<< 02-06-2015 >>
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00:08:29jaco60if you're interested for a nim plugin for the IntelliJ IDEA, please vote: https://plugins.jetbrains.com/wishlist/show?pr=&wid=503
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00:38:20pragamicHi
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00:39:51pragamicAre buffer overflows usual in Nim ?
00:41:44Varriountpragamic: Only if you have bounds checking turned off.
00:42:15VarriountWell, I should say, they're much more possible with bounds checking turned off.
00:42:47VarriountIterators and such tend to mitigate overflows.
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07:07:03dtscodeGenerally speaking, which generates better code? The C backend or the c++ backend?
07:10:23strcmp1donno. my uneducated guess would be the C backend.
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07:10:38dtscodehmmm
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07:13:56cazovI'd guess they're about the same, minus any weirdness like using iostreams or stuff like that. I can't imagine the C++ backend generates code that is very much different from the C backend, minus any necessary differences to make things `C++-nice`
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07:29:50Varriountdtscode: The C backend is the most tested of the two (due to being the default). As cazov says, they're probably about the same, however the C++ backend might have more bugs.
07:30:07dtscodeDamn :/
07:31:01Varriountdtscode: On the other hand, if you use the C++ backend, you can help find the bugs. :D
07:32:34dtscodeVarriount: Of course I will do that :D. I love pestering and annoying dom96/araq with bug reports, but I was hoping the c++ codegen wasn't as tight as the C codegen, and then I was hoping I could write code by hand that could out perform the c++ generated stuff.
07:32:51dtscodeBut, thats a pipe dream if araq got it as good as the C codegen
07:33:23Varriountdtscode: There's only one way to know for sure...
07:33:42dtscodeEh. I know I can't. I'll stick to what I do best
07:34:07VarriountI'd say a good start would be to benchmark the Nim compiler compiled with the C backend vs the Nim compiler compiled with the C++ backend
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07:50:06sepisoadhow can we share a ref object like AsyncSocket among threads, I tried every possible way, like channels and allocshared but I cannot get them work for me
07:51:00sepisoadi need to close an socket which is being used by another thread to recv data from clients
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07:59:11Varriountsepisoad: Have you passed the AsyncSocket as a pointer, instead of a ref?
07:59:40VarriountReferences passed between channels are deepcopied
07:59:57sepisoadi tried creating a AsyncSocket pointer using createShared() proc
08:00:08VarriountAnd?
08:00:25sepisoadbut the compiler still complains that the object is GC safe and cannot be shared
08:01:06sepisoadthen I decided to send the AsyncSocket object through a channel
08:01:24sepisoadbut again compiler refuses to accept the code
08:01:35VarriountHm.
08:01:37sepisoadnow my code is going to be mess
08:01:53Varriountsepisoad: Araq might be able to help.
08:01:59sepisoadmaybe i can show you the code
08:02:16Varriountsepisoad: That would be good. I can't promise that I can be of too much help.
08:02:28VarriountI don't do much multithreaded programming.
08:02:46sepisoadok, i'm cleaning up my code, maybe that helps
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08:13:53sepisoadVarriount, Araq : this is my code:
08:13:54sepisoadhttps://gist.github.com/4c3009dbee8e2dc27ee8.git
08:14:16sepisoad Error: 'server' is not GC-safe as it accesses 'sockServer' which is a global using GC'ed memory
08:15:55Varriountsepisoad: Uh, is that a link to a file, or a git repository?
08:16:05VarriountI'd rather not download anything.
08:16:12sepisoadit's a gist
08:16:23sepisoadnot it's now a download link
08:16:34VarriountYes, however all I get is a blank page.
08:16:54sepisoadwait in min...
08:16:59VarriountAlso, it's got '.git' on the end, which is usually meant for downloading via git
08:17:21sepisoadwhat about this link:
08:17:22sepisoadhttps://gist.github.com/sepisoad/4c3009dbee8e2dc27ee8
08:17:31VarriountYes, that works.
08:17:35sepisoadsorry Varriount
08:17:41sepisoadmy bad
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08:19:15Varriountsepisoad: Try 'ptr AsynSocketObj'
08:19:28Varriounthttp://nim-lang.org/docs/asyncio.html#AsyncSocket
08:19:46Varriountptr AsyncSocket is a pointer to a reference - maybe that's the problem?
08:20:08sepisoadbut that object is not accessible it's local to the file where it's being defined
08:20:14VarriountHrm.
08:20:59sepisoadI know what you are trying to say
08:21:06VarriountUm, AsyncSocketObj isn't private.
08:21:14Varriounthttps://github.com/Araq/Nim/blob/master/lib/pure/asyncio.nim#L128
08:21:49sepisoadError: undeclared identifier: 'AsyncSocketObj'
08:22:19sepisoadooops
08:22:21sepisoadsorry
08:22:53sepisoadi'm using AsyncSocket from asyncnet module
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08:23:11sepisoadit is a ref object of AsyncSocketDesc
08:23:25sepisoadAsyncSocketDesc itself is not accessible
08:25:44sepisoadwhat you mentioned is AsyncSocketObj from asyncio module, however this module is deprecated
08:26:22VarriountAh, I see.
08:26:47Varriountsepisoad: I think I'll need to defer to Araq and dom96 on this...
08:27:30sepisoadi wish there was a section in nim website that could comprehensively cover nim thread model and all the sharing stuff
08:27:47Varriountsepisoad: You and me both.
08:28:18sepisoadVarriount, ;)
08:32:41sepisoadBTW, if Araq, dom96 other anyone else can comment under the gist page I would appreciate, because sometimes i lose track of irc channel
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08:39:05Varriountsepisoad: I got it to compile...
08:39:18sepisoadVarriount, how?
08:39:19VarriountBut only by making AsyncSocketDesc public.
08:39:30VarriountAnd I don't know if it will run.
08:39:51sepisoadVarriount, you changed the module?
08:39:58VarriountYeah
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08:40:29sepisoadhaha, but that's a hack, kinda
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08:41:08VarriountAnd... it doesn't run. :<
08:41:17VarriountError: unhandled exception: An operation was attempted on something that is not a socket.
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08:41:28sepisoadcool ;)
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08:41:47Varriountsepisoad: I like Nim, I really do... but threading is one of its big weaknesses.
08:42:34sepisoadVarriount, so do i, i wish there was a simple way of sharing ref variables in nim
08:42:46VarriountFor one thing, people simply aren't used to thinking of multi-threaded design within the constraints imposed by Nim
08:43:08VarriountAnother thing is something like this - It's not straighforward when you want to do something unsafe.
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08:43:27VarriountAnyway, I need to get to bed. Good luck.
08:44:05sepisoadsweet dreams pal
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09:58:30dom96Really good answer by Jehan https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9643870
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10:03:54sepisoadhi dom96, can you please go up and take a look at my question?
10:03:58dom96sepisoad: just replied
10:04:05dom96(on the gist)
10:04:40sepisoadyes
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10:06:13sepisoaddom96, thanks
10:06:28sepisoadthough i did not fully got what is your idea
10:06:36dom96why do you need threads though?
10:07:36sepisoadi'm trying to use threads along with my gui app which is written using iup lib
10:08:10sepisoadsince threads might block ui, i prefer spawning a new thread that handles socket operations
10:08:21dom96the socket operations are already async though
10:08:42sepisoadi know, but what if i want to waitFor a future value?
10:09:04dom96then you use 'await'
10:09:05sepisoadi managed to use asyncSocket with iup without blocking the ui
10:09:42dom96right, so what's the problem?
10:09:44sepisoadi mean through a seperate thread
10:09:49dom96oh
10:10:08dom96IUP has an event loop which you should hook into
10:11:05dom96You can call:
10:11:08dom96IupLoopStep()
10:11:15dom96asyncdispatch.poll()
10:11:22dom96in a while true loop
10:11:28dom96in the same thread
10:12:14sepisoadOk, that's file, Anyways, how can i share a ref object among threads?
10:13:15dom96you might be able to send it through a Channel
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10:28:20Varriountsepisoad: Ping
10:28:58sepisoadVarriount, still up?
10:29:07Varriountsepisoad: Couldn't get to sleep.
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10:29:22Varriountsepisoad: Just an FYI, dom96 commented on your gist page.
10:29:40sepisoadI saw the answer
10:29:57Varriountsepisoad: So, a.. workaround to your problem is to turn thread analysis off, via --threadAnalysis:off
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10:30:28sepisoadhmmm!
10:30:36sepisoadlet me check
10:31:54Varriountsepisoad: It works, or rather, it compiles, and runs with no output.
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10:39:25dom96turning off thread analysis is likely not a good idea
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11:12:04Varriountdom96: Well, I did say it was a workaround, not a fix.
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11:13:29Varriountdom96: Although I know that sepisoad's program could be implemented differently, he nevertheless *should* be allowed to implement it in the current fashion.
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11:15:33dom96Varriount: no, because thread's utilise a GC per thread. He cannot share data that way.
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11:19:40matkukiWhat type should be used on the Nim side for a C 'wchar_t' type?
11:21:36def-matkuki: WideCString looks good
11:21:48matkukidef-: Thanks!
11:22:08def-matkuki: and TUtf16Char
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11:52:39Strikecarlis there like a rand() ?
11:53:48def-Strikecarl: import math; randomize() echo random(100)
11:53:56def-randomize(); echo random(100)
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11:55:10def-Strikecarl: if you need less-flawed pseudo-random numbers: https://github.com/BlaXpirit/nim-random
11:55:27Strikecarlmeh i just need something that will spit out a number
11:55:30Strikecarlcan i do like
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11:55:40Strikecarlwhat is the int in the random()?
11:55:51def-http://nim-lang.org/docs/math.html#random,int
11:56:02Strikecarlaight ty
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12:30:14matkukidef-: Is there a way to cast a string to WideCString?
12:30:42matkukiSorry, I meant 'convert' not 'cast'!
12:32:10BlaXpiritmatkuki, that's really tough
12:32:20BlaXpiritbecause WideCString is not even a well-defined thing
12:32:41BlaXpiritcould be utf-16, could be anything
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12:40:21matkukiOk, I need a way to pass arguments passed from a Nim app to an embedded python interpreters 'int Py_Main(int argc, wchar_t **argv)' function.
12:40:23matkukiIf I call it as 'Py_Main*(argc: int, argv: seq[string])', it throws a 'SIGSEGV: Illegal storage access. (Attempt to read from nil?)' error if arguments are passed to the Nim application!
12:40:24matkukiWithout arguments it works though. Any ideas?
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12:44:22matkukiThe code: https://bpaste.net/show/9bc51b880dbf
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12:48:39matkukiDoes the string sequence get GC'ed?
12:54:15dom96the definition of Py_main doesn't look right to me.
12:55:35fowlPass it cmdline and cmdcount
12:56:20fowlYou can't just make wchart** be seq.. Completely different memory layout
12:57:36matkukiThanks, but what's the Nim declaration for 'int Py_Main(int argc, wchar_t **argv)' then?
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12:58:19pigmejmatkuki: do you integrate python with nim?
12:58:24matkukiyes
12:58:30matkukipython 3
12:58:35pigmejouch
12:59:58matkukidom96, fowl: Any hints for the Nim 'int Py_Main(int argc, wchar_t **argv)' declaration?
13:00:37dom96if anything you should be passing addr sequence[0] there
13:00:48fowlI'll look when I'm back home, probably (argc:cint, argv:cstringarray): cint
13:00:57dom96but I have no idea if string is compatible with wchar_t
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13:02:57matkukiWill try it when I get back.
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14:23:32Araqmatkuki: no idea why Python uses wchar_t**. wchar_t* is a WideCString which you can create with newWideCString
14:25:42matkukiAraq: Will try it, thanks.
14:27:48matkukiAraq: I'm making bindings for Python 3 using your library (nim-lang/python) as a starting point.
14:27:49matkukiCan I turn to you if I need help or is someone else responsible for that library?
14:28:16Araqjust ask me, I know everything
14:28:43matkukiHa, good one.
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14:29:30dom96He really does.
14:29:35dom96Araq is all knowing.
14:32:08Araqso yeah, a seq[WideCString] does the job when you pass it via addr s[0]
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14:37:18matkukiAraq: Ha, it works. There is no more 'SIGSEGV' error. Maybe you are all knowing...
14:39:35matkukiAraq: Should the library be split into python2 and python3 or should it be in one python.nim module?
14:40:30Arrrr"import python2, python3"
14:40:36AraqI think py3 is close enough API wise that we can lave it as python.nim
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14:40:43Araq*leave it as
14:41:02dom96I think it should be separate
14:41:14dom96It's not the same API, is it?
14:41:21Araqit is.
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14:41:42Araqalso what Arrrr said. "import python2, python3" will not work easily
14:42:22fowlI don't think the python module even works
14:42:38matkukifowl: For the examples, it does.
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14:42:55matkukiAt least on Windows.
14:42:55fowlThe data types use inheritance
14:43:08drewsremI'm trying to write a macro that generates a getter for a field of a type, I'm imagining that I pass to this macro the expr e.g. "macroCall myobjecttype.id" and the macro can "recognize" id being a field and then splits them, ending up with e.g. a variable that holds "myobjecttype" and one that holds "id" at the end. - Any pointers?
14:43:44matkukiAraq: Ok, one module it is.
14:44:25fowldrewsrem: myobjecttype- is it a type or an instance
14:44:32drewsremfowl, type
14:44:50fowlYou cannot have a variable of it
14:45:29drewsremI guess I just need the ident? - I want the macro to end up producing a proc thats just a getter for the field I passed.
14:47:12drewsremFor this example: http://nim-lang.org/docs/tut2.html#object-oriented-programming-properties the macro would be called like: "mkGetter Socker.Fhost"
14:47:21drewsremSocket*
14:47:29drewsremIs this possible at all?
14:47:49fowlYea drewsrem with a template even (easier than macros)
14:48:17drewsremfowl, what parameter types would I use? - Just an expr?
14:48:31fowlTemplate defAccessor (ty, field, name: untyped): stmt =
14:49:00fowl Proc name* (self: ty): auto = self.field
14:49:14drewsremoh, very nice
14:49:29fowlThen another one for `name=`
14:50:32drewsremWould the above be possible with macros tho? - i.e. that you don't have to separately pass the type and field name, but rather just pass "type.field" and the macro recognizes them?
14:50:54fowlYou could yea
14:51:09drewsremI see, thanks
14:52:00fowluntyped{nkDot} can be used to make sure you get a dot expr
14:52:06fowlMight be nkDotExpr
14:52:48drewsremThere's nothing about the untyped-keyword in the manual yet?
14:53:07fowlAraq: instead of butchering that section of code in typeRel I added an if stmt
14:53:08drewsremI'll look for examples in the source tho
14:53:24Araqfowl: yeah the PR is fine
14:53:37fowldrewsrem: in the manual its probably called expr
14:53:39Araqbut it requires some tests designed to break it
14:53:54drewsremfowl, oh they're interchangeable I see
14:54:27fowlAraq: break it how
14:55:48fowlShow a conflict where a function could match with string and openarray[t] ?
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15:08:23dom96To everyone who is still not aware of this. Araq's screencast starts in 2 hours: http://www.oreilly.com/pub/e/3420
15:08:39dom96Register if you want to participate.
15:09:02Araqfowl: yeah, something like that
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15:22:14ozradom96: Ah, thanks for telling, cool.
15:22:51*johnsoft joined #nim
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15:28:14fowldom96, what participation is there?
15:29:11dom96fowl: What do you mean? You can ask Araq questions through their chat.
15:29:17*ddl_smurf quit (Client Quit)
15:29:26fowloh ok
15:32:27fowldom96, can i watch it from this link
15:33:02dom96fowl: you need to register for it I think
15:35:33*amishPa left #nim (#nim)
15:36:15BlaXpirit_nice registration
15:36:28BlaXpirit_had to enter name 2 times, email 3 times
15:36:56fowlright
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15:37:14dom96BlaXpirit_: yeah, it's very weird
15:38:09BlaXpirit_is it like... only for business-people?
15:41:17fowlwill the event page refresh with the video when it is time?
15:41:53BlaXpirit_what "company" should i enter D:
15:42:08fowlyou can put fowlsoft ;)
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15:42:22fowlyou can be my intern
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15:44:40dom96yeah, it asks odd questions
15:44:44dom96I wrote "None?"
15:44:45dom96:P
15:45:35*gyeates joined #nim
15:45:45ArrrrIt is asking me "Are you using underwear?" wtf
15:49:02*BlaXpirit_ quit (Quit: Quit Konversation)
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15:50:31*BlaXpirit is CEO of "-" inc.
15:52:04dom96I'm CFO.
15:52:26dom96gimme your moneys
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15:53:58*dtscode gives dom96 all the things
15:54:08*dom96 swims in all the things
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15:56:23ozraBlaXpirit: haha, yeah, worst registration procedure ever!
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16:25:26OnOwebcast today? will it be live?
16:27:28BlaXpiriti think so
16:27:34BlaXpirit30 min
16:28:13dtscode:D
16:31:16dom96OnO: yep. Register here: http://www.oreilly.com/pub/e/3420
16:32:02dom96How many of you guys are watching it?
16:32:23BlaXpirit5
16:32:49fowl0 - hasnt started yet
16:32:54fowlzing
16:33:07dom96* are going to be watching it
16:33:45dtscodeI am registering right now for it
16:33:58dtscodeI almost said I live in the United Stated
16:34:30OnOyeah, already did last week... hope to see Araq soon :)
16:36:01dtscode>June 2, 2015: 10am - L.A. | 1pm - NY | 6pm - London
16:36:01dtscode>O'Reilly Software Engineering Online Conference
16:36:05dtscodeIts this one right?
16:37:37dom96I think so
16:38:35dtscodeOh wait. I guess it is cause it says Araq is speaking underneath that
16:38:56dom96You can't go wrong if you follow the link I gave.
16:39:06dtscodeI did. I'm all set now
16:39:17dtscodeOr do you mean in life in general?
16:39:49dom96yep
16:39:59dtscodeoh good
16:45:53dom96oooh, we can launch it now
16:46:18dtscode:D I'm already in
16:47:17dom96Nice music.
16:47:27rgv151yeah, i love it :)
16:48:47dtscodeis oscon for open source stuff?
16:49:22dom96yep. Open Source Conference
16:49:48dtscodeMaybe I've been IRC'ing for too long, but the spaces in between each group chat message bugs the hell out of me
16:50:04dom96yeah...
16:50:12dom96It's not the best chat in the world.
16:50:12fowlthis looks like amberjs
16:50:22dtscodeD: Its in Oregon? Yeah there's no way I'm going
16:50:33BlaXpiritwhat chat
16:50:44dtscodeBlaXpirit: There are some apps at the bottom
16:50:44OnOnice tune, bit progressive
16:51:02BlaXpiritis this year 2002
16:51:26dom96dtscode: try getting there when you live in Europe :(
16:51:36dom96also the tickets to OSCON cost waaayyy too much
16:51:41ozraHmm. I don't get this O'Reilly page.. it shows me that "register now", though I've goe through the process of typing my credentials fiftyeleven times... Will it redirect to the screencast, eh, anyone knows?
16:51:58dom96ozra: You should get an email IIRC
16:52:01dtscodeozra: Did you see the email?
16:52:18dtscodedom96: I know the feels. c++con is super expensive
16:52:22ozraYeah. All clicked and dandy an hour ago...
16:52:27*matkuki quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.91.1 [Firefox 38.0.1/20150513174244])
16:52:36dom96dtscode: Can't wait to host NimCon and charge people thousands of dollars for tickets :P
16:52:49dtscodeexactly
16:52:56dtscodeAnd we can just have like 2 booths
16:53:08dom96It'll just be me ranting about my life.
16:53:12dom96for 2 days
16:53:21dom96ozra: you mean it worked an hour ago?
16:53:34dtscodeoh god. I can see the stories about tea now
16:53:43fowlozra, use the link in your email
16:53:57ozraah. no, I regged an hours ago :-/
16:54:03ozraI'll check again, thanks
16:55:03dom96hrm, Araq's slides look a bit low-quality.
16:56:18OnOyeah... NimCon 2020, 10k tickets sold within 10 minutes :)
16:56:31ozraNo go. I'll re register :-/
16:56:49OnOOS X 11, now written in Nim, replacing Swift and ObjC :>
16:57:07*johnsoft quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
16:57:19dtscodeLinux2: Now written in nim, so it works
16:57:29*filwit joined #nim
16:58:06dtscodefowl: is your name really fowlington?
16:58:07dom96filwit: http://www.oreilly.com/pub/e/3420
16:58:09Arrrr2020: nim v3 now with interfaces
16:58:27filwitdom96: if that's the presentation link i'm already there bro :)
16:58:37reactormonkArrrr, we already have concepts ^^
16:58:47dom96filwit: cool
16:58:48ozra*finally* :)
16:58:48dtscodeOh... btw. We should never release nim 1.0. Just keep getting closer and closer to 1 without actually hitting it
16:58:49fowldtscode, nah
16:59:00dtscodeD:
16:59:06dtscodeYou lied on the internet?
16:59:11fowlrealname is Fakename Isfake
16:59:33dtscodesouds legit
16:59:44reactormonkdom96, gotta get him to let you review the slides beforehand ;-)
17:00:06dom96reactormonk: O'Reilly messed it up I think.
17:00:22dom96reactormonk: His slides looked fine to me. The PDF they generated seems to have resized them weirdly.
17:00:26ozrasuuuch funky music, I'm blown away!
17:00:30reactormonkdom96, fuck
17:00:36OnOyeah, let's do asymptotic versioning
17:00:38reactormonkdom96, got a stream url?
17:00:48OnO0.9, 0.9.9, 0.9.9.9....
17:00:54dom96reactormonk: you need to register http://www.oreilly.com/pub/e/3420
17:00:54dtscodeexactly
17:00:59dtscode0.9999999
17:01:02reactormonkdom96, :-/
17:01:02OnOsome Smurfette is talking
17:01:18dom96reactormonk: it doesn't take long if you hurry!
17:01:19drewsremPretty awful web GUI
17:01:21dom96they're starting now
17:01:22fowlis there video
17:01:28dom96fowl: nope
17:01:40dom96So many people from the US
17:01:47*yglukhov___ joined #nim
17:01:48dtscodewe are master race
17:01:50rgv151so there is not video?
17:01:54rgv151no*
17:01:59dtscodecorrect
17:02:05dom96just slides
17:02:09Arrrrwill someone upload it to youtube? Seems like i cant use yopmail for registration
17:02:12dom96in the "Slide area"
17:02:23drewsremAudio quality is pretty bad?
17:02:26rgv151i c
17:02:33filwitaudio quality is good for me
17:02:38dtscodeArrrr: Its recorded, so it will probably already be there
17:02:39*gsingh93 quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
17:02:41reactormonkdom96, ah fuck registration email...
17:02:42filwitno video yet for me though
17:02:55*johnsoft joined #nim
17:02:57dtscodeno video filwit
17:03:10dom96dat hesitation
17:03:13reactormonkdom96, Error #2046 -.-
17:03:24filwityeah i figured it just hasn't started yet.. but wasn't quite sure
17:03:32filwitoh no i understand
17:03:34filwitit's a radio show
17:03:55filwitslideshow
17:03:56filwitsomething
17:04:01drewsremawkward
17:04:04filwitlol
17:04:08*toadytoadtoad joined #nim
17:04:13toadytoadtoadHi all!
17:04:19toadytoadtoadTuning in to the nim webcast...
17:04:43dom96omg, the woman really messed up
17:04:48rgv151lol
17:04:53dom96was she not supposed to go over those slides?
17:05:03drewsremLooks like
17:05:05filwittoadytoadtoad: hello, we're all there too
17:05:17toadytoadtoad:D
17:05:18reactormonkUrgh, the audio quality... I guess I'm watching too many twitch streams
17:05:27dom96the audio quality is a bit worse now...
17:05:30drewsremreactormonk, audio quality is also awful on my end, no twitch here
17:05:32BlaXpiritno, it's the microphone
17:05:43reactormonkdrewsrem, nah, twitch usually has good quality
17:05:48ozraYeah, same here.
17:05:51reactormonkI guess I'm just spoiled :-)
17:05:56dom96BlaXpirit: no, it's not. He sounded perfect on Skype.
17:05:59BlaXpirithm
17:06:06BlaXpiriti saw the main developer of Crystal join
17:06:21dom96oh well, I can still understand him
17:06:27dbohdanAnyone here tried to write a binary extension for a GC-ed scripting language in Nim? I wonder how Nim's GC would interact with that of the scripting language.
17:06:50dbohdanThe language I am specifically interested in is Tcl.
17:06:53ArrrrBlaXpirit: tell him to join this channel
17:07:09reactormonkdbohdan, there's nim-borg for python... but otherwise it's mostly the same for a C api
17:07:17dtscodeare we allowed to answer the Q's if we can?
17:07:28reactormonkdtscode, just do it
17:07:36ozradtscode: can't see why not!
17:07:44toadytoadtoadHelp us out, dtscode !
17:07:48dom96dtscode: I sure as hell am going to :P
17:08:20dtscodeFuck everyone beat me to it
17:08:26toadytoadtoadWhy are these languages essential?
17:08:30reactormonkI can't really write because I put up a random name - automatic reaction to mandatory registration
17:08:32toadytoadtoadI asked that a while ago
17:08:33*darkf quit (Quit: Leaving)
17:08:41ozramy group chat ain't workin.. grrggl
17:09:14dtscodetoadytoadtoad: They cover a wide range of computer fields
17:09:25toadytoadtoadOk
17:10:02dbohdanAnd a related question: does gc:none mean you can't use the standard library?
17:10:24reactormonkdbohdan, sure you can, but you'll leak memory
17:10:25dtscodedbohdan: Not that I know of
17:10:38dtscodeThat is some nice nim code
17:11:55reactormonkHow do you do usability testing?
17:12:29*vendethiel joined #nim
17:13:04dom96reactormonk: I guess spend money to hire people to test the language.
17:13:24reactormonkdom96, lulz. Oh well.
17:13:45dtscodeMan this Dominik Picheta noob. I bet hes never even used nim
17:14:31dom96;)
17:16:06dtscodeis it going slow for everyone else?
17:16:23drewsrem"but that's not very interesting" :)
17:16:37dbohdanreactormonk: Hm, not sure just leaking memory is better. :-) It would to probably be nontrivial to make Nim use a third-party GC, right?
17:16:53dbohdans/to probably/probably/
17:17:03reactormonkdbohdan, +/-, we just had a PR which implements the go gc
17:17:21reactormonkdbohdan, https://github.com/Araq/Nim/pull/2851
17:17:37*johnsoft quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
17:18:22Arrrrhow is go gc lincensed?
17:19:06reactormonkBSD 3-clause
17:20:26dbohdanSo you need a cycle detector... Tcl's GC doesn't do that (because everything's immutable).
17:21:18reactormonkdbohdan, I mean you can just go with the C api and do the tcl memory management kinda manually.
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17:22:23toadytoadtoaddtscode: Confesssion time... I've never coded in nim
17:22:29dtscodeI know :D
17:22:33toadytoadtoadXD
17:22:41toadytoadtoadI just like how it looks and seems
17:22:49dtscodeAli Shakiba: Q: Why "for i in x ...." is highly discouraged?
17:22:54*johnsoft joined #nim
17:22:56dtscodeDid araq just say that?
17:23:09toadytoadtoadYes
17:23:19dtscodeodd
17:23:36reactormonkdbohdan, how about guile?
17:23:41dom96no, he said that unsigned ints are discouraged.
17:23:48dtscodeah
17:23:59dtscodeI already knew that though
17:24:09dbohdanreactormonk: But you would still have two GCs running: Nim's and Tcl's. Maybe it isn't that bad but it seems like a code smell to me.
17:24:12*synthmeat quit (Quit: WeeChat 1.3-dev)
17:24:52reactormonkdbohdan, maybe, but if it works
17:25:17toadytoadtoaddtscode: You're a nim aficionado. Why are you listening?
17:25:37BlaXpiritmany of us there
17:25:40dtscodeI barely know nim :D. I've messed with about 20% of the language
17:25:44toadytoadtoadI bet a bunch of people here are aficionados, just focusing on dts here
17:25:44BlaXpiritpersonally i dont know
17:25:52BlaXpiritwhy
17:26:02dtscodeI invited him here
17:26:17dtscodeI should learn more nim and work on the compiler/stdlib
17:26:23dbohdanreactormonk: What do you mean with Guile? I want to find a language other than C in which to write Tcl extensions.
17:26:24*synthmeat joined #nim
17:26:52toadytoadtoaddtscode: btw, thanks again for showing me this
17:26:56dtscodenp :
17:26:57dtscode:D
17:27:10toadytoadtoadI'm happy nim is first... I don't have time for the other 2 lecture s;-;
17:27:10dom96toadytoadtoad: I'm there to answer questions
17:27:15toadytoadtoadCool
17:27:21reactormonktoadytoadtoad, basically listening so maybe I learn more stuff ;-)
17:27:27dtscode^
17:27:36toadytoadtoadFair enough
17:27:47dom96wish we could see how many people there are
17:27:48toadytoadtoaddts: what was the domain name you had once?
17:27:54reactormonkdbohdan, hm. How can you mark something in a tcl extension to be GC'd?
17:28:12dtscodedom96: :c They need to use IRC protocol
17:28:29dtscodetoadytoadtoad: I've had many. do you mean dragontoothsoftware.com?
17:28:33toadytoadtoadNo
17:28:38toadytoadtoadthe dtsisawesomeand
17:28:39dom96they need to use something which does not depend on Java and Adobe Flash
17:28:47toadytoadtoadThe really long one involving nim
17:28:57*xificurC quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
17:28:58BlaXpiriti dont see java
17:28:59dbohdanreactormonk: Tcl_DecrRefCount(). When it reaches 0 the value is collected.
17:29:12BlaXpiritand html is not viable
17:29:22dtscodedom96: whats that link that compares nim to rust?
17:29:32dbohdanreactormonk: ("It" being the reference count.)
17:29:46reactormonkdbohdan, you could manually garbage collect the items interacting with tcl and let the nim gc handle the rest
17:30:19reactormonk"manually" as in when the refcount is zero
17:30:49toadytoadtoaddom96: You wrote nim kernel?!
17:31:18dom96yep
17:31:23dtscodedom96 is a fucking genius
17:31:30dom96http://arthurtw.github.io/2015/01/12/quick-comparison-nim-vs-rust.html
17:31:34dom96dtscode: hah barely
17:31:36ArrrrMan, he wrote like half of the compiler
17:31:43filwitdom96: he meant 'methods' as 'dynamic dispatch based on inheritance' not UFCS (i think)
17:31:56dtscodedom96: You can say that after writing all the cool parts of the stdlib
17:32:07toadytoadtoaddom96: Thats really impressive
17:32:10dom96filwit: I think he meant the ability to define functions on objects.
17:32:13BlaXpiritdom96 is a legend
17:32:33dtscodeHes also written the irc lib that ruined irc for me in other languages
17:32:46dom96That's very kind of you guys to say. Thanks :)
17:32:52dbohdanreactormonk: That seems reasonable. It's how C++ code generally interacts with Tcl as well.
17:33:17dbohdanreactormonk: Thanks for the answers! I've gotta go.
17:33:19toadytoadtoaddom96: I might take a look at your kernel... I might include nim in my OS now
17:33:22BlaXpiriti only tried to bring up an old joke, but it's true
17:33:45toadytoadtoadDoes nim have easy audio processing? (easy compared to c)
17:33:57dtscodeSure
17:34:00BlaXpiritlanguages don't "have" audio processing
17:34:03dtscodeit has some audo wrappers
17:34:04BlaXpiritit's all about libraries
17:34:04*toadytoadtoad quit (Remote host closed the connection)
17:34:10dom96toadytoadtoad: it's not really that impressive, it's just OSDev's barebones example ported to C with some additional functionality (like the rainbow function :))
17:34:11BlaXpiritand libraries are very easy to wrap
17:34:19Arrrrhe didnt like to read that
17:34:27dom96*ported to Nim from C
17:34:30dtscodeNah hes in school right now
17:34:46*TOADYTOAD joined #nim
17:34:46TOADYTOADClicked the back button accidentally
17:34:48TOADYTOADClicked the back button accidentally
17:34:52TOADYTOADSorry
17:35:00Arrrri cannot forgive you
17:35:00dtscode<dom96> toadytoadtoad: it's not really that impressive, it's just OSDev's barebones example ported to C with some additional functionality (like the rainbow function :))
17:35:10TOADYTOADThanks dts
17:35:17TOADYTOADdom96: Error handling?
17:35:26*vendethiel quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
17:35:35dom96oh yeah, that too. But that's mostly handled by Nim :)
17:35:41TOADYTOADAnd audio wrappers, name of one so I can google it?
17:35:58TOADYTOADdom96: Idk how to even get nim running on itself so....
17:36:28dtscodeTOADYTOAD: On the website there is a list of things supported by nim
17:36:40ozraTOADYTOAD: audio processing + GC tend to not play nicely. So you'd have to avoid GC...
17:36:42*dbohdan left #nim (#nim)
17:36:45TOADYTOADOk
17:36:46TOADYTOADThanks
17:37:00Arrrrozra, why?
17:37:05ozraGive nreal time processing ofc.
17:37:21dtscodejeezus I need my dtscode.io rdns back
17:37:30*johnsoft quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
17:37:36dtscodeOh yay! hes gotten to DSL's
17:37:43filwitozra: just use the realtime GC faculties to control when and for how long the GC runs
17:37:50TOADYTOADdts Speaking of which, again, what was that nim domain you had?
17:38:04dtscodeI would have to check cloudflare :D
17:38:12dtscodeI'll do it after the webthingy
17:38:13dom96I hope they got Araq to record himself locally
17:38:30ozrafilwit: For audio, even soft realtime is "not realtime enough" unfortunately (coded a lot audi DPSing along time ago, for Cubase, VST)
17:38:39filwitahh, i see
17:38:40dom96ozra: Nim's GC is soft real-time ;)
17:38:50TOADYTOADMy OS is audio based so...
17:39:17ozraAudio based OS? TOADYTOAD ?
17:39:24TOADYTOADI'm building an OS
17:39:33TOADYTOADI plan on making an audio only interface
17:39:37ArrrrDoes nim has something like c's static vars in procs?
17:39:48TOADYTOADRight now I'm working on mem management
17:39:49reactormonkArrrr, what does static mean?
17:40:12TOADYTOADdom96: How much nim work have you done?! Incredible...
17:40:21Arrrrlike global, but with the same scope as the proc
17:40:23dom96TOADYTOAD: A lot!
17:40:29ozraTOADYTOAD: Why not make an audio interface to an existing OS (just curious) (I wrote about audio interfaces in a white paper 15 years ago, interests me :_)
17:40:36dtscodeehh hes written like 2 small things and thats about it
17:41:10Arrrrhttp://stackoverflow.com/questions/572547/what-does-static-mean-in-a-c-program
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17:41:17TOADYTOADorza It's running on MIPS, at first I was just building an OS with no goal, and I want kernel control
17:41:27TOADYTOADI would hack linux but I didn't know where to start
17:41:45TOADYTOADThe files dont say: boot here, then this, this does that... too advanced for me :p
17:42:00TOADYTOADI'm not even watching the webcast anymore....
17:42:07ozraTOADYTOAD: In the end going with hacking linux will probably be more productive, but then again, making your own kernel is cooler B-)
17:42:30TOADYTOADYep
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17:42:40TOADYTOADMy OS is open source
17:42:58dtscodewait we have a builtin html dsl?
17:42:59TOADYTOADFeel free to check it out: https://github.com/toad1359/InteractOS
17:43:01dtscodesince when?
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17:43:22ozraWell, if you're not processing audio real realtime (like in few ms latency i/o) soft GC would be fine...
17:43:30TOADYTOADOk
17:43:53TOADYTOADNUUUU ALMOST DONE ;-;
17:44:49ozraTOADYTOAD: You should deffo go with nim :-)
17:45:09dtscodeI'll be writing pokernel in nim :D
17:45:17dtscode*once it becomes more stable that is*
17:45:19TOADYTOADNice
17:45:25TOADYTOADWhats pokernal?
17:45:32TOADYTOAD*pokernel
17:45:55dtscodea secret :D
17:46:05ozraTOADYTOAD: (sidenote: if you made audio UI integration with linux you would help a shitload of blind people in the world...) [plus, I could use it for wearable use and code while walking ;-]
17:46:08TOADYTOADNot for long... mwahahaha
17:46:35TOADYTOADorza Yeah.. blind people are one of my target crowds
17:46:53TOADYTOADorza: That would be cool, but it wouldn't format it properly
17:47:12TOADYTOADAnyways, again, my OS is open source
17:47:13dtscodeDoes anyone know the answer to Jay's question? I'm curious as well
17:48:02ozraTOADYTOAD: Yeah, just meant, no offence, probably no one will use it, and it will be production ready in x years? Just thinking out loud here, not trying to discourage you..
17:48:05reactormonkdtscode, can you copy/paste it here?
17:48:18dtscodeJay Dinsbach: Q What are NIM's real time features for embeddedd systems, if there are any?
17:48:26TOADYTOADI get it
17:48:30TOADYTOADConstructive criticism
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17:48:51reactormonkdtscode, tried it, didn't work out too well because a lot of system stuff requires a heap
17:49:15TOADYTOADorza I plan on having a beta in 1 year, maybe less thanks to summer, if I stick to it... Dang no nim on mips
17:49:56ozraYeah, like in "I like the sound of that - I'd like to actually use it, and that road choice elliminates that, unless application X, Y, Z are ported, lets poke..." ;-)
17:50:31Arrrrozra: what are you working on in your own branch?
17:50:34TOADYTOADorza Also, I plan on making custom hardware....
17:50:35dtscodereactormonk: shame
17:50:56reactormonkdtscode, so it's not a problem with having no GC, rather the arduino had so little memory
17:51:12dtscodeyeah that makes sense
17:51:25ozraArrrr: Of Nim? Right now I'm trying to debug and fix the test-util. The tests gave different results in different runs(!) OR what do you mean?
17:51:49TOADYTOADSo dtscode You checking that domain now or l8r?
17:51:51ozraTOADYTOAD: Cool.
17:52:10TOADYTOADThanks
17:53:03dtscodeuh later. I want to listen to the talk for now
17:53:17TOADYTOADOk
17:53:29TOADYTOADI'm leaving soon, thats why Im curious
17:53:45ArrrrYes, just wanted to see if you were adding new stuff
17:54:50ozraArrrr: Ah, like my 'pipe of' suggestion? ;-) That one was easy to highlight away (unlike dash-identifiers), so I won't bring it up again ;)
17:55:16Arrrrheh
17:55:38ozraArrrr: Are you working on something epically cool? :)
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17:56:31TOADYTOADMy question :D
17:56:36dtscodeI like how shes asking questions we already answered :D
17:56:52ArrrrNo, i'd like to. Do you know crenshaw's lets build a compiler?
17:57:06Arrrri'm following it, but making changes to use nim
17:57:27dtscodeI should port the crenshaw tutorial to nim
17:57:28BlaXpiritdtscode, the questions were pretty bad
17:57:37dtscodeBlaXpirit: yeah :D
17:57:43TOADYTOADArrrr: I printed that out for $50
17:57:45TOADYTOAD<3
17:57:57Arrrri read it only for free
17:58:05TOADYTOADI wanted a hard copy
17:58:10ozraArrrr: No, haven't heard of.
17:58:23ArrrrAh, ok. Well, it is very easy to translate it to Nim TOADYTOAD
17:58:26TOADYTOADArrrr link?
17:58:36Arrrrozra http://compilers.iecc.com/crenshaw/
17:58:42TOADYTOAD(to the translated version.... is it on github?)
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17:59:37ozraOk. Well, I think I can pass on that one :) Learned by doing. Not that I'm an expert in any way...
17:59:37ArrrrNo, im not using github. I can upload what i have to pastebin if you want, TOADYTOAD
17:59:55TOADYTOADI would like that
18:00:05ozraArrrr: Why aren't you using github, if I may ask?
18:00:57ArrrrTOADYTOAD: http://pastebin.com/9inn9KC3 this is what i have up to part 3, part 4-5 is a rewrite
18:01:16ArrrrWell, i have nothing to share with the world. When i have something, ill create an account (i suppose)
18:01:23TOADYTOADThanks
18:01:27ArrrrIm not a genious like half of the programmers here
18:01:48TOADYTOADI'm in the stupid half
18:02:05TOADYTOADStupid together, Arrrr? But if you're porting a pascal program to nim, you are smart
18:02:13TOADYTOADHave fun in that half!
18:02:37ozraArrrr: It's good to have an account for issue-reporting etc. anyways. I've had one for years without sharing anything (been in the corporate sphere) :)
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18:03:35InteractOSDevI'm toad
18:03:36ArrrrYou are right, last time i have to report something on the forum. It was reported to github thanks to yglukhov___
18:03:43InteractOSDevWrong button.... again
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18:04:27ozraArrrr: Just get an account already B-)
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19:04:27matkukiHow did Araq's talk go?
19:05:05AraqI hope/think people liked it. feedback was quite positive.
19:05:33matkukiGreat
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19:11:05dtscodeI liked it
19:11:20OnOyup, I think Nim will get more & more attention upcoming months
19:11:21dtscodeAlthough audio was a bit fuzzy
19:11:55dom96I wonder if creating some live screencasts independently on YouTube would be useful.
19:11:59dtscodeAraq: Dom and I decide that we will host a nim conference and charge people $10k a ticket.
19:12:19dom96dtscode: Lets invite Bill Gates and charge him $50 million
19:12:22dtscode^
19:12:36filwitAraq: talk was great, nice job.
19:12:46ozraYes, the audio was muddy unfortunately, but the presentation was great.
19:13:08OnOyou will be talking differently, once Nim is bought by Apple ;)
19:13:18dtscodeBack to that independent screencast thing... what about an AMA as well? like collection questions from reddit + hacker news (yuck) + the forums?
19:13:25filwitAraq: people seemed impressed with the code-coverage example (though, I change the title from 'Macros' to 'Code Coverage' before releasing the slides)
19:13:32dtscodeerrr an AMAAN
19:14:07filwitI would** change...
19:15:47filwitAMAs and Screencasts surely take a lot of time, and everyone's going to want Araq to do it, lol..
19:16:09Arrrrmacros deserve its own screencast
19:16:39filwitscreencast(s)
19:18:47matkukiNext problem with python: https://bpaste.net/show/edf861ec901f
19:18:48dom96I'm not good enough? :(
19:18:49matkukiThe 'open' proc creates the file pointer correctly, the 'PyRun_AnyFile' fails. Checked system.nim and 'File = ptr CFile'. What am I missing?
19:19:45dtscodedom96: eh you barely write any nim code
19:20:23matkukiAraq: A little help, please?
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19:20:40Araqmatkuki: are you on windows?
19:20:44matkukiyes
19:21:08Araqthen File is C's FILE*, but it uses mingw's FILE*
19:21:19Araqand Python is usually compiled with visual c++
19:21:26Araqso these structures are not compatible
19:21:32filwitdom96: i'm just saying, realistically everyone's gonna want to hear from the "main man" type of thing.. don't get me wrong, this *has* to change pretty soon (I doubt Araq even has time to do THESE presentations), and you're the next obvious candidate for presentation (we could really use some other community members too.. Jehan's input would surely be invaluable)
19:21:37Araqyou can try to use --cc:vcc to solve this problem
19:21:52matkukiAraq: will do
19:22:13Arrrrin fact, i dont know why you dont write more often in your blog dom96 .
19:22:18Araqmatkuki: but even that might not solve it
19:22:22vikatonHow did the Oreilly thing go @ Araq?
19:23:20Araqmatkuki: you should really pass the python code as a string to python, not via FILE*
19:23:22dom96Arrrr: No time. Also I want to redesign it, and redesign the tool which generates it.
19:23:49Araqvikaton: read the logs please. I think people liked it.
19:24:00Araqbbl
19:24:35matkukiAraq: So I should skip the PyRun_AnyFileXXX... and PyRun_SimpleFileXXX... functions?
19:25:02matkukiYeah, you're probably right. Seems more portable.
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19:30:41ozraVarriount: around?
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19:32:58dtscodeHow do you turn a string to an int again?
19:33:13def-dtscode: strutils.parseInt
19:33:25dtscodety
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19:36:55UberLambdaIs there a way to import a module "a" inside of a module "b" and let "b" expose some of "a" 's templates?
19:37:16UberLambdaI'm trying to wrap "logging" into another module that sets it up a bit
19:37:24filwityes, use 'export'
19:37:29UberLambdafilwit: thanks
19:38:16vikatonthat Pharohbot guy did a good job debunking some myths in Nim https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9640384
19:40:02UberLambdameanwhile there's me trying to guess what deferred reference counting is :P
19:40:26UberLambdabut hey, I think I'll replace most of my C code with Nim soon
19:41:50Arrrrnim, the superset of go
19:42:02Arrrrchange the topic
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19:42:46vikatonI lol'd at that
19:43:49UberLambdaIs code at module-level executed only once, even if the module is imported multiple times? It seems like so, but I'd like to be sure
19:45:29dom96pretty sure it is, yeah.
19:46:21UberLambdadom96: cool, thanks
19:47:00UberLambdaThis language is pretty awesome... fast compilation, fast execution, flexibility + LISP-like macros :3
19:47:13dom96yep :)
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19:49:15ozradom96: I had some descrepancies with the testament/tester, which of course is a no no. So I'm investigating it a bit. I think the problem is that it does not use the local-dir compiler nor the local-dir libs, which ultimately is what one wants to test. My idea is to check the args, and if --lib is not passed etc. it defaults to the current dev dir. Any thoughts?
19:49:52dom96ozra: I think it likely might just call the Nim in your PATH
19:50:02dtscodedom96: :c
19:50:10dtscodeYou should write me a function or 2
19:50:14ozradom96: Exactly - which is 'way wrong' for it spurpose..
19:50:34dom96ozra: True.
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19:51:42ozradom96: I'll familiarize myself with the source a bit more, before applying changes, since the 'obvious' place I've found might have alternatives ;)
19:52:46toadestI'll put some nim in my kernel l8r..... thanks Dom96 for reference
19:54:01dom96toadest: cool
19:54:32gokrIt sure is fun seeing this constant flow of new nicks in this channel
19:57:42toadestI've been here today only so I wouldn't know
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20:05:08pigmejreactormonk: hey, I have some time now, and I'm going to try to assemble epc + suggest
20:05:32reactormonkpigmej, let's see if it crashes and burns
20:06:36pigmejFor now I just hope it will do something ;P
20:07:23OnOAraq: as discussed I made TR extension, I hope you like it https://github.com/Araq/Nim/pull/2859
20:07:58pigmejand I need to setup another emacs instance... blah
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20:13:35fowlOnO: cool!
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20:22:14dtscodewhy does proc getDaysLeft(year_s: string, today: string, holiday: string): string = cause invalid indentation errors?
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20:22:56vikatondtscode: code?
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20:23:15dtscodethats the only important part
20:23:23dom96gist all of your code please
20:24:18dtscode*sigh* fine. I guess so. https://gist.github.com/DTSCode/5487bd9d059531c5a015 but it is literally only line 5.
20:25:07dom96that's not where the error happens
20:26:08dom96you're missing a parenthesis on line 54
20:26:20dtscode:3
20:26:41dtscodemy bad. I read that as line 5
20:26:54vikatonlmao
20:27:16dtscodeI'm a total jackass aren't I?
20:27:54Jehan`nah, just human. :)
20:28:01Jehan`Welcome to the club. :)
20:28:01pigmejreactormonk: do you have any sample entries / lines to nimsuggest epc /
20:28:01pigmej?
20:28:10reactormonkpigmej, see scratch.el
20:29:18pigmejoh thx
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20:31:00UberLambdapigmej: just being curious, do you currently use Autocomplete or Company-mode?
20:31:34UberLambdaI'm considering removing company-mode just to be able to install the nim plugin for autocomplete... or porting it to a company-mode hook
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20:32:18pigmejUberLambda: glad to finally see you there
20:32:34pigmejUberLambda: reactormonk + I talked about nim-suggest + epc
20:32:39dom96dtscode: you should really wrap your code to 80 chars btw
20:32:49pigmejreactormonk wrote nim-suggest epc server
20:33:00UberLambdapigmej: :D
20:33:03reactormonkit should work... I just can't get company to run
20:33:05dtscodedom96: This is a throwaway toy :D
20:33:14pigmejreactormonk: http://sixty-north.com/blog/a-more-full-featured-company-mode-backend ?
20:33:17pigmejhave you seen this ?
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20:34:48reactormonkpigmej, nope. I have some text properties on there which should help
20:35:00reactormonkI mean you can always add more information, but first get it to suggest anythign at alll
20:35:10pigmejyeah yeah
20:35:20pigmejI already did epc with python backend
20:35:34pigmejso I will try to find it first, and then maybe it will work somehow ;)
20:36:52pigmejUberLambda: have you ever written company backend ?
20:37:19pigmejbtw reactormonk http://sixty-north.com/blog/writing-the-simplest-emacs-company-mode-backend this one is 'simple' I will experiment with it
20:37:20pigmej;)
20:37:45UberLambdapigmej: not really, I just followed the tutorial some time ago. It didn't seem too hard to implement for simple things... but I don't know if RPC would make it much more complex :P
20:38:21pigmejwithout epc you could just complete keywords
20:38:47UberLambdapigmej: that would be something...
20:39:12UberLambdaI'm not that good at elisp though... I just switched from vim, like, one month ago
20:40:03reactormonkUberLambda, it's not that hard
20:40:29pigmejit is;p
20:40:47UberLambdareactormonk: hm, but I come from a really "imperative" background and I still have to learn to think more functionally
20:41:08reactormonkUberLambda, elisp is very imperative
20:41:53UberLambdareactormonk: oh? It seemed to use mapc & friends quite a bit
20:42:13reactormonkUberLambda, that too.
20:42:34pigmejUberLambda: elisp is 'just' a lisp...
20:43:26UberLambdareactormonk, pigmej: I guess it's time to fiddle a bit with my Emacs config again :P
20:46:04pigmejUberLambda: I'm elisp n00b
20:47:26UberLambdapigmej: I'm n00bier
20:47:34UberLambdaalso, /home/paolo/.nimble/pkgs/compiler-0.10.3/compiler/nimfix/prettybase.nim(10, 8) Error: cannot open 'ast'
20:47:47UberLambda... seems like I can't install nimsuggest
20:48:00pigmejUberLambda: it's in Nim/compiler/nimsuggest
20:48:12pigmejthen compile it nim c -d:release nimsuggest.nim
20:48:22pigmejand then copy to the same dir (bin) where you have ni
20:48:23pigmejnim
20:49:08UberLambdapigmej: ok, doing that now.... but I'd hoped that the Nimble version would have worked. Seems like the compiler needs to be updated & recompiled, but fails because it doesn't find the ast module?
20:50:20pigmejafair nimble version of nimsuggest is totally broken
20:50:38pigmejreactormonk: hmm, I do have always 'nil' as a return from epc
20:50:49reactormonkpigmej, ok, that would explain a lot
20:50:57dom96pigmej: indeed. If somebody could take a look as to why that would be brilliant.
20:51:00reactormonkenable epc debugging (see scratch.el)
20:51:02dom96*why that is
20:51:04pigmejyeah yeah
20:51:23reactormonkand see if your query works with nimsuggest stdout
20:51:26pigmejreactormonk: is even nil supposed to be returned?
20:52:26reactormonkpigmej, the epc debug should be a bit longer than nil
20:53:29pigmejha!
20:53:35pigmejI did path error;)
20:54:31UberLambdauh oh... nimsuggest.nim(17, 44) Error: cannot open 'sexp'
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20:57:32reactormonk^^
20:57:44UberLambdaI don't understand... sexp.nim is in "compiler"
20:58:06UberLambdaI mean in lib/pure
20:58:51pigmejUberLambda: copy it to bin
20:58:55pigmej(nimsuggest)
21:00:00UberLambdapigmej: I ended up adding ../../lib/pure to nimsuggest.nim.cfg... compiler/nimfix/pretty.nim(26, 25) Error: undeclared identifier: 'getConfigVar'
21:00:10UberLambdapigmej: I'll try copying it to bin...
21:01:26UberLambdapigmej: same thing :(
21:02:18reactormonkUberLambda, follow the instructions in the issue
21:04:06UberLambdareactormonk: sorry, which issue? I could only find two regarding nimsuggest moving to a new repo
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21:04:16reactormonkUberLambda, on nim-mode
21:04:44UberLambdareactormonk: oh
21:04:57reactormonkhttps://github.com/reactormonk/nim-mode/issues/12
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21:06:04UberLambdareactormonk: nice opening post, lol
21:06:31reactormonkUberLambda, a bit of humor helps :-)
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21:08:56pigmejreactormonk: what woudl be the goal with nimsuggest + epc ?
21:09:11UberLambdareactormonk, pigmej: I'll try downloading from the epc branch tomorrow, gtg now. Bye :)
21:09:13reactormonkpigmej, what exactly do you want to know?
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21:10:46pigmejI mean, my emacs/elisp fu is a bit too low to make it fully working probably, but I could probably manage company to return usefull thigns
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21:36:09pigmejreactormonk: ~it worked
21:36:14pigmej~worked
21:36:14reactormonkpigmej, \o/
21:36:32pigmejyeah
21:36:40pigmejfar far from success though
21:36:51pigmejbut all we need now is to format epc response
21:38:09reactormonkI think company-nim has a few things for this
21:38:10pigmejreactormonk: http://wklej.to/QHYGd/text all I did ;D (notice it tries to use :async but I call epc-sync in backend)
21:38:35reactormonkhm, duh.
21:38:49reactormonkjust go for sync. It should be fast enough.
21:38:57pigmejasync will be fine
21:39:02pigmejI mean it's easy generally
21:39:10pigmejepc has some macros for async
21:39:12pigmejafair
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21:45:37pigmejreactormonk: where did you stopped with company ?
21:46:12reactormonkpigmej, I couldn't get it to complete
21:46:19reactormonkaka it didn't invoke at all
21:46:59pigmejah ok
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22:57:03toadestdom96: What are the advantages of a nim kernel? Any? Using a higher level lang?
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23:03:24vikatonWhat are people who code in Nim called?
23:03:45fowlPeople
23:04:12vikatonIs there a zombie apocalypse I'm not aware of ?
23:04:22fowlYes
23:04:44fowlThe zombie virus mutated from some rust programmer's tetanus
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23:16:26dom96toadest: You can use all of Nim's nice features. Generics, iterators etc.
23:16:36dom96toadest: also, you get a much better syntax than C.
23:17:26toadestOk
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23:21:02toadestThanks dom
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23:21:56_44535463686f646is there any VOD of the screencast thingy from today?
23:24:43flaviu"Not C syntax" is literally the last reason I use Nim.
23:25:21flaviuBut modules, generics, no headers, GC? That's the interesting stuff.
23:25:33fowlWell its safer than c
23:26:26flaviuIt's possible to be safe in C too.
23:26:41flaviuA little verbose, but not too bad.
23:30:04_44535463686f646no shitty forced oop is a big ass plus
23:32:47ozravikaton: Just, _not_ Nimrods, because those code in Rust ;-)
23:33:40fowlYea you have to be disciplined to be safe in c :p
23:33:43flaviuozra: Let's stay civil.
23:34:24ozraflaviu: Haha, yeah, just jokin!
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23:38:01_44535463686f646https://code.visualstudio.com/Updates#_rust
23:38:04_44535463686f646no nim :(
23:38:44_44535463686f646cant wait for the plugin system to replace sublime text
23:38:44flaviu_44535463686f646: Send them a PR!
23:39:07_44535463686f646flaviu: its closed source with no plugin system yet!
23:40:13jaco60can't wait for an IntelliJ plugin, too
23:40:24_44535463686f646http://visualstudio.uservoice.com/forums/293070-visual-studio-code/suggestions/7752408-plugin-system
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23:42:48ozra_44535463686f646: What editor? (I just found sublime, and am super happy with NimLime in it..)
23:42:59_44535463686f646visual studio code
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23:43:17_44535463686f646ozra: yes i use sublime too with nimlime
23:43:33_44535463686f646bug studio code will be better than sublime imo
23:43:37_44535463686f646but*
23:43:46ozrastudio code?
23:43:54_44535463686f646visual studio code
23:44:05_44535463686f646https://code.visualstudio.com/
23:44:25ozraOooh, haha. ok. Used that professionally, but I've never had windows on my private computer (happily ;-) so...
23:44:34_44535463686f646no u havent
23:44:38toadestIm on windows now
23:44:38_44535463686f646its a new editor
23:44:46_44535463686f646its a linux / mac / windows editor
23:44:51ozraAha, sorry.
23:45:05ozraOk. Cool. Always good with new tools. If they're better ofc :)
23:45:13_44535463686f646with multiple cursor, command palette, etcetc
23:45:17toadestI hate this computer
23:45:31ozra_44535463686f646: so.. sublime? ;)
23:45:48_44535463686f646yes
23:46:01_44535463686f646but i cant wait to use it instead of sublime.
23:46:06ozraAha, open source?
23:46:08toadestDoes nim have a cygwin port?
23:46:10_44535463686f646even if i paid 70$ for it
23:46:34_44535463686f646its still not open source, it might get open sourced eventually, but there will be a plugin system with package manager like sublime
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23:46:54ozraHmm. So what makes it better?
23:47:30_44535463686f646small things that adds up + free
23:47:41_44535463686f646and built by microsoft compared to a single person
23:47:51toadestGuess not...
23:48:00toadestMicro$oft is EVEEEL
23:48:02flaviuIt uses the atom model, iirc
23:48:03Xetoadest: I can't imagine it won't work in cygwin
23:48:07flaviuwebkit frontend.
23:48:09toadestYeah....
23:48:19toadestI'm sadly on windows and would be nice to use one shell
23:48:31Xethen install it from source in cygwin?
23:48:36toadestInstead of nim on windows AND gcc for everything else
23:48:39_44535463686f646install what on windows?
23:48:43toadestOoohhhh.... thanks Xe
23:48:48ozraflaviu: _44535463686f646 - if it's got the atom model and webkit frontend - its out! It doesn't respect linux fontrule settings - that's why I switched to sublime. Thanks for the intell.
23:49:51vikatonRust is popular because of mozilla and samsung imo
23:50:02_44535463686f646toadest: what are you trying to install on windows?
23:50:24toadestLinux Nim
23:50:37_44535463686f646?
23:50:47toadestThe rest of my project builds on Linux
23:50:53toadestIm stuck on windoze rite now
23:50:59toadestI rather keep it lunux based
23:51:00Xeuse putty?
23:51:16toadestXe my linux laptop broke
23:51:17_44535463686f646i use gitbash (mingw)
23:51:19ozratoadest: run in a VM box.. or will it be to heavy?
23:51:23_44535463686f646and everything works great
23:51:28toadestToo heavy
23:51:34ozrayeah
23:51:43toadest2GB ram filled with bloat
23:51:48toadestLaggy already
23:52:02flaviutoadest: Linux 2GB? Dunno what distro you're using.
23:52:04ozraaha
23:52:22toadestNo.... Computer has 2gb
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23:52:36flaviuah. Get a better PC? Rent hardware?
23:52:56toadestThis is while my pc is getting refurbed
23:53:18_44535463686f646what exactly not working with nim on your windows?
23:53:32toadestNothing isn't working
23:53:37toadestI just want the linux version
23:54:01_44535463686f646why
23:54:12flaviutoadest: Rent hardware in the cloud. It's the cheapest and easiest method.
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23:54:47_44535463686f646your on windows, no clue what you would do with the linux version
23:55:10toadestGood idea,falviu
23:55:17toadest_44535463686f646: I explained this
23:55:27toadestThe rest of my project builds on Linux
23:55:31toadestIm stuck on windoze rite now
23:55:34_44535463686f646...
23:55:35toadestI rather keep it lunux based
23:55:42toadest*linux
23:55:47ozratoadest: flaviu s idea was on target :)
23:55:53_44535463686f646what do you use that is linux specific?
23:55:57toadestYes
23:55:59toadestGCC
23:56:02_44535463686f646..
23:56:06_44535463686f646i use gcc
23:56:11_44535463686f646and im on windows
23:56:11toadestCross and gxemu
23:56:13_44535463686f646mingw
23:56:19toadestMingw != GCC
23:56:30_44535463686f646mingw=gcc
23:56:32ozratoadest: how long til you get your machine back?
23:56:39toadestProbably 1.5w
23:57:17ozraooh.. well then: either go with windows setup for now, start hacking, switch to linu later. Or go with the "cloud ware".. I guess.
23:57:45toadest_44535463686f646: No..... theyre different.... minGW is minamalist GNU but not GCC... maybe it has a modified GCC but mingw isn't gnu based anymore
23:57:59toadestSo try modified gcc with other stuff
23:58:18toadestDefinentely does not =
23:59:02toadestozra Back me up? Or am I wrong?
23:59:13_44535463686f646but exactly
23:59:15_44535463686f646what isnt working?
23:59:22toadestNothing isnt working
23:59:27toadestI just want the linux version
23:59:30_44535463686f646why?
23:59:39toadestThe rest of my project builds on Linux
23:59:43toadestIm stuck on windoze rite now
23:59:48_44535463686f646what does 'build on linux' means
23:59:48toadestI rather keep it lunux based
23:59:53_44535463686f646what is linux specific