to tell if there is no output in the general case. The problem is that the macro took your runtime string just fine. It treaded it as a typed ast node with a len of 0. So the for loop "worked". It just had 0 iterations. |
| 02:47:57 | rayman22201 | Treated* |
| 02:48:29 | axion | I see. It seems this structure won't work for what I need it for anyway |
| 02:48:45 | axion | I'd like to produce proc definitions |
| 02:49:34 | rayman22201 | you just make your result node a nnkstatementlist, and add the list of proc definitions. |
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| 02:50:37 | axion | I tried that |
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| 02:52:35 | rayman22201 | If you remember that crazy macro I showed you for lifting bool procs, I do exactly this: https://gist.github.com/rayman22201/bfc4ce11fa15e57176130c4855407199#file-liftboolprocs-nim-L137 |
| 02:52:58 | rayman22201 | well, it makes macros, not procs, but there is no difference really. (Just the ast node type) |
| 02:53:29 | axion | https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gbl |
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| 02:53:56 | rayman22201 | off topic. I know how to get rid of the experimental thing now. (I know how to use typedescs better.) But I don't want to spend more time on it :-P |
| 02:54:10 | axion | That's ok :) |
| 02:55:11 | rayman22201 | https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gbm |
| 02:55:15 | rayman22201 | You don't need `ident` |
| 02:55:43 | axion | without it i got Error: identifier expected, but found '"x"' |
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| 02:56:38 | rayman22201 | oh, hold on. |
| 02:56:40 | rayman22201 | easy fix |
| 02:59:03 | rayman22201 | https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gbn |
| 02:59:12 | rayman22201 | two things. 1. you need static again |
| 02:59:22 | rayman22201 | 2. you can't call ident inside quote do |
| 02:59:56 | axion | let's see if i can beat myself to death with static today |
| 03:00:17 | leorize | that's a lot of statics :P |
| 03:00:20 | rayman22201 | lol. I can see why it's not intuitive for a lisper :-P |
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| 03:00:33 | axion | Well thanks. That should be enough to get me going |
| 03:00:57 | rayman22201 | np 🚀 |
| 03:03:24 | axion | The most confusing thing for a lisper is that ` means quasiquote in Lisp, whereas ` is "unquote" within the quasiquote form quote do :) |
| 03:03:31 | axion | I keep getting tripped up by that |
| 03:04:41 | rayman22201 | it's inverted? interesting. |
| 03:04:51 | axion | `(1 2 ,(+ 1 2)) ; => (1 2 3) |
| 03:05:05 | axion | comma is the unquote in lisp |
| 03:05:24 | rayman22201 | that makes some elisp code I was looking at make more sense now lol |
| 03:07:31 | rayman22201 | unfortunately Nim's quasiquote is a little less ergonomic. You can only embed variables, not full expressions. But it forces you to name unquoted things, so arguably an ok tradeoff. |
| 03:08:34 | FromDiscord | <Rika> some of us bullshit our variable names though... |
| 03:08:36 | axion | It's also inverted in the fact that macros are unhygeinic by default, whereas in Nim you supply the inject pragma to make it unhygeinic |
| 03:08:43 | FromDiscord | <Rika> < - - - - - - |
| 03:08:49 | axion | in Lisp, you manually gensym what you want |
| 03:09:03 | FromDiscord | <Rika> i think thats a good thing |
| 03:09:07 | rayman22201 | that is definitely a good thing imo |
| 03:09:12 | axion | It is |
| 03:09:27 | rayman22201 | isn't that schemes whole schtick? hygenic macros? |
| 03:09:46 | rayman22201 | the common lisp vs. scheme split |
| 03:09:46 | axion | Yes. I dislike it very much for that reason and more |
| 03:10:00 | FromDiscord | <Rika> it -> scheme? |
| 03:10:11 | FromDiscord | <Rika> why dont you like hygienic macros? |
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| 03:10:42 | axion | Yes, I don't like Scheme. When I say "Lisp" I mean Common Lisp. |
| 03:10:55 | axion | Scheme is pretty much an entirely different language for a lot of reasons |
| 03:11:10 | axion | Elisp is closer to CL than Scheme by far |
| 03:12:13 | axion | I don't like them because they don't allow for very expressive code, and syntax-case etc make "safe" macros very hard to write comparatively speaking |
| 03:13:21 | axion | rayman22201: Part of it. The bigger reason is the Lisp-1vs Lisp-2 case |
| 03:14:51 | axion | Lisp-2 means that functions and variables live in a different namespace. In Scheme, you can't use the name of an existing function, user-defined or builtin, as a variable, so it forces you to think and is the source of a lot of bugs...also not very expressive. |
| 03:15:00 | axion | So Scheme, is a Lisp-1 |
| 03:15:53 | FromDiscord | <Rika> sounds like ass |
| 03:16:07 | axion | In Common Lisp, symbols are actually objects that include a variable binding and function binding member (amoung other members) |
| 03:17:53 | axion | and there's full runtime support for querying all the different information about a symbol, such as applying its currently bound function to something, or getting it's string name, etc. The whole language is sort of designed to be as useful for code generation as it is for runtime manipulation of the language. |
| 03:21:17 | axion | CL is a very interesting language. I used it for so long because of the extensive introspection support like this, which comes in handy when modifying a game as it's running without stopping to recompile. Anyway, enough off-topic for that tangent :) |
| 03:28:08 | axion | I really like Nim and I'm trying to forget about CL :) I haven't actually used an Algol derivitive before, unless you count a brief Python experience some 20 years ago or so |
| 03:31:18 | FromDiscord | <Rika> is nim an algol derivative? |
| 03:33:31 | axion | Yes |
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| 03:37:21 | axion | http://blog.daveastels.com.s3-website-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/images/languages/PLchart.png |
| 03:37:24 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> @Rika https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generational_list_of_programming_languages#ALGOL_based |
| 03:37:24 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/371759389889003532/694752249049776259/2020-04-01-06-37-06_grim.png |
| 03:37:57 | axion | Nim would be somewhere far to the right within the huge cluster of Algol derivatives |
| 03:45:15 | FromDiscord | <Rika> Huh, does nim share a lot with Oberon? Or is there a different way of measuring if something is under another language |
| 03:49:27 | leorize | iirc 4raq say that Nim have a lot more in common with modula 3 |
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| 03:53:46 | rayman22201 | Yeah. Iirc 4raq's idea was to try and bring a lisp like macro system to modula. Something like that. |
| 03:57:16 | axion | How do I make an identifier `foo=` to be used as a proc name, given an existing ident foo? |
| 03:57:28 | FromDiscord | <Rika> In quote do? |
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| 03:57:57 | FromDiscord | <Rika> You need to make an accquoted nimnode I think, then use that in quote do |
| 03:58:41 | axion | trying to fix the second proc in test2: https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gbz |
| 04:01:06 | FromDiscord | <Rika> https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gbA |
| 04:01:20 | FromDiscord | <Rika> ah wait, made a mistake |
| 04:03:18 | FromDiscord | <Rika> https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gbB |
| 04:03:23 | FromDiscord | <Rika> axion ^ |
| 04:03:44 | axion | ah a new node type to look up. Thanks :) |
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| 04:10:24 | axion | What are the [] and []= names even called btw? I'm writing a new proc and need to name that ident something better than what i have? |
| 04:12:26 | FromDiscord | <Rika> id just call them bracket getters and setters |
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| 04:15:16 | axion | ok |
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| 04:20:47 | axion | well my first non-trivial macro seems to work. |
| 04:20:52 | axion | thanks for all the help! |
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| 04:42:03 | axion | @Rika This is what I came up with. I do have 1 question regarding a small change if you can help: https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gbK |
| 04:44:39 | axion | Or rayman22201 for that matter. I'm pretty close to how I want it |
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| 04:46:19 | voltist | Could anyone recommend a Nim image manipulation library? |
| 04:49:01 | rayman22201 | voltist: https://nimble.directory/search?query=Image |
| 04:49:42 | rayman22201 | axion: what is your question? |
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| 04:50:46 | axion | rayman22201: For line 37, it would be nice if the high level code didn't see an array of strings. I'd like to somehow modify the macro so the call looks like: genAccessors [x, y] without the stringified items in the caller. I tried a static array of symbols, but the compiler yelled at me and said to use NimNode instead. Tried that, and it errors deep inside the compiler in seminst.nim |
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| 04:57:52 | FromDiscord | <Rika> https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gbT best i could think of, axion |
| 04:58:35 | voltist | rayman22201: If I wanted a list of image libraries I would have asked for one. I'm wondering if anyone has any recommendations. |
| 04:59:12 | FromDiscord | <Rika> sorry, got no recommendations |
| 04:59:26 | FromDiscord | <Rika> only one i used was nimpng but that was more "parsing" than "manip" |
| 04:59:38 | axion | @Rika tried running it and it errors |
| 04:59:49 | FromDiscord | <Rika> oh no did i fuck up |
| 04:59:51 | FromDiscord | <Rika> lets see if i did |
| 05:00:00 | rayman22201 | Why don't you give some details on what features you actually want? Image library is pretty freaking general |
| 05:00:07 | rayman22201 | Also don't be an ass hole |
| 05:00:08 | FromDiscord | <Rika> what errors axion |
| 05:00:10 | voltist | rayman22201: Sorry, that came out a little harsh. |
| 05:00:22 | axion | @Rika just click Run :) |
| 05:00:33 | FromDiscord | <Rika> aw shite |
| 05:00:36 | FromDiscord | <Rika> ill fix em sorry |
| 05:00:55 | voltist | I'm looking specifically for a library that has the ability to draw text onto an image |
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| 05:02:21 | FromDiscord | <Rika> OH i missed one of the calls, axion, do you mind "Quat.genAccessors(w, x, y, z)" instead of the bracketed one |
| 05:03:11 | axion | Can I call it like `Quat.genAccessors w, x, y, z` without the parens? |
| 05:03:22 | FromDiscord | <Rika> dont know, i think you can |
| 05:03:30 | FromDiscord | <Rika> testing right now |
| 05:03:47 | axion | That's what I'm looking for. I'm being anal because this macro is practice for an unrelated DSL i eventually want to write |
| 05:03:52 | FromDiscord | <Rika> yeah you can |
| 05:04:02 | axion | brackets don't matter then |
| 05:04:20 | FromDiscord | <Rika> https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gbV |
| 05:05:28 | axion | What did you change besides the signature? |
| 05:05:33 | rayman22201 | Sorry, on mobile. @voltist, I think this wrapper might be the best we have. Nothing native unfortunately GitHub - zedeus/nimagemagick: ImageMagick wrapper for Nim (MagickCore/MagickWand) (https://github.com/zedeus/nimagemagick) |
| 05:06:32 | axion | Oh I see. the $ for idents |
| 05:06:36 | FromDiscord | <Rika> yeah |
| 05:06:39 | axion | Thanks. exactly what i was looking for |
| 05:06:48 | zedeus | nimagemagick is an outdated wrapper, this native one is great https://github.com/SolitudeSF/imageman |
| 05:08:04 | voltist | rayman22201: Ah well, even if it where an updated library, I may as well just go for a python library that can do what I need rather than implementing the image processing myself. |
| 05:08:13 | axion | oh very nice. starred |
| 05:09:27 | voltist | rayman22201: Thanks for the help though. Sorry again for being harsh just earlier, I don't know what came over me. |
| 05:12:11 | rayman22201 | NP. All good. Sorry we couldn't be more helpful 👍 |
| 05:13:05 | zedeus | voltist: maybe combining imageman/flippy and this? https://github.com/treeform/typography |
| 05:13:16 | axion | Thanks for the macro help everyone. Really appreciate it. I got a decent amount done today. Will finish tomorrow. o/ |
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| 05:14:28 | voltist | zedeus: I'll have a look at that for future consideration. Right now I'm just going to pass all this data to Python's matplotlib instead of making my own raster plots |
| 05:15:08 | rayman22201 | Oh, we have ggplot |
| 05:15:29 | zedeus | maybe consider this https://github.com/Vindaar/ggplotnim |
| 05:15:38 | rayman22201 | https://github.com/Vindaar/ggplotnim/blob/master/README.org |
| 05:15:49 | rayman22201 | Sniped again lol |
| 05:18:19 | voltist | rayman22201: Yeah I saw that, but I'm trying to make a very niche type of raster plot for use in neuroscience research which is already supported by matplotlib, so I may as well use it |
| 05:19:27 | rayman22201 | Fair enough |
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| 06:50:58 | FromDiscord | <Varriount> Hrm, this is an interesting PR - https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/pull/13813 |
| 06:53:48 | FromDiscord | <Varriount> I'm not entirely comfortable with how we keep adding bits and pieces to the VM's available procedures... But I don't know of a good alternative |
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| 07:11:23 | axion | @Variount you on mumble? |
| 07:12:03 | axion | @Varriount * |
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| 07:23:42 | FromDiscord | <Varriount> Axion: I can get on |
| 07:36:59 | FromGitter | <Vindaar> @voltist: not sure if you're still around, but I just saw your posts and did this: https://gist.github.com/Vindaar/9c32c0676ffddec9078e4c0917861fcd |
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| 08:08:11 | Yardanico | Finally a worthy first April's joke knome.org |
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| 08:21:57 | madprops | something weird happened today. apparently compiling a binary using a specific version of glibc, won't work on systems with an older version of glibc .. which kinda defeats the point of a compiled program |
| 08:28:49 | PMunch | Yardanico, haha that's nice |
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| 08:40:11 | livcd | madprops: Nim program? |
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| 08:43:49 | madprops | yeah |
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| 08:45:28 | livcd | madprops: Could you do this? https://scripter.co/nim-deploying-static-binaries/ |
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| 08:52:29 | madprops | i migh try that, thanks livcd |
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| 08:58:49 | livcd | thanks kaushalmodi :-) |
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| 09:06:53 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> this guy... XD https://github.com/oakes/vim_cubed |
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| 09:08:39 | rmt | embeddable vim for games .. I like it! :) |
| 09:08:54 | rmt | Or boss mode. :) |
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| 09:12:35 | dom96 | Yardanico: new nimforum will be rolled out when I get the time and will to look at a bug that the new categories have |
| 09:12:44 | dom96 | (and fix it of course) |
| 09:18:15 | PMunch | Recruit_main707, maybe that's how I should stream my coding |
| 09:18:36 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> probably ngl |
| 09:18:59 | PMunch | I like the README as well, "How do I stop the cube from spinning?" "No" |
| 09:20:17 | skrylar[m] | so i saw we have an experimental option to make macros that override for loops |
| 09:20:27 | skrylar[m] | and remembered people were asking about tqdm clones |
| 09:21:41 | PMunch | Macros that override for loops? |
| 09:22:05 | PMunch | This paravim stuff is actually pretty neat |
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| 09:26:55 | federico3 | https://lemire.me/blog/2020/03/31/we-released-simdjson-0-3-the-fastest-json-parser-in-the-world-is-even-better/ we need a fast parser like this in Nim |
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| 09:27:46 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> lets just wrap this one :smart: |
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| 09:33:05 | skrylar[m] | @PMunch https://nim-lang.org/docs/manual.html#macros-for-loop-macro looks almost made for tqdm lol |
| 09:37:48 | PMunch | Huh, that is actually pretty cool |
| 09:38:11 | PMunch | Not 100% sure what it offers over just an iterator though.. |
| 09:38:22 | PMunch | Short of allowing some optimisations |
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| 09:44:19 | skrylar[m] | eeh well tqdm is a python package that wraps over an iterator to automatically do a progress bar for it |
| 09:44:35 | dadada | with experimental dotOperators you can't use macros as I noticed while testing https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gdf |
| 09:45:07 | skrylar[m] | basically sugar over having to make the prog bar and update it in a loop, you just `for x in tqdm(whatever you were already looping)` |
| 09:46:00 | dadada | I had an idea in mind that's not possible with this limitation, wanted to build a special wrapper using this method |
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| 09:51:36 | skrylar[m] | altho if tqdm can't figure out what the length is it just makes it an indeterminate progress bar (still counts iterations per minute) |
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| 09:54:25 | PMunch | Sorry for not streaming yesterday by the way.. I procrastinated shovelling snow, and when I finally did it and was done with it it had gotten a bit late.. |
| 09:57:03 | FromDiscord | <Varriount> It's fine. I was busy pretty much all day |
| 09:58:41 | dadada | Araq: would it be possible to add support for macros to work with dotOperators? the thing I've in mind is creating a wrapperobject that uses this to automatically forward all dot operator operations to the wrapped object |
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| 09:59:05 | Araq | I don't know |
| 09:59:36 | dadada | fiar |
| 09:59:39 | dadada | fair |
| 09:59:40 | Araq | explain the issue in an issue |
| 10:00:01 | Araq | or maybe even in an RFC |
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| 10:27:12 | PMunch | Well I mean this works dadada: https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gdp |
| 10:27:55 | PMunch | I think this might be a regression TBH |
| 10:28:01 | PMunch | I could have sworn that this used to work.. |
| 10:28:34 | PMunch | Hmm, maybe not |
| 10:28:38 | PMunch | Tried with an older version |
| 10:30:11 | dadada | PMunch: what do you mean? the example 2gdp seems to work, right? Maybe my example is just buggy? |
| 10:30:46 | PMunch | Yeah, that works, but try to add a `.` proc that takes a Test and any other type |
| 10:31:43 | dadada | yeah, then I get undeclared identifier y/x |
| 10:34:11 | * | cfhklmprstz is now known as qwertfisch |
| 10:34:15 | dadada | so the issue is that proc`.` prevents from macro`.` from being considered somewhere in the resolution process |
| 10:35:37 | PMunch | Yeah |
| 10:35:44 | PMunch | Which I think is a bug |
| 10:36:28 | dadada | me too :-) |
| 10:41:20 | FromGitter | <Vindaar> just doing some pandas comparisons over here |
| 10:41:30 | FromGitter | <Vindaar> (https://files.gitter.im/nim-lang/Nim/rJmQ/bench_create_column_openmp.png) |
| 10:41:57 | FromGitter | <Vindaar> ugh, forgot to give that a white background |
| 10:42:26 | FromDiscord | <Rika> hard to read indeed |
| 10:44:45 | FromGitter | <Vindaar> (https://files.gitter.im/nim-lang/Nim/F4Ng/bench_create_column_openmp.png) |
| 10:45:00 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> when are wikipedia stats updated? |
| 10:45:01 | FromGitter | <gogolxdong> How to append sequence safely from threads? |
| 10:45:36 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> Viddaar: is that logaritmic scale? |
| 10:45:48 | stefantalpalaru | Is there a way to access all the C compiler options passed to {.passc: .} from Nim code? |
| 10:46:00 | FromDiscord | <Rika> please choose more distinct colors 😦 |
| 10:47:32 | FromGitter | <Vindaar> @Recruit_main707: yup. x axis is 10^label in column size. y is obviously logarithmic |
| 10:47:45 | Araq | gogolxdong: you need a 'SharedSeq' |
| 10:48:13 | FromGitter | <Vindaar> if it wasn't clear "pd_" are pandas benchmarks, "df_" my own |
| 10:48:17 | FromGitter | <gogolxdong> What's that , how to make it? |
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| 10:56:41 | Araq | gogolxdong: can you use --gc:arc already? |
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| 10:59:56 | FromDiscord | <HutchyBen> Im looking to learn nim what kind of programs does it specialize at making |
| 11:00:21 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> what would you like to do? |
| 11:00:29 | FromDiscord | <Rika> its pretty general |
| 11:00:29 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> nim can do pretty much anything |
| 11:00:42 | FromDiscord | <HutchyBen> oh nice |
| 11:00:56 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> if C can, Nim can, (with more or less effort) |
| 11:01:14 | FromDiscord | <HutchyBen> and c can do almost anything so cool |
| 11:01:45 | PMunch | And if JS can, Nim can as well |
| 11:01:57 | PMunch | So you should be set to create pretty much anything |
| 11:01:59 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> true |
| 11:02:39 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> would the js backend be deprecated if a wasm one was ever created? |
| 11:03:09 | FromDiscord | <Rika> likely not |
| 11:03:16 | FromDiscord | <Rika> is wasm useful for nodejs |
| 11:03:33 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> idk XD |
| 11:07:37 | FromGitter | <lxdong007> not sure about CMP, I am working on another project. |
| 11:09:20 | PMunch | HutchyBen, where did you hear of Nim since you wanted to try it by the way? |
| 11:09:24 | PMunch | Just out of curiosity :) |
| 11:11:06 | FromGitter | <lxdong007> I was about to ask, I noticed there is a shared heap together with arc, I think it's possible to access global varibale from threads with arc. And yes I am using arc. The project I posted is working with arc. |
| 11:11:54 | PMunch | Yes, using a shared heap and global variables should be possible with ARC |
| 11:18:59 | FromGitter | <lxdong007> Is shared heap state of art usage of arc? Is there any example? |
| 11:19:20 | FromGitter | <alehander92> https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22743267 |
| 11:19:35 | FromGitter | <alehander92> nim on hacker news |
| 11:23:48 | PMunch | Haha, didn't realise that repo has so many funny issues as well |
| 11:24:10 | go|dfish | it was #1 on r/programming for most of yesterday too |
| 11:24:54 | FromDiscord | <Rika> its great though |
| 11:25:18 | PMunch | What, vim3? |
| 11:27:17 | FromDiscord | <HutchyBen> im trying to set ip vim3 |
| 11:27:39 | FromDiscord | <HutchyBen> it cant recognise a dll tho >.< |
| 11:28:12 | FromGitter | <alehander92> rayman22201 |
| 11:28:20 | FromGitter | <alehander92> do you plan on providing async executors |
| 11:28:28 | FromGitter | <alehander92> if you guys make an async with state machines |
| 11:28:57 | livcd | i tried to compile parsetoml with arc :-[ |
| 11:28:59 | livcd | no luck |
| 11:29:17 | FromGitter | <alehander92> like i dont understand them very well, but i think i would love to have custom async engines |
| 11:29:29 | FromGitter | <alehander92> so one can like customize how async is running for its domain/app |
| 11:29:36 | FromGitter | <alehander92> e.g. https://os.phil-opp.com/async-await/#cooperative-multitasking-1 |
| 11:30:05 | FromGitter | <alehander92> (and a custom executor if i am understanding corretly) |
| 11:31:25 | PMunch | HutchyBen, what dll? |
| 11:31:35 | PMunch | livcd, :( what went wrong with it? |
| 11:32:19 | liblq-dev | PMunch, @HutchyBen it's vim³™, not any ordinary vim3 |
| 11:32:39 | PMunch | Vim³, happy? |
| 11:32:44 | FromGitter | <alehander92> https://blog.yoshuawuyts.com/state-machines/ |
| 11:32:56 | FromGitter | <alehander92> araq do you mean this for typestate in rust |
| 11:32:58 | PMunch | Just forgot how to type ³ on this layout |
| 11:33:19 | FromGitter | <alehander92> i imagine you can do it with `requires` |
| 11:33:26 | FromGitter | <alehander92> but no overloading on requires |
| 11:33:47 | FromGitter | <alehander92> i imagined before that one can overload using annotation like that but probably too confusing |
| 11:33:55 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> .b and .a were the equivalent to [0] and [1]? |
| 11:34:00 | FromGitter | <alehander92> and requiring z3 support always |
| 11:35:11 | PMunch | @HutchyBen, in case it didn't highlight you before: What dll is the issue? |
| 11:36:35 | FromGitter | <alehander92> https://github.com/oakes/vim_cubed/issues/22 |
| 11:36:38 | FromGitter | <alehander92> i think this one |
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| 11:39:43 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> this code doesnt compile on 1.1.1 https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gdG |
| 11:39:44 | PMunch | Yeah I realised |
| 11:40:36 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> its an issue with the pair.a and pair.b thing |
| 11:40:42 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> has it been changed? |
| 11:41:09 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> (note that someone gave me this code) |
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| 11:44:14 | PMunch | Run likes a charm on Linux this vim³ thing :( |
| 11:44:16 | PMunch | :)* |
| 11:46:12 | PMunch | I like the description in the .nimble file. Vim for masochists |
| 11:51:14 | livcd | PMunch: something with deep copy :O |
| 11:51:23 | livcd | PMunch: sorry I have not really investigated more as I did not need arc |
| 11:51:39 | jken | That forum post about rewriting in python got me :D |
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| 11:52:36 | PMunch | jken, link? |
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| 11:53:04 | jken | https://forum.nim-lang.org/t/6136 |
| 11:55:10 | PMunch | Oh man |
| 11:55:31 | PMunch | Throwing shade on Python/C hybrid projects as well, nice :P |
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| 12:08:35 | FromDiscord | <djazz> I for one welcome our (C)Python overlords! |
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| 12:14:49 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> this almost got me lol. |
| 12:14:51 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> i was like, wtf have they done! |
| 12:15:06 | PMunch | Haha :P |
| 12:15:22 | narimiran | :) |
| 12:16:21 | Araq | XD |
| 12:16:44 | Araq | and I thought I could have been more subtle |
| 12:17:25 | federico3 | Araq: perhaps by suggesting pypy |
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| 12:24:34 | dom96 | finally an april fool's joke |
| 12:24:39 | * | dadada joined #nim |
| 12:24:40 | dom96 | took us long enough :) |
| 12:24:59 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> have yall searched Bing in Google yet? |
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| 12:26:40 | dom96 | narimiran, your tweet could have been much shorter and much more click baity |
| 12:26:54 | dom96 | "Big announcement: we're rewriting Nim in Python" |
| 12:27:03 | PMunch | What does "./koch boot -d:release" actually do? |
| 12:27:19 | narimiran | dom96: eh, probably, but i find that too click-baity and less-believeable |
| 12:27:43 | PMunch | Recruit_main707, anything supposed to happen? |
| 12:27:46 | narimiran | PMunch: is this a start of some joke? |
| 12:27:51 | PMunch | Haha, nope |
| 12:28:13 | PMunch | Someone on HN asked how fast Nim was at compiling |
| 12:28:18 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> PMuch: internet prank to google |
| 12:28:23 | PMunch | I thought I'd cite him how fast it compiled Nim |
| 12:28:48 | narimiran | PMunch: it bootstraps the compiler, but it takes several iterations to do that |
| 12:28:59 | narimiran | maybe `koch temp` would be better to use as an example? |
| 12:29:27 | dom96 | narimiran, it's just the tweet doesn't even say that Nim will be rewritten in Python |
| 12:29:37 | dom96 | the forum thread even says that |
| 12:30:25 | PMunch | narimiran, yeah that's what I was wondering |
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| 12:34:06 | FromGitter | <alehander92> i honestly often do nim -d:release compiler/nim.nim |
| 12:34:10 | FromGitter | <alehander92> with some other flags |
| 12:38:36 | Araq | IMHO 'koch boot' should now default to -d:release |
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| 12:39:32 | Araq | I use 'koch temp' when I'm after stack traces |
| 12:45:34 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> so koch is used to build your local nim compiler in case you edit it? |
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| 13:11:09 | liblq-dev | am I the only one who strongly prefers `import module for a, b, c` instead of `from module import a, b, c`? |
| 13:11:26 | liblq-dev | I first saw that in Wren and imo it's a shame that Nim doesn't have a syntax like this |
| 13:12:37 | liblq-dev | the thing that pisses me off with `from x import y` is that it doesn't line up with other imports |
| 13:14:00 | FromGitter | <gogolxdong> createShared, resizeShared,freeShared |
| 13:14:04 | FromDiscord | <mratsim> Python does the same |
| 13:16:40 | liblq-dev | I have to fix that in rod :P |
| 13:16:50 | liblq-dev | when I get to imports, of course. |
| 13:17:11 | liblq-dev | right now I'm burnt out after my battle with generics |
| 13:19:18 | Araq | liblq-dev: it's a good point, 'from x import y' is inferior |
| 13:20:08 | liblq-dev | in my eyes it just looks bad next to my other imports |
| 13:20:19 | liblq-dev | that's why I avoid using it |
| 13:20:45 | liblq-dev | I can always reference the module explicitly anyways |
| 13:25:33 | PMunch | liblq-dev, that syntax is actually pretty nice |
| 13:25:40 | liblq-dev | which one? |
| 13:26:04 | PMunch | The `import module for a, b, c` |
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| 13:27:12 | liblq-dev | yeah, and it doesn't waste another keyword, it just reuses `for` |
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| 13:40:25 | FromGitter | <alehander92> Araq |
| 13:40:31 | FromGitter | <alehander92> i am working on the sourcemap PR |
| 13:40:51 | FromGitter | <alehander92> from an old comment of yours, i see i shouldn't use a command for it (i guess its for when compileOp) |
| 13:41:06 | FromGitter | <alehander92> it still doesnt make sense to use one right, just a option flag |
| 13:41:48 | Araq | option flag seems fine or attach it to the existing --debuginfo flag |
| 13:43:21 | FromGitter | <alehander92> can i reserve a separate sourcemap one? seems useful if we add different options or even different kinds of sourcemaps one day |
| 13:45:01 | Araq | please don't, the proliferation of flags and options is killing me |
| 13:46:16 | FromGitter | <alehander92> well then it can be just `--sourcemap:on/off` : if one has a sourcemap for e.g. C<->nim in the future, it can be reused |
| 13:46:23 | FromGitter | <alehander92> ok |
| 13:56:18 | PMunch | Hmm, I wonder if I can take an ASCII art generator and feed it Vim³ so I can run it in my terminal.. |
| 14:02:10 | FromGitter | <alehander92> Araq, one more thing : should it be `sourcemap` `source-map` or `source_map` in options/flag and `Sourcemap` or `SourceMap` in code |
| 14:04:01 | FromGitter | <alehander92> guys what do you think of https://sulami.github.io/posts/common-lisp-restarts/ |
| 14:05:42 | FromDiscord | <Kiloneie> why is sleep() an unknown identifier for me ? |
| 14:06:04 | FromGitter | <alehander92> import os ? |
| 14:06:10 | FromDiscord | <Kiloneie> ooh |
| 14:06:15 | FromDiscord | <Kiloneie> ups |
| 14:06:31 | FromGitter | <alehander92> you're still sleeping :) |
| 14:06:33 | FromDiscord | <Kiloneie> forgot os is not default imported |
| 14:06:42 | FromDiscord | <Kiloneie> i thought it was for some reason |
| 14:06:59 | FromGitter | <alehander92> yeah, you can write your own `common` file |
| 14:07:05 | FromGitter | <alehander92> to import if you usually use the same imports |
| 14:07:13 | FromGitter | <alehander92> which exports such imports |
| 14:07:18 | FromGitter | <alehander92> e.g. `import os ... export os ` |
| 14:07:48 | FromDiscord | <Kiloneie> nice trick okay |
| 14:08:01 | FromGitter | <alehander92> i think local people call it prelude |
| 14:08:07 | FromGitter | <alehander92> e.g. i think karax had it |
| 14:08:21 | FromGitter | <alehander92> but not sure overally |
| 14:08:26 | dom96 | Nim has it |
| 14:08:27 | FromDiscord | <Kiloneie> im just, play 2 games, make a program(which i can then use for my planned playlist of How to X program or something like that...) |
| 14:08:29 | dom96 | include prelude |
| 14:08:50 | FromDiscord | <Kiloneie> i think people would like that idk, probably help with some examples for the docs |
| 14:09:06 | Araq | alehander92: the style says sourceMap |
| 14:09:09 | FromDiscord | <Kiloneie> which are quite empty in some modules |
| 14:09:22 | FromGitter | <alehander92> Araq ok, but my question is because |
| 14:09:32 | FromGitter | <alehander92> all the flags seem to use lowercase |
| 14:09:37 | FromGitter | <alehander92> e.g. nilcheck |
| 14:10:02 | FromGitter | <alehander92> nilseqs etc |
| 14:10:31 | FromGitter | <alehander92> dom96 but import prelude would be better, right |
| 14:11:06 | FromGitter | <alehander92> as one can just export from prelude: i just try to use `import` if i can, but in this case i agree probably it's ok |
| 14:11:54 | dom96 | sure, but IIRC you cannot export modules |
| 14:12:49 | FromGitter | <alehander92> you can |
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| 14:33:48 | FromGitter | <mratsim> @Araq @Andrewrk: were is the joined April’s Fool? https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/pull/13757 |
| 14:33:56 | FromGitter | <mratsim> where* |
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| 15:01:16 | Yardanico | @mratsim something like "We decided to combine Zig and Nim into one programming language which'll be the best"? |
| 15:02:33 | FromGitter | <mratsim> called Zim |
| 15:03:42 | Yardanico | Zim name is already taken :P https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zim_(software) |
| 15:03:57 | FromGitter | <mratsim> doesn’t matter, Nig is a bit awkward |
| 15:04:02 | Yardanico | oof |
| 15:04:04 | FromGitter | <mratsim> and it’s only for a day |
| 15:04:13 | narimiran | Yardanico: i use Zim, btw |
| 15:04:31 | FromGitter | <deech> https://animesuperhero.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/invader_zim_render_by_neonstartapeinvasion-d9m3yz6.png |
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| 15:05:59 | FromGitter | <alehander92> dont like 1 april jokes, but i'd like some zig features |
| 15:06:00 | FromGitter | <alehander92> :D |
| 15:06:08 | Yardanico | me too *hides* |
| 15:07:20 | dom96 | Zimrod :D |
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| 15:12:59 | FromGitter | <alehander92> yardanico dont hide |
| 15:13:13 | FromGitter | <alehander92> the borders are closed anyway, Araq can't fight us :D |
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| 15:17:23 | FromGitter | <mratsim> Zigrod :p |
| 15:17:55 | FromGitter | <alehander92> guys |
| 15:18:01 | FromGitter | <alehander92> do we have nim syntax support in chrome |
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| 15:18:44 | FromGitter | <alehander92> sorry i got confused , we dont :D |
| 15:19:41 | Yardanico | wdym in chrome? like an extension? |
| 15:22:22 | FromGitter | <alehander92> in developer console |
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| 15:37:23 | FromGitter | <rishavs> How can I add new items to a set? ⏎ ⏎ ``` var walledDoors: set[Directions] ⏎ walledDoors.add(West)``` [https://gitter.im/nim-lang/Nim?at=5e84b533a61b811a4f7528ed] |
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| 15:38:14 | FromGitter | <Yardanico> maybe you want HashSet, not the built-in "set" type? |
| 15:38:34 | FromGitter | <Yardanico> check out https://nim-lang.org/docs/sets.html |
| 15:42:20 | FromGitter | <rishavs> the way the document is written is pretty confusing but I want the mathematical sets, where I only have unique values |
| 15:42:47 | narimiran | use `incl`, not `add` |
| 15:42:52 | narimiran | a.k.a. read the docs |
| 15:43:49 | FromGitter | <rishavs> aye. found it. :D |
| 15:44:12 | FromGitter | <rishavs> Thanks |
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| 16:11:08 | rayman22201 | alehander92: just waking up. You pinged me? |
| 16:12:24 | rayman22201 | We have custom async executors already. We call it "the event loop". See httpbeast for an example of a custom one. |
| 16:14:47 | FromGitter | <zetashift> Is there a scenario where you would use sets and not HashSets? |
| 16:15:04 | FromGitter | <zetashift> ah nvm it's right under there, sets are used for bit flags |
| 16:15:40 | leorize | that's the C FFI use case |
| 16:15:54 | leorize | though it's used for writing flags in Nim too :P |
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| 16:28:15 | FromGitter | <zetashift> leorize do you even sleep |
| 16:28:35 | leorize | maybe :) |
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| 16:33:04 | inv2004 | Hello, are there any way to write in script-style, but with async? |
| 16:33:21 | leorize | script-style? |
| 16:33:38 | inv2004 | I mean that I do not want to define main() {.async.}, but still want to use async. |
| 16:34:02 | leorize | I don't think you should/can |
| 16:34:10 | leorize | do you have an example usecase in mind? |
| 16:35:48 | inv2004 | @leorize, it is quite simple - if you use nim like bash - you do not want to define functions without reasons |
| 16:36:18 | FromGitter | <kayabaNerve> JS has has this debate for a long time. The problem with doing it at the top-level, in Nim, is you'd need to transform the file itself. |
| 16:36:39 | FromGitter | <kayabaNerve> File-wide macros aren't a thing unless you put the entire file in a block. Araq hates the idea, although I personally like it. |
| 16:37:02 | FromGitter | <kayabaNerve> And as the Nim filter system goes line by line, you can't replace line endings with `\r\n ` and compensate. |
| 16:37:46 | inv2004 | @leorize, probably you can write just two lines: let resp = await client.request; let data = await resp.body(); echo data.parseJson().pretty. but defining waitFor main() would add two more lines :) |
| 16:38:05 | FromGitter | <kayabaNerve> If you're going to put the entire file in a block just so you don't have to define `proc main() {.async.}; waitFor main()`... why |
| 16:38:40 | FromGitter | <kayabaNerve> But I mean, hey, if you want to write a macro `asyncMain:` to expand to those two statements, go ahead. |
| 16:39:16 | leorize | inv2004: or you can write it like this: let resp = waitFor client.request; let data = waitFor resp.body() :p |
| 16:39:22 | dom96 | yeah, you can't |
| 16:39:31 | dom96 | but if you're writing scripts, why even use async? |
| 16:39:55 | inv2004 | @dom96, good question - I did not think about it, because I can :) |
| 16:41:23 | dom96 | lol |
| 16:41:24 | inv2004 | @leorize, nice idea, thank you! |
| 16:41:39 | dom96 | well if the amount of typing bothers you, just don't use it |
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| 16:52:30 | leorize | \o/ macros in typedef is now a thing |
| 16:56:30 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> *sigh* I just spent the last hour slamming my head on an issue that turned out to be StringStream taking `0XCE` and treating it as 32b instead of 8b |
| 16:57:21 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> I'm sure that makese sense at some point, but I haven't slept and omg did that throw me for a loop |
| 16:58:17 | leorize | yea you should sleep :) |
| 16:58:18 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> Esp since the `0xCE` was the termination byte for a network frame, and so the server would then try to read the next 7 bytes and pitch a fit about how everything was zero |
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| 16:58:47 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> I sat there staring at Wireshark thinking I'd lost it |
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| 16:59:02 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> I would sleep if I could, bad insomnia for the last 3 days 😦 |
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| 17:00:17 | leorize | not looking at the screen is a good way to change that :) |
| 17:02:14 | FromGitter | <geotre> Are there any libraries for async/await on js backend (apart from asyncjs) ? |
| 17:03:55 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> leorize: I went to bed at 2am as usual and laid there until 5am, no lights, no screens |
| 17:04:04 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> just brain that won't sleep |
| 17:05:19 | leorize | that doesn't sound good :( |
| 17:05:44 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> Story of my life, haha |
| 17:05:57 | leorize | well go see a doctor I suppose :) |
| 17:06:09 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> I have, multiple times |
| 17:06:18 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> Oh and sleep aids generally don't work on me |
| 17:06:47 | FromDiscord | <Benumbed> My doctor calls me 'an interesting anomaly' |
| 17:08:42 | FromGitter | <kayabaNerve> Is there a way I can force a ref to be freed? |
| 17:09:02 | leorize | kayabaNerve: yes, but no |
| 17:09:22 | FromGitter | <kayabaNerve> I didn't think so outside of reference count manip |
| 17:09:56 | leorize | well the idea of the GC is that you don't do this kind of "forcing free" |
| 17:10:25 | leorize | but if it's the last reference (ie. not referenced elsewhere by anything) |
| 17:10:33 | leorize | set the ref to nil, then run GC_fullCollect() |
| 17:10:46 | leorize | (please never do that in real programs) |
| 17:11:43 | leorize | the memory held by the ref might be freed |
| 17:12:24 | leorize | though any finalizer will still be called if it's not freed |
| 17:13:41 | leorize | might be freed because the GC can and does keep a pool of small memory segments |
| 17:14:09 | leorize | it will accumulate the "freed" memory for a big free() |
| 17:14:16 | leorize | and can also reuse them irrc |
| 17:14:18 | leorize | iirc* |
| 17:15:54 | FromGitter | <kayabaNerve> leorize: I'm creating duplicates of 512 MB objects somehow, despite using refs, and need to clear them in my tests |
| 17:16:34 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> how can i pass a function to a template/macro, and get the name of that function? |
| 17:17:10 | leorize | Recruit_main707: wdym by passing a function? like this? `macro(foo)` |
| 17:17:23 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> yes |
| 17:17:30 | leorize | then the node will depend on the type of the param |
| 17:17:56 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> the param is the function? |
| 17:18:05 | leorize | if it's a typed, then it'll resolve into an nnkSymbol. You can use it directly for any expression since it'd be solved |
| 17:18:14 | leorize | getting the name is as simple as .strVal :) |
| 17:18:26 | leorize | if it's an indent, well kinda same story :P |
| 17:19:04 | leorize | kayabaNerve: refc is not really deterministic |
| 17:19:14 | leorize | you'd really want arc for that |
| 17:21:41 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> leorize i didnt understand a shit, sorry, let me show you my code so that i can understand: https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gg4 |
| 17:21:41 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> its a very specific problem, it will be shorter if you dont ask why i do it ;) |
| 17:24:06 | leorize | https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gg7 |
| 17:24:18 | leorize | the magic of emit :) |
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| 17:26:02 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> lmao, i didnt know about those XD |
| 17:26:05 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> thanks |
| 17:26:26 | leorize | https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2gg9 |
| 17:26:27 | FromDiscord | <Varriount> Hm. Araq, how do other languages handle the aliasing situations that the Nim spec currently says are not allowed? |
| 17:26:37 | leorize | and here's the macro version if you'd like to know how to get the name |
| 17:27:28 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> lovely, thank you very much, i am finally seeing the potential of metaprogramming. |
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| 17:36:37 | FromGitter | <kayabaNerve> I think I found the problem. I'm defining the types as: ⏎ ⏎ ```X {.importc: "x", header: "x.h", incompleteStruct.} = object ⏎ Y* = ptr X``` ⏎ ⏎ When Nim clears the wrapper ref object, the pointer isn't properly deallocated. [https://gitter.im/nim-lang/Nim?at=5e84d12461967448380eedf4] |
| 17:37:11 | FromGitter | <kayabaNerve> That's my theory at least, given that I'm setting the wrapper ref to nil and calling GC_fullCollect() to no effect. |
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| 17:41:04 | leorize | do you have a finalizer to deallocate the pointer? |
| 17:41:08 | FromGitter | <kayabaNerve> Though I'm not entirely sure how to check that. I guess register a destructor for the ref? |
| 17:41:20 | FromGitter | <kayabaNerve> ... nope. Nim won't do it automatically either. |
| 17:41:22 | FromGitter | <kayabaNerve> That's my fault. |
| 17:41:25 | FromGitter | <kayabaNerve> Thanks. |
| 17:41:56 | leorize | you can write a destructor and it'll be transformed into a finalizer automagically |
| 17:42:41 | FromGitter | <kayabaNerve> Yep |
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| 17:49:44 | shashlick | Araq: curious why proc pragmas are at a different place in the AST compared to types |
| 17:50:12 | * | solitudesf quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 17:50:44 | leorize | finally I can make my `ctype` macro and it wouldn't look weird :) |
| 17:51:41 | zacharycarter | does anyone use kakoune with Nim? |
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| 18:03:34 | solitudesf- | yes |
| 18:04:10 | zacharycarter | Nice! Do you use the kak plugin system? |
| 18:04:27 | zacharycarter | plug.kak or whatever? |
| 18:04:33 | solitudesf- | nope |
| 18:05:03 | zacharycarter | ah okay - I have the LSP plugin and just added Nim to the list of languages to set options for, but I have a feeling I'm going to need to do more configuration to get it to work |
| 18:05:36 | solitudesf- | you dont need plug.kak for that |
| 18:06:40 | solitudesf- | only thing needed is to do launch kak-lsp and run lsp-enable |
| 18:06:58 | zacharycarter | okay I'm doing that - so hopefully it's just working already and I'm unaware :) |
| 18:07:55 | rayman22201 | Hey zacharycarter. Been a while since we've seen you on irc. Hope all is well! |
| 18:08:14 | solitudesf- | there is lsp-capabilities command to check if its working |
| 18:11:21 | zacharycarter | I'll try that, thanks |
| 18:11:37 | zacharycarter | Hey rayman22201: Thanks! All is good, just getting settled into my new digs in Austin |
| 18:11:55 | rayman22201 | nice! great timing lol |
| 18:12:10 | zacharycarter | Haha yeah! Just in time to really really settle into them |
| 18:12:36 | zacharycarter | hope you are doing well too! |
| 18:12:57 | FromGitter | <zetashift> great to see you again zachary :D |
| 18:13:25 | zacharycarter | Hi zetashift! Likewise! |
| 18:20:41 | FromGitter | <alehander92> zacharycarter how are youu |
| 18:20:57 | FromGitter | <alehander92> rayman22201 so hm |
| 18:22:04 | FromGitter | <alehander92> i need to write a custom async module? i think sometimes tweaking how async macro works is also needed, but maybe thats too much |
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| 18:33:17 | rayman22201 | alehander92 sorry. I need more context. what are you trying to do? |
| 18:33:31 | rayman22201 | I only half read your ping when I woke up lol |
| 18:35:40 | * | rayman22201 sometimes feels like I'm the only one who sleeps around here lol |
| 18:36:23 | FromGitter | <alehander92> well i just read about https://os.phil-opp.com/async-await/#cooperative-multitasking-1 implementation a bit :D |
| 18:36:59 | FromGitter | <alehander92> but honestly just the idea to write custom ways that futures are executed with seems useful, but you're right this might be already possible here |
| 18:37:09 | FromGitter | <alehander92> ah here it is evening |
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