| 00:00:06 | BlaXpirit_ | Araq, let me fix that readme, anyway |
| 00:00:06 | Araq | BlaXpirit_: so what? you can always embed the html directly |
| 00:00:14 | Trixar_za | I won't even ask why you'd want that. Also nobody is stopping somebody from extending or improving RST. Just fyi. |
| 00:01:43 | flaviu | Trixar_za: My point is that the cost of extending the RST implementation is higher than just wrapping a markdown. |
| 00:02:11 | Araq | flaviu: for whom? for gradha and me it's easier to extend what we have |
| 00:02:51 | flaviu | Araq: https://github.com/gradha/midnight_dynamite |
| 00:03:09 | flaviu | Looks like someone decided that it's easier to wrap a library :) |
| 00:03:56 | Araq | er no? |
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| 00:04:21 | Araq | gradha is not here arguing for throwing away what we have |
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| 00:04:47 | flaviu | I wasn't trying to put words into his mouth, sorry if it sounds that way |
| 00:05:14 | flaviu | But it's clear that he wants to use markdown for some project |
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| 00:05:49 | Araq | maybe he thinks fewer people will complain then. |
| 00:05:56 | Araq | and he would be right |
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| 00:11:33 | BlaXpirit_ | Araq, so please tell me what here is ugly https://gist.github.com/BlaXpirit/b58add2f410dfb92dd48 |
| 00:12:03 | BlaXpirit_ | or could be "read as normal text" better if written in rst |
| 00:12:15 | BlaXpirit_ | (see "raw" of course) |
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| 00:13:02 | Araq | [Freenode][] |
| 00:13:19 | BlaXpirit_ | give the same thing in rst then |
| 00:13:35 | BlaXpirit_ | `Freenode <irc://irc.freenode.net/nim>`__ ? |
| 00:13:52 | Araq | ... should work: |
| 00:13:54 | Araq | $ git clone git://github.com/Araq/Nim.git |
| 00:13:55 | Araq | $ cd Nim |
| 00:14:04 | BlaXpirit_ | what? |
| 00:14:13 | Araq | --> it's not obvious why colon followed by $ produces this kind of block |
| 00:14:26 | BlaXpirit_ | it's just indentation |
| 00:14:39 | BlaXpirit_ | neither colon not $ cause it |
| 00:14:41 | BlaXpirit_ | nor |
| 00:15:00 | Araq | ok ... |
| 00:15:10 | flaviu | mget requires that the key be stringifyable: https://github.com/Araq/Nim/blob/master/lib/pure/collections/tables.nim#L681 |
| 00:15:22 | flaviu | That seems like a needless restriction. |
| 00:15:56 | Araq | flaviu: patch it with 'compiles' |
| 00:16:14 | BlaXpirit_ | Araq, now give me your prettiest rst document |
| 00:16:33 | flaviu | I'd prefer to add a `key` field for KeyError. |
| 00:17:21 | Araq | flaviu: no idea how that can work |
| 00:17:44 | Araq | BlaXpirit_: manual.txt |
| 00:18:05 | Araq | and the files it includes of course |
| 00:18:17 | Trixar_za | BlaXpirit_: Use Markdown if it works for you, but please stop trying to convert others over to it by being truculent. |
| 00:18:30 | BlaXpirit_ | Why would I convert anyone |
| 00:18:42 | BlaXpirit_ | RST is enforced by documentation tools |
| 00:18:46 | flaviu | BlaXpirit_: My version is better: https://gist.github.com/flaviut/6b7abb6bce467cc79fa5 :P |
| 00:19:17 | BlaXpirit_ | flaviu, why dont i see any difference |
| 00:19:22 | Araq | BlaXpirit_: also I think the number of concepts/special syntaxes in RST is way less than what markdown uses |
| 00:19:30 | BlaXpirit_ | who cares |
| 00:19:34 | BlaXpirit_ | justt allow both already |
| 00:19:49 | flaviu | BlaXpirit_: I like the link targets to be at the bottom of the section, not the bottom of the document. |
| 00:19:59 | BlaXpirit_ | oh ok, flaviu |
| 00:20:41 | BlaXpirit_ | that is indeed better |
| 00:20:45 | Trixar_za | BlaXpirit_: pandoc. |
| 00:20:51 | BlaXpirit_ | Trixar_za, haha. |
| 00:21:02 | BlaXpirit_ | i tried to convert a document once |
| 00:21:11 | BlaXpirit_ | not a single line converted correctly after i tried it in forum |
| 00:21:13 | BlaXpirit_ | xD |
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| 00:22:02 | Trixar_za | They never do. My disdain comes with Markdown comes from trying to convert MediaWiki pages over to Markdown documentation... Never again :| |
| 00:22:13 | Triplefox | If only we could just standardize on wordperfect 5.1 |
| 00:22:16 | Trixar_za | - first comes* |
| 00:22:29 | BlaXpirit_ | Trixar_za, try that with rst too -___- |
| 00:22:58 | BlaXpirit_ | Araq, not much to say about manual. `` becomes ` .. code-block:: nim is simply removed but code is indented with 2 more spaces |
| 00:23:49 | BlaXpirit_ | but of course, if you want to specify a language, then extensions would be needed, not gonna lie |
| 00:24:59 | Araq | the tables would be full of | too :P |
| 00:25:18 | Araq | but maybe markdown has more hidden ways to write these |
| 00:25:21 | BlaXpirit_ | wow big deal, add some | in between columns |
| 00:25:31 | BlaXpirit_ | markdown doesn't even have a way to make a table, FYI |
| 00:25:57 | BlaXpirit_ | the numerous languages that extend upon it, however... |
| 00:26:40 | Araq | so. to summarize: we should call our RST a dialect of markdown with some non-standard features and you'll be happy |
| 00:26:55 | BlaXpirit_ | umm no |
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| 00:28:18 | flaviu | I'd be happy with that, make sure it implements everything in http://daringfireball.net/projects/markdown/syntax though. |
| 00:28:25 | BlaXpirit_ | yeah |
| 00:28:39 | flaviu | Also add fenced code blocks, they're incredibly useful. |
| 00:29:42 | Trixar_za | I'm having the weirdest flashback of when I added MediaWiki syntax on top of LionWiki |
| 00:29:53 | BlaXpirit_ | in documentation i definitely wouldn't use fenced code blocks though |
| 00:30:00 | BlaXpirit_ | and what else would they be for? |
| 00:30:28 | flaviu | BlaXpirit_: When I'm writing out a message, I can't be bothered to open vim and indent my code. |
| 00:30:37 | BlaXpirit_ | oh u mean forum |
| 00:30:39 | BlaXpirit_ | sure |
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| 00:33:52 | BlaXpirit_ | come to think of it, i dont absolutely have to use rst in my documentation |
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| 00:34:13 | BlaXpirit_ | well it's not so bad anyway, the main difference so far has been `` vs ` |
| 00:34:15 | BlaXpirit_ | ... |
| 00:34:47 | BlaXpirit_ | but yeah, doing some pandoc magic may be acceptable |
| 00:34:52 | flaviu | Is there a way to get a handle to the caught exception? |
| 00:35:20 | flaviu | getCurrentException() and cast might work |
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| 00:37:00 | Trixar_za | Btw how hard is it to learn Clojure? I have to learn it for a job opportunity. |
| 00:37:13 | Trixar_za | I know it uses a LISP variation |
| 00:37:50 | BlaXpirit_ | it's not that likely someone present knows it |
| 00:38:26 | x4nt | http://learnxinyminutes.com/docs/clojure/ |
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| 00:40:36 | x4nt | idk, doesn't look like too bad of a functional language |
| 00:41:57 | BlaXpirit_ | http://4clojure.com/ is so good tho |
| 00:41:57 | Trixar_za | By looking at this example, it seems surprisingly easy to learn |
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| 00:46:07 | Kal_ | It was my first Lisp and I didn't have too much trouble |
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| 02:19:52 | keyle | hi |
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| 03:01:38 | def- | hi keyle |
| 03:01:57 | keyle | hey def- |
| 03:02:31 | keyle | i tried using your irc lib to build a small irc client but no luck |
| 03:03:23 | keyle | readline is blocking. |
| 03:04:27 | def- | I'm not the author of the irc lib, but i can take a look. do you have the source anywhere? |
| 03:05:27 | keyle | oh |
| 03:05:48 | keyle | search for keyle here and have a quick read http://irclogs.nim-lang.org/09-01-2015.html |
| 03:05:59 | keyle | source here https://gist.github.com/keyle/46337a707c23492c7e11 |
| 03:06:04 | keyle | thx :> |
| 03:06:21 | def- | ah, an async irc client |
| 03:07:04 | keyle | my goal was a tiny irssi style irc client yep |
| 03:07:50 | keyle | but an await readline blocks everything afaik, and I've been using nim for 5 days so :)... |
| 03:09:52 | EXetoC | can it not block? |
| 03:10:13 | def- | looks like something is broken indeed |
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| 03:10:42 | keyle | someone hinted of polling the keyboard keys but noted that it won't work on windows, so that won't do it for me |
| 03:10:49 | def- | the test clients of the irc lib don't work either, do they? |
| 03:11:02 | keyle | yep it works |
| 03:11:12 | def- | ah wait. so everything works and you just want to get a key press? |
| 03:11:17 | keyle | I can get the test bot in a channel and send command to it and it responds |
| 03:11:18 | def- | I'd use the termbox library |
| 03:11:25 | keyle | yep |
| 03:11:33 | EXetoC | not for windows |
| 03:11:38 | keyle | ok never heard of that one |
| 03:11:53 | def- | oh =/ |
| 03:12:22 | def- | i guess ncurses or pdcurses would work? |
| 03:12:35 | keyle | ah yep anything else than linux {.error: "This platform has not been accounted for in the termbox wrapper.".} |
| 03:13:05 | EXetoC | termbox itself supports it? |
| 03:14:36 | keyle | I have no knowledge on how to write a wrapper or using that c2nim tool |
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| 03:15:49 | keyle | I'd probably should learn c2nim with something much simpler than a TUI lib :D |
| 03:16:24 | def- | If you can get termbox compiled on Windows (no idea if it works on Windows), it should be easy to adapt the wrapper to work |
| 03:16:51 | EXetoC | the lib is very simple |
| 03:17:49 | flaviu | keyle: consider you could have started with the windows api ;) |
| 03:17:57 | keyle | the go version made its own winapi impl https://github.com/nsf/termbox-go |
| 03:18:42 | keyle | flaviu, I am a noob in system programming. |
| 03:18:58 | keyle | I had C class 14 years ago :) |
| 03:19:27 | keyle | which is why I'm interested in nim |
| 03:21:00 | flaviu | keyle: You should try writing a personal project in C. I recently did so and found it really rewarding. |
| 03:21:36 | keyle | yep I should. |
| 03:23:15 | keyle | def-, sorry I had you confused with dom96 I think |
| 03:28:23 | flaviu | keyle: dom96's timezone is around UTC, fyi |
| 03:28:48 | keyle | that's UK-ish? |
| 03:29:15 | flaviu | yep |
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| 03:32:17 | keyle | I am no expert but seeing that termbox uses /dev/tty... I don't see it working for me :) |
| 03:33:48 | def- | hm, yeah |
| 03:33:53 | def- | looks *nix only |
| 03:34:04 | def- | curses or winapi then |
| 03:34:15 | def- | I don't know how to this in either, in termbox it would've been easy |
| 03:36:10 | keyle | technically with async I can launch two loops with timers on each and get the results shuffled right? |
| 03:38:05 | EXetoC | thou shalt not use curses for it was conjured by the devil |
| 03:38:40 | keyle | btw the readme link is broken http://nim-lang.org/lib.html#nimble |
| 03:39:30 | flaviu | keyle: https://github.com/nim-lang/nimble#readme |
| 03:39:46 | keyle | yeah I figured as much :> |
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| 04:01:44 | flaviu | I've sent a PR to fix that and some other stuff. |
| 04:01:47 | flaviu | night. |
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| 04:02:44 | keyle | night |
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| 08:32:48 | Varriount | gmpreussner: ping |
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| 08:39:20 | HakanD | hey |
| 08:39:34 | HakanD | there are a few spam posts on the forum front page |
| 08:41:41 | keyle | do you know where I can find an example of async with poll ? |
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| 09:01:40 | Varriount | keyle: Hm? |
| 09:02:23 | keyle | something similar to this https://github.com/Araq/Nim/blob/a8771b30518c307aa537b122d07bc41426eccb24/tests/async/tasyncawait.nim |
| 09:02:47 | Varriount | keyle: That uses the old async code. |
| 09:03:04 | keyle | hm github search threw me on an old branch |
| 09:03:12 | Varriount | keyle: Do you know what `poll` is? |
| 09:03:33 | keyle | not really but it's not like it's documented |
| 09:04:26 | keyle | it's ok I'm just mocking around learning the language |
| 09:04:35 | keyle | I wished it were better documented tho |
| 09:04:41 | Varriount | keyle: I mean, do you know what 'polling a socket' does? |
| 09:04:56 | keyle | yes |
| 09:05:17 | keyle | didn't know that poll was socket polling |
| 09:05:21 | keyle | thanks for that |
| 09:05:55 | Varriount | keyle: Well you can also poll file handles. |
| 09:06:03 | Varriount | keyle: And stdin is a file handle |
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| 09:06:38 | keyle | even on windows? |
| 09:07:16 | Varriount | keyle: The poll in asyncdispatch is bit different, as it's meant for polling all open sockets and file handles other things are currently waiting on. |
| 09:07:42 | Varriount | keyle: I can't remember. I think there are some limitations with polling stdin on windows. |
| 09:08:38 | keyle | ok |
| 09:09:02 | keyle | I do love how easy it is to hack around |
| 09:09:07 | keyle | template `loop`(act:stmt): stmt {.immediate.} = while true: act |
| 09:09:46 | keyle | here is a question, imagine a DSL loaded from a file |
| 09:09:56 | keyle | is there an eval proc somewhere? |
| 09:10:09 | keyle | as in "evaluate this string as code" |
| 09:10:38 | Varriount | keyle: Yes, but it's compile time only. |
| 09:10:58 | keyle | :/ |
| 09:11:09 | Varriount | keyle: Although, you are ussually better off just using macros, templates, and source filters. |
| 09:11:24 | keyle | so no such thing as creating a bunch of templates, loading up a file and executing it as "my own DSL" ? |
| 09:11:38 | Varriount | keyle: Not at runtime. |
| 09:11:47 | Varriount | keyle: Not unless you want to write an interpreter. |
| 09:12:38 | keyle | so if I made my own silly compiler.exe, I can't load a file and execute is as a DSL source? |
| 09:12:49 | keyle | would that qualify as interpreted? |
| 09:13:27 | keyle | I guess simpler question, imagine this: template print(a: expr):expr {.immediate.} = echo a |
| 09:14:03 | keyle | var s = """ print "bla" """ |
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| 09:14:22 | keyle | how to 'execute' var s's content? |
| 09:16:24 | Varriount | keyle: Look in the macros module, at parseStmt |
| 09:17:29 | keyle | ah, thank you sir :) |
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| 09:36:28 | keyle | this doesn't compile, shouldn't it ? var t = parseStmt("echo 5") |
| 09:37:21 | Varriount | keyle: What error are you getting? Are you using parseStmt in a macro? |
| 09:37:41 | keyle | [Linking] |
| 09:37:43 | keyle | Error: execution of an external program failed |
| 09:37:50 | keyle | no, clearly I'm doing something silly |
| 09:38:35 | Varriount | keyle: What exactly do you have in mind for this? It's much easier to just construct macros and templates to make the DSL you want. |
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| 09:38:57 | keyle | that's my goal indeed |
| 09:39:25 | keyle | right now I'd like to execute "echo 5" from string to AST to running code |
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| 09:44:13 | Varriount | https://gist.github.com/Varriount/188eb68c84b63306850b |
| 09:44:17 | Varriount | keyle: ^ |
| 09:44:36 | keyle | ha |
| 09:44:40 | keyle | thank you Varriount :) |
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| 09:57:27 | keyle | wow this is powerful |
| 09:57:44 | keyle | and arguably dangerous |
| 09:58:03 | BlaXpirit | nah |
| 09:58:09 | BlaXpirit | it's only compile time anyway |
| 09:58:11 | BlaXpirit | i think |
| 09:58:36 | BlaXpirit | and this is exec, not eval :| |
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| 10:01:32 | Varriount | keyle: Oh, try the 'emit' procedure |
| 10:01:56 | Varriount | macros.emit : accepts a single string argument and treats it as nim code that should be inserted verbatim in the program |
| 10:02:19 | keyle | result = emit($s) ? |
| 10:02:46 | Varriount | No, just replace the entire procedure I wrote. |
| 10:02:59 | Varriount | emit("echo 5") |
| 10:04:03 | keyle | hehe ok but that needs a const string |
| 10:04:21 | keyle | so like BlaXpirit it's compile time only |
| 10:05:10 | Varriount | Araq: Since, for the fix for #1832 , I'm modify incrSeq, should I rename incrSeq to something more... descriptive? |
| 10:05:35 | Varriount | keyle: Keep in mind that Nim is primarily a statically compiled language. |
| 10:05:56 | Varriount | Runtime evaluation is possible, but difficult. |
| 10:06:04 | keyle | yep good point |
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| 10:12:23 | keyle | so there is no jitting in nim |
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| 10:18:19 | keyle | so I'd have to write an interpreter |
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| 10:18:56 | gokr1 | There is AFAIK some kind of VM that runs the compile time Nim - but no idea on its state. |
| 10:19:37 | gokr1 | I also know Araq wants to use tcc to do "dynamic" compilation by simply calling it to compile stuff and reload libraries. |
| 10:21:47 | novist | is there a way to make nim dump AST of some piece of code? |
| 10:22:42 | def- | novist: http://nim-lang.org/macros.html#dumpTree.m,stmt |
| 10:23:50 | keyle | thanks guys |
| 10:24:29 | keyle | I'm always torturing compilers |
| 10:24:35 | novist | err but how do i use it? like if i want to see AST of proc contents? |
| 10:25:23 | keyle | novist: https://github.com/Araq/Nim/blob/188df67677912189438226b96e765ee034b2ff9f/tests/macros/tdumptree.nim ? |
| 10:25:43 | novist | ohhhhh thats neat, didnt know it can be used like that too. thanks! |
| 10:25:57 | keyle | me neither... :D |
| 10:26:28 | keyle | what I love about nim is that I get a damn .exe out of it |
| 10:26:53 | keyle | no runtime shipping, vm, dlls... |
| 10:27:03 | keyle | yet it feels like python |
| 10:27:40 | novist | totally. all we need is good IDE support now ^_^ |
| 10:27:58 | Varriount | Well, onionhammer and I have sublime text covered. |
| 10:28:02 | keyle | yes, I'm with you on that one. I'm an intellij sucker. |
| 10:28:09 | novist | so am i \o/ |
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| 10:28:21 | keyle | sublime is good, but no refactoring |
| 10:28:25 | Varriount | Hi Matthias247 |
| 10:28:33 | novist | i actually started putting together intellij plugin but stopped due to lexer/parser stuff |
| 10:28:33 | Matthias247 | hi |
| 10:28:37 | keyle | no updating imports on refactors |
| 10:28:43 | keyle | and no navigate to definition working |
| 10:28:55 | Varriount | novist: You could probably just copy the compiler's parser code. It's not that complicated |
| 10:29:06 | keyle | novist: I looked at it too and decided that my life wasn't long enough |
| 10:29:14 | novist | well.. it would require translating it to java too |
| 10:29:24 | novist | then different compilers would need explicit support |
| 10:29:41 | keyle | IntelliJ plugin dev is like wearing nipple clamps thrown in a blender |
| 10:29:51 | novist | i silently hope that compiler could do lexing/parsing in the future |
| 10:29:55 | Varriount | novist: What? Don't just looooove Java? >:D |
| 10:29:56 | novist | keyle nah.. |
| 10:30:07 | novist | Varriount i prefer c# :p |
| 10:30:09 | Varriount | novist: Um, but what would the compiler output? |
| 10:30:11 | keyle | novist: well then you get my vote to do it! |
| 10:30:40 | keyle | Varriount: is the go to definition meant to work in sublime? |
| 10:30:43 | novist | Varriount i hoped compiler could provide something like loose RCP interface to implement lexing/parsing interfaces |
| 10:30:43 | Varriount | novist: Things like line numbers and comments get thrown away after parsing.. |
| 10:30:59 | novist | actually lexer can be done in java |
| 10:31:05 | novist | but parsing would be hard |
| 10:31:15 | Varriount | keyle: Not really. Not until the IDETools part of the compiler is functional. |
| 10:31:19 | keyle | intellij lexer has its own definition thing, that's the easy part |
| 10:31:46 | Varriount | keyle, novist: You have no right to complain unless you plan on doing something about it. |
| 10:31:57 | Varriount | :/ |
| 10:32:05 | novist | its not complaining :p |
| 10:32:19 | novist | if there were right tools i would be on writing some kind of plugin already |
| 10:32:32 | novist | or maybe if i had more experience to fill in gaps myself |
| 10:33:03 | novist | hell actually.. maybe compiler would have to just provide AST dump |
| 10:33:22 | novist | and maybe some support for "broken" code ast dumping like that idetools dirty flag thing |
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| 10:40:14 | keyle | yeah no I'd write the intellij plugin if I had the skills, I promise |
| 10:40:25 | keyle | very happy with aporia and sublime |
| 10:41:10 | keyle | I tried Julia 6 months ago, if I remember correctly the tooling was awful |
| 10:41:21 | keyle | Dart is also awful |
| 10:41:29 | keyle | so is the language and the damn lib system |
| 10:42:08 | keyle | so didn't meant to come off as a complaint, I was just talking in the realms of an awesome future, intellij would be my IDE of choice |
| 10:42:27 | keyle | bbl |
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| 10:45:26 | Varriount | keyle: It's just, I wish there were more people contributing to Nim. Even helping with fixing/extending the standard library would be nice. |
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| 10:52:53 | keyle | Varriount: I plan to. I still got my Learner plate on :) |
| 10:53:26 | keyle | like this one, I think I could fix it but I don't know enough yet |
| 10:53:27 | keyle | https://github.com/Araq/Nim/issues/1906 |
| 10:53:55 | Varriount | keyle: I was actually looking at that one earlier. |
| 10:53:55 | novist | entry bar is pretty high though |
| 10:54:15 | keyle | I plan on writing a small static html generator, so that I can convert gists into a nim cookbook website |
| 10:54:36 | keyle | like novist says, the entry bar is pretty high |
| 10:54:39 | Varriount | keyle: That issue shouldn't be too difficult. I wouldn't resort to using osExecShell and cls though |
| 10:55:00 | keyle | heh I welcome a better solution |
| 10:55:18 | Varriount | keyle: I'd look at this -> http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/ms682022%28v=vs.85%29.aspx |
| 10:55:25 | novist | though Varriount im pretty sure people would contribute in other ways. say if i figured out that parser thing for intellij i bet keyle would contribute something to intellij plugin too |
| 10:55:44 | Varriount | And see what differences there are between the Nim version and the C version |
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| 10:56:10 | keyle | Varriount: great find |
| 10:56:46 | keyle | I know nothing of windows.h and low system dev |
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| 10:57:03 | keyle | I spend my days in java hell |
| 10:57:08 | Varriount | keyle: Ouch. |
| 10:57:11 | novist | either of you know if i can dump debug info of some variable? like type, value..? |
| 10:57:23 | keyle | maven is my girlfriend |
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| 10:57:53 | keyle | novist: like a php vardump? or typeof? nope :/ |
| 10:58:17 | Varriount | novist: you can use typetraits.name to get the type name |
| 10:58:27 | novist | at least thats good, thanks |
| 10:58:35 | Varriount | repr() works to dump most of an objects information |
| 11:03:16 | keyle | is nimfix like gofmt ? |
| 11:03:28 | keyle | does it reformat code to standards? |
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| 11:08:12 | dv- | i don't think that's possible |
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| 11:17:37 | Varriount | keyle: Sorta? |
| 11:18:54 | keyle | so proc bla(x:string):string= becomes proc bla (x: string): string = |
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| 11:27:17 | Varriount | keyle: I really haven't used nimfix, so I don't know. |
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| 11:33:02 | novist | could someone enlighten me why my macro is not modifying ast? http://paste.linuxmint.com/view/xyyv |
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| 12:01:29 | flaviu | novist: `return result` is redundant |
| 12:01:56 | flaviu | but the reason that dumpTree output doesn't is because it dumps the AST right after parsing |
| 12:02:05 | flaviu | it doesn't expand any possible macro invocations. |
| 12:03:32 | flaviu | Also, if I understand what you're trying to do, you don't really need a macro: https://gist.github.com/flaviut/1ae1d7deac4c57d0a84c |
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| 12:11:28 | BlaXpirit | .eval var a; echo((a = 5) == 5) |
| 12:11:32 | Mimbus | BlaXpirit: eval.nim(4, 4) Error: ':' or '=' expected, but found 'echo' |
| 12:11:35 | novist | thanks flaviu |
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| 12:24:53 | novist | .eval echo($42u) |
| 12:24:54 | Varriount | Hello Lingo___ |
| 12:24:57 | Mimbus | novist: 42 |
| 12:27:06 | BlaXpirit | how to... inherit constructors? |
| 12:27:55 | flaviu | result = initFoo(...); ... |
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| 12:28:59 | BlaXpirit | oh yeah... |
| 12:29:05 | BlaXpirit | thx |
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| 12:35:34 | flaviu | https://gist.github.com/flaviut/e2ddb62c38cb224e5148 |
| 12:35:47 | flaviu | "cannot prove ... is not nil" |
| 12:36:02 | flaviu | but if it is nil, than exception will be thrown |
| 12:36:54 | flaviu | And inside the if, it can be shown that there are no accesses to potentially nil addresses |
| 12:37:13 | flaviu | *then |
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| 12:53:39 | flaviu | maybe `not nil` should be marked as experimental? |
| 12:59:33 | alexruf | If someone also uses Dash (http://kapeli.com/dash), please write them an mail and request a docset for Dash. Since I did the first vote for a Nim docset, the will only start to generate on when more people request it. |
| 13:02:45 | Varriount | Araq: Does the GC use a sequences length field for anything in particular? |
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| 13:07:57 | ekarlso- | is there any docs site a'la doc.rust-lang.org yet ? |
| 13:08:39 | flaviu | http://nim-lang.org/lib.html |
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| 13:09:17 | Varriount | ekarlso-: Um.. is it not somewhat prominant on the website? |
| 13:09:44 | Varriount | I mean, there's a tab that says 'docs'... |
| 13:10:55 | ekarlso- | ah-,,- |
| 13:11:49 | flaviu | How does UFCS interact with generics? |
| 13:12:25 | flaviu | It seems that foo.bar[Type](...) is treated as bar[Type](bar) |
| 13:12:25 | * | z1y quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 13:12:37 | flaviu | err, bar[Type](foo) |
| 13:12:46 | flaviu | without any `...` |
| 13:12:50 | Varriount | flaviu: There are one or two quirks. |
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| 13:14:21 | Varriount | flaviu: Mainly because the compiler doesn't know if the subscript operator is acting on a generic, or a type that supports `[]` |
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| 13:23:32 | novist | is there maybe a way to dump ast of nim file now? |
| 13:29:37 | keyle | .eval echo "hello world" |
| 13:29:40 | Mimbus | keyle: hello world |
| 13:29:53 | keyle | neat. |
| 13:30:48 | flaviu | Does the stdlib expose an unchecked array type anywhere? |
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| 13:38:39 | flaviu | rtarrays, but that says not to use it. |
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| 13:42:09 | flaviu | dom96: http://forum.nimrod-lang.org/ doesn't redirect properly. |
| 13:47:48 | Varriount | novist: You can use the dumpTree macro |
| 13:48:19 | Varriount | novist: There might be a hidden compiler command, but I can't remember (hidden because it isn't official) |
| 13:48:21 | flaviu | I wonder how it'd be possible to implement sum types. |
| 13:48:38 | Varriount | flaviu: ? |
| 13:48:54 | flaviu | like tuple[foo: string, bar: int] |
| 13:49:06 | flaviu | but instead of having both types, just have one type |
| 13:49:13 | novist | Varriount but can i use dumpTree without re-writing entire file to new file where everything is under the macro? |
| 13:49:19 | Varriount | flaviu: You mean, object variants? |
| 13:49:33 | flaviu | Varriount: Yes, but inline |
| 13:49:46 | flaviu | I don't want to type 'case' once. |
| 13:49:52 | Varriount | flaviu: Macro then? |
| 13:50:02 | Varriount | flaviu: There's also the union pragma |
| 13:50:17 | flaviu | yep, but I need to find the macro invocation rules for types. |
| 13:51:17 | Araq | Varriount: er yes? to determine the length. |
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| 13:53:48 | Varriount | Araq: I ask, because for some reason, separating the inc(seq.len) from incrSeq, I get GC errors |
| 13:53:48 | flaviu | Araq: Can you look at what I posted around 12:35:34? |
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| 13:57:06 | keyle | does anyone know how I can get the stuffed piped in the program? |
| 13:57:07 | Araq | flaviu: you seem to complain that the analysis is not smarter than what an Option[T] would have given you |
| 13:57:17 | keyle | I know about parseOpt2 |
| 13:57:33 | keyle | e.g. echo "bla" > mynimapp |
| 13:57:37 | novist | Araq (lets bombard you with questions!) was there unofficial compiler param to dump AST of nim file? |
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| 13:58:00 | flaviu | keyle: stdin |
| 13:58:17 | keyle | flaviu: care to share an example? |
| 13:58:30 | keyle | let ins = system.readAll(stdin) |
| 13:58:34 | keyle | that didn't pan well :P |
| 13:59:29 | flaviu | keyle: works fine for me. |
| 13:59:40 | Araq | novist: hrm no. |
| 13:59:41 | flaviu | The `echo "bla" > mynimapp` syntax looks wrong though |
| 13:59:52 | flaviu | try `echo "bla" | mynimapp` |
| 14:00:04 | Araq | keyle: stdin.readAll doesn't work on some OSes iirc |
| 14:00:21 | Araq | gokr1 has a fix but never made a PR |
| 14:00:43 | keyle | I'm one windows |
| 14:00:46 | keyle | on* |
| 14:01:47 | keyle | echo system.readAll(stdin) |
| 14:01:55 | keyle | dir > pipe.exe |
| 14:01:58 | keyle | nothing |
| 14:02:34 | keyle | maybe I'm not piping right on windows, afaik dir > bla.txt works |
| 14:02:48 | keyle | yeah that works |
| 14:03:13 | flaviu | keyle: sorry, I can't help. I know nothing about how windows works. |
| 14:03:47 | keyle | it's ok don't feel bad, Microsoft doesn't either |
| 14:04:54 | Araq | keyle: try this: while not eof(stdin): let x = stdlin.readLine |
| 14:06:46 | keyle | where is eof from? |
| 14:07:04 | Araq | maybe it's endOfFile instead, it's in system |
| 14:07:27 | keyle | k |
| 14:08:01 | keyle | while not endoffile(stdin): let x = stdin.readLine |
| 14:08:10 | keyle | this compiles but again, nothing at runtime |
| 14:08:26 | Araq | well try to feed it some input manually |
| 14:09:24 | keyle | this compiles but again, nothing at runtime |
| 14:09:28 | keyle | oops |
| 14:10:23 | keyle | so if I type input manually it does echo back |
| 14:10:32 | keyle | but piping into it not so much |
| 14:10:46 | Araq | well > is an output pipe |
| 14:11:00 | Araq | try < but I never used that on windows either |
| 14:13:23 | keyle | http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=RP7RdSAW |
| 14:14:06 | keyle | Are you guys linux / mac ? |
| 14:14:28 | def- | keyle: you overwrote the pipe.exe |
| 14:14:45 | keyle | umf did I |
| 14:15:03 | keyle | yes I did |
| 14:15:09 | keyle | rofl, mea culpa |
| 14:16:33 | keyle | so every time I compiled, I tried command > pipe.exe first, and then command | pipe.exe |
| 14:16:41 | keyle | everytime overwriting the binary |
| 14:16:50 | keyle | So sorry :) |
| 14:16:53 | def- | Haha |
| 14:17:06 | keyle | echo readAll(stdin) # works fine on windows btw! |
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| 14:18:29 | keyle | thanks for the help anywya |
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| 14:20:50 | flaviu | keyle: 20% linux, 25% mac, 30% windows |
| 14:21:31 | keyle | sounds healthy |
| 14:21:39 | Araq | 25% Plan 9? |
| 14:21:44 | flaviu | lol |
| 14:22:01 | keyle | I did run openbsd for a few years |
| 14:22:06 | flaviu | these are the stats from google analytics, so I didn't include mobiles and minority OSes. |
| 14:22:36 | keyle | they're all the tor users :> |
| 14:22:47 | flaviu | Araq: 0.08% FreeBSD :P |
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| 14:29:29 | gour | keyle: how did you like openbsd? i tried it the other day on my netbook (with gnome) but it seems to still require some manual fiddling..however i plan to put opensmtpd on th server to replace postfix |
| 14:29:59 | keyle | I liked it above all else |
| 14:30:09 | gour | what do you use atm? |
| 14:30:25 | keyle | bunch of linodes with debian |
| 14:30:34 | gour | ahh, ok |
| 14:31:01 | gour | so, it was not on the desktop? |
| 14:31:22 | keyle | openbsd as a desktop... it's kind of like taking your bride in a jeep |
| 14:31:34 | gour | he he |
| 14:32:01 | gour | i read somewhere that openbsd devs use OS on their machines unlike freebsd ones :-' |
| 14:32:08 | gour | :-) |
| 14:32:24 | keyle | it's a neat system |
| 14:32:41 | gour | does nim work there? |
| 14:32:42 | keyle | they kind of lost my respect a bit with their arrogance in the heartbleed mess though |
| 14:33:18 | keyle | if I'd pick one it'd probably be archlinux |
| 14:33:32 | keyle | I merely used it but I liked it |
| 14:33:54 | gour | i'm on suse now, after debian...liked it very much, especially zypper |
| 14:34:16 | gour | *like |
| 14:35:05 | keyle | I think I tried suse in the late 90ies, at the time I was using slackware tho |
| 14:35:16 | keyle | suse was `massive` |
| 14:35:48 | gour | it's very polished today, imho...i did start with linux/suse in '99 |
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| 14:46:29 | flaviu | https://gist.github.com/flaviut/d5d31442bb70443faee9 |
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| 14:51:51 | flaviu | nothing I do seems to fix it. |
| 14:52:10 | Araq | template params shouldn't be in ` ` |
| 14:53:16 | flaviu | It give an internal error |
| 14:53:26 | flaviu | if I make it a macro, it still gives an internal error. |
| 14:53:49 | flaviu | I removed the ``, but I doesn't seem to fix it. |
| 14:54:01 | gokr1 | Hey guys |
| 14:56:08 | gokr1 | keyle: Want my fix? |
| 14:56:23 | keyle | gokr1: which? |
| 14:56:26 | Araq | gokr1: I want it. is that enough? |
| 14:56:40 | gokr1 | Hehe, well, its not a "fix" - more of a workaround. |
| 14:56:47 | gokr1 | 1 sec |
| 14:57:28 | gokr1 | http://pastebin.com/H507u65Y |
| 14:57:51 | gokr1 | I just defined my own readAll which doesn't do that stuff at the beginning. I guess a proper fix could use a when: check |
| 14:58:18 | gokr1 | Araq: Btw, QtCreator seems very capable |
| 14:59:13 | gokr1 | The NimKate highlighting works in QtCreator - it uses the same system. |
| 14:59:43 | gokr1 | And debugging seems to work fine, and seems to have quite advanced features. |
| 15:00:12 | gokr1 | And QtCreator AFAIK runs on all modern platforms - and is built to work fine with Android etc. |
| 15:00:22 | gokr1 | later |
| 15:01:29 | keyle | hm gokr1: this worked fine for me http://pastebin.com/cABrDve1 |
| 15:01:48 | keyle | option1 gives an extra line for whatever reason |
| 15:02:43 | keyle | (granted I haven't tested with much) |
| 15:07:15 | flaviu | https://gist.github.com/flaviut/d282846647d6ff5f4f9b |
| 15:07:24 | flaviu | if anyone else wants to have fun while using macros :) |
| 15:08:18 | Araq | violation of NEP-1 detected. |
| 15:08:43 | flaviu | huh? |
| 15:08:57 | Araq | procs should start with a lowercased letter |
| 15:09:31 | flaviu | Araq: I like to pretend I live in a world where https://github.com/Araq/Nim/issues/1693 has been accepted. |
| 15:09:57 | Araq | Sym is not even a type |
| 15:10:21 | Araq | nnkSym is an enum value that's it |
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| 15:11:28 | flaviu | and *Lit is also wrong |
| 15:11:36 | flaviu | I'll fix that once I get to it. |
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| 15:37:27 | flaviu | Is https://gist.github.com/4ff0f300fc9db8ea43c0 too much to expect? |
| 15:37:49 | flaviu | I get the feeling it might be, but I can't think of another way to do what I want. |
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| 15:44:09 | keyle | night |
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| 15:45:03 | Varriount | flaviu: Doesn't #1693 cause ambiguity issues? |
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| 15:45:15 | Araq | flaviu: at which point will you use the language instead of fighting it all the time? |
| 15:45:24 | Varriount | ^ |
| 15:49:23 | flaviu | Varriount: How would it cause ambiguity issues? |
| 15:50:09 | flaviu | Araq: What's the point of a language if you can't abuse it to do crazy stuff? |
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| 15:59:51 | flaviu | Looks like it's already been reported: https://github.com/Araq/Nim/issues/1070 |
| 16:01:17 | EXetoC | it is of course nice to have a community that takes a more practical approach, but some people just can't help but abstracting as much as possible :p |
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| 16:03:19 | flaviu | EXetoC: I'm not abstracting as much as possible, I'm just trying to keep things DRY for the user. |
| 16:05:14 | EXetoC | fair enough. just gotta be patient then |
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| 16:15:29 | novist | hey i see semicolons used to separate params in proc definition. do they have any special meaning or are they same as comma? |
| 16:15:40 | flaviu | novist: Exactly the same as comma |
| 16:15:49 | flaviu | dom96: http://forum.nimrod-lang.org/ doesn't redirect properly. |
| 16:15:51 | novist | awesome, ty |
| 16:16:13 | novist | flaviu that url works just fine. where it should redirect? |
| 16:16:27 | dom96 | flaviu: I am aware. No need to tell me twice. |
| 16:16:36 | dom96 | I'll fix it when I can. |
| 16:16:46 | flaviu | dom96: Ah, sorry, I thought you might have missed it in the logs. |
| 16:17:11 | flaviu | novist: It should go to forum.nim-lang.org |
| 16:17:29 | Araq | dom96: the forum's CSS is also broken. |
| 16:17:42 | flaviu | google might penalize the search ranking if it sees two sites with identical content. |
| 16:17:43 | novist | ohh i see. fact that forum worked threw me off a bit |
| 16:17:46 | dom96 | Araq: huh? |
| 16:17:51 | Araq | the spacing between paragraphs need to be much larger |
| 16:18:59 | novist | for site/forum you guys should use some css framework at least. no need to manually do everything. |
| 16:19:08 | dom96 | Araq: I don't have time to deal with CSS issues. |
| 16:19:21 | novist | bootstrap is easy and polished thing, could help ya build something good looking fast. and it would be maintainable too |
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| 16:19:49 | Araq | dom96: flaviu is busy with re-inventing haskell though :-/ |
| 16:19:51 | EXetoC | I prefer foundation, but both simplify writing responsive pages etc |
| 16:21:04 | dom96 | flaviu: fixed |
| 16:21:20 | dom96 | novist: But we already have something good looking :P |
| 16:21:41 | flaviu | dom96: It could use a lot more work. |
| 16:21:51 | novist | dom96 this might hurt your feelings but nim's forum is like from year 1999 |
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| 16:22:03 | novist | site looks bit better but still :p |
| 16:22:20 | EXetoC | well if someone ever makes it responsive |
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| 16:23:35 | novist | you know there is saying that first impression matters the most. i can totally see people not getting excited when they see something that looks bit like a hack. represents language badly |
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| 16:23:46 | dom96 | novist: You're welcome to improve it. |
| 16:24:08 | flaviu | dom96: The first step would be re-writing all the CSS and HTML, honestly. |
| 16:24:11 | dom96 | It looks better than the first version of the forum. |
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| 16:24:23 | novist | honestly - i have same thing to say for reinventing forum as for reinventing IDE - wasted work bros, pointless.. |
| 16:24:45 | dom96 | flaviu: Yeah. So do it. |
| 16:24:55 | Araq | yeah right, we get async production ready by not using it in production. |
| 16:25:03 | Araq | makes perfect sense |
| 16:25:04 | dom96 | It's annoying hearing "the forum looks like it's from the year 1999" when you don't even bother to make it look better. |
| 16:25:28 | Araq | the compiler should also have been written in Ocaml. |
| 16:25:31 | novist | Araq its valid point but still lots of wasted effort while currently available opensrc forums would work much better |
| 16:26:20 | onionhammer | so anyway... |
| 16:26:29 | dom96 | I guess all these libraries which I wrote for the forum to use were a waste of effort too then. |
| 16:26:37 | onionhammer | Araq, you mentioned caas the other day? :) |
| 16:27:21 | novist | nah dom96. at least some good came out of it ^_^ |
| 16:27:52 | EXetoC | I think it's a net positive |
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| 16:29:06 | EXetoC | and we have several other editor plugins for example. they all probably need some work, but it's something |
| 16:29:15 | flaviu | But the knee-jerk rejection of a CSS preprocessor isn't really good. |
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| 16:32:13 | EXetoC | that's more of a luxury compared to other things |
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| 16:46:58 | gokr1 | Araq: I think the issue with readAll on Windows only happened when blimp was used in a pipe-thing (by git). |
| 16:48:14 | gokr1 | Ehm... ah, perhaps that was the only time it used stdin. Wonder why it works for keyle. |
| 16:51:20 | gokr1 | dom96: I appreciate all your work :) |
| 16:52:36 | gokr1 | And even if I would love a mailinglist - I do understand that perhaps all of the networking code comes through your work. And that alone makes me LOVE the forum. ;) |
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| 17:04:19 | novist | dom96 do you maybe have a clean nim logo somewhere? |
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| 17:10:45 | flaviu | novist: http://a.pomf.se/rtjxkg.svg |
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| 17:11:16 | novist | thanks |
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| 17:17:34 | flaviu | I need to fix that bottom curve |
| 17:17:57 | flaviu | it's unbelievably irritating. |
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| 17:23:39 | flaviu | fixed: http://a.pomf.se/pcbxmo.svg |
| 17:23:41 | flaviu | novist: ^ |
| 17:24:39 | novist | even better, ty |
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| 17:52:34 | novist | hey.. we cant use macros in compiler code? |
| 17:55:18 | BlaXpirit | ? |
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| 17:57:09 | novist | for some reason i get undefined references when using macros |
| 17:57:30 | novist | main.c:(.text+0x1412): undefined reference to `parsestmt_305602' |
| 17:57:30 | novist | main.c:(.text+0x141c): undefined reference to `treerepr_305833' |
| 17:58:17 | BlaXpirit | when i used nim-after-0.10.2 (not sure if master or devel), it simply crashed while compiling some of my programs |
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| 18:02:43 | novist | ah i guess errors because macros stuff is market as compiletime |
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| 18:07:24 | flaviu | http://nim-lang.org/os.html#sleep,int sleeps for milisecs seconds |
| 18:07:29 | flaviu | on my system |
| 18:08:22 | def- | flaviu: what system is that? |
| 18:08:31 | flaviu | linux |
| 18:08:45 | def- | weird, works for me |
| 18:09:26 | def- | it uses posix.nanosleep |
| 18:09:31 | def- | looks totally fine to me |
| 18:11:17 | flaviu | def-: weird |
| 18:11:48 | def- | .eval import os; sleep(1000) |
| 18:11:50 | flaviu | def-: Oh, it's a problem with my program |
| 18:11:52 | Mimbus | def-: <no output> |
| 18:11:54 | flaviu | sorry. |
| 18:12:07 | flaviu | I put the sleep in the wrong loop. |
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| 18:19:17 | novist | lib/core/macros.nim(396, 15) Error: cannot generate code for 'kind' |
| 18:19:32 | novist | this is real bummer. it no longer works when i remove compiletime pragmas in macros module :| |
| 18:20:02 | novist | why on earth there have to be two different identical types, TNode in compiler and TNimrodNode in macros module |
| 18:20:41 | flaviu | Is there a way to get the data pointer out of a seq? |
| 18:21:41 | def- | flaviu: pointer to the actual elements? |
| 18:21:46 | flaviu | Yep |
| 18:21:49 | def- | maybe addr(mySeq[0]) |
| 18:22:02 | EXetoC | yep |
| 18:22:09 | flaviu | def-: Thanks! |
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| 19:01:47 | flaviu | nim web already outputs mostly-valid markdown, can it be made to output something suitable for github readmes? |
| 19:02:07 | flaviu | It already works pretty well with some manual modification: https://github.com/flaviut/optional_t/blob/master/readme.md |
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| 19:03:01 | MyMind | open arrays are can change length at run time ? |
| 19:03:36 | gokr1 | MyMind: seq can |
| 19:03:57 | gokr1 | openarray is just a special type you can use as parameter type (only) - matching both arrays and seqs |
| 19:04:14 | gokr1 | Such procs can then accept either an array (fixed size) or a seq (dynamic size) |
| 19:04:25 | gokr1 | For things you can do with a seq - check my article: |
| 19:04:43 | gokr1 | The top one: http://goran.krampe.se/category/nim/ |
| 19:08:03 | MyMind | ty gokr1 somehow wasn't clear enough for me at the doc |
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| 19:12:21 | MyMind | an equivalent to a python dictionary ? |
| 19:12:27 | def- | MyMind: tables |
| 19:14:17 | MyMind | any of them can mix types? |
| 19:16:51 | def- | no |
| 19:19:07 | flaviu | MyMind: You can hack around that by using json. |
| 19:19:22 | flaviu | store json nodes instead of whatever object you really want to store. |
| 19:19:37 | MyMind | kinda tricky |
| 19:19:45 | MyMind | :D |
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| 19:21:59 | MyMind | bad python habits I guess |
| 19:23:14 | wtw | fyi: I got the master branch to build under FreeBSD, very strange but apparently it was just a file caching issue |
| 19:24:27 | def- | wtw: interesting. have a way to reproduce? |
| 19:25:24 | wtw | I'm working on it, it was a messy series of updating to different branches, 'koch clean's and manually compiling steps that lead to it |
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| 19:28:28 | flaviu | For a regex library, should it be `captures[0].bounds`, `captures[0].substr`, or should it be `captureBounds[0]`, `captures[0]`? |
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| 19:41:51 | jpoirier | is a channel declared global, for threads to use, preferred over passing a channel ptr in as a parameter? |
| 19:45:36 | EXetoC | MyMind: object variants |
| 19:46:34 | MyMind | EXetoC: can you be more specific? |
| 19:52:52 | EXetoC | MyMind: look for it in the manual. they allow for run-time typing, but the valid types must be specified at compile-time |
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| 20:38:19 | MyMind | an array of void is possible? |
| 20:40:03 | flaviu | MyMind: That's meaningless |
| 20:40:07 | flaviu | void means no type. |
| 20:40:30 | MyMind | in C you can use to mix types and cast them later |
| 20:40:36 | flaviu | void* and void in C sound similar, but are unrelated. |
| 20:40:39 | MyMind | at runtime |
| 20:40:47 | MyMind | void* |
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| 20:40:59 | MyMind | iirc |
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| 20:41:25 | flaviu | MyMind: Yes, but think of it as `void*` and `void`, not `void` `*` |
| 20:41:45 | flaviu | You can sort of emulate it by creating an unchecked array T and casting. |
| 20:42:03 | flaviu | although you shouldn't store refs in it or you'll have GC problems. |
| 20:44:03 | MyMind | can you disable Gc? |
| 21:00:01 | onionhammer | MyMind yes |
| 21:00:13 | onionhammer | but you'll have trouble with the standard library |
| 21:00:30 | onionhammer | but you can use a custom std library |
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| 21:04:27 | MyMind | ty onionhammer |
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| 21:24:20 | gokr1 | MyMind: Note that GC is per thread. I am guessing you could have one thread doing "non GC" code only, thus not using the GC at all. |
| 21:24:31 | gokr1 | MyMind: Further, you can control the GC quite a lot. |
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| 21:51:27 | Araq | what should I do instead of 'git pull' again? ;-) |
| 21:51:45 | Araq | 'git fetch && git rebase' ? |
| 21:52:01 | gokr1 | fetch is always safe. |
| 21:52:22 | gokr1 | And rebase indeed often nice. |
| 21:52:40 | gokr1 | Reapplying your modifications on current head |
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| 22:00:05 | gokr1 | Regarding the Object type in Java (I am porting code from Java) - I kinda punted and used a generic for that, but now... I realize that perhaps I should make an object variant that catches a similarly broad net that Object in Java does. |
| 22:01:20 | gokr1 | So it could hold either a seq[T], a T or a string (and perhaps a few more). |
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| 22:07:28 | ekarlso- | so any volunteers for packages program ? :) |
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| 22:09:58 | renesac | ekarlso-: what? |
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| 22:12:10 | flaviu | Araq: or git pull --rebase. |
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| 22:13:25 | flaviu | If you want to update all the branches, I've also written https://gist.github.com/flaviut/c0ec97eb185bf212557f |
| 22:13:32 | flaviu | *nix only though |
| 22:13:50 | irrequietus | dom96: ;) |
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| 22:22:30 | Araq | "I wanted something like git up, but then realized that it would require me install a shit-ton of ruby dependencies. I can't be bothered to wait for that, so I wrote my own script that does something similar." |
| 22:22:55 | renesac | https://github.com/msiemens/PyGitUp <-- this python one may be good too |
| 22:23:02 | EXetoC | people and their deps |
| 22:23:03 | Araq | ah so when others have dependencies that's bad. but throwing away what we have for lots of deps is of course fine |
| 22:23:53 | flaviu | Araq: Depends. If something would take a lot of work to duplicate, then yes, I'll put up with dependencies. |
| 22:24:26 | flaviu | But if it's trivial to replicate, then I have no problem creating my own. |
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| 22:25:59 | flaviu | A CSS preprocessor seems like the most useful scapegoat here: It may look simple on the surface, but dig underneath and it's a lot less simple. |
| 22:26:28 | flaviu | you have to write all the builtins, parse and build an AST, do calculations. |
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| 22:27:28 | Araq | when I do it and the result is complex you blame me for it. when others do it, it's complex by its nature. you have developed a nice set of double standards. |
| 22:29:54 | flaviu | I'm against unnecessary complexity. |
| 22:30:48 | matkuki | Is partial case sensitivity in Nim here to stay? |
| 22:31:12 | flaviu | And if it does seem like I have double standards, it's mostly between software with lots of bugs and software with hardly any bugs. |
| 22:31:46 | EXetoC | matkuki: yes. what changed is this: Foo != foo |
| 22:32:11 | EXetoC | but foo = FoO (case-sensitivity for the first char only) |
| 22:32:54 | ekarlso- | renesac: renesac a'la crates.io for nim, |
| 22:33:04 | matkuki | EXetoC: Just making sure, because it messed up a few SDL2 modules |
| 22:35:14 | matkuki | EXetoC: What was the intention behind this? |
| 22:36:03 | flaviu | matkuki: so that we can get rid of the `T` and `P` prefixes |
| 22:36:29 | matkuki | flaviu: Can you give me an example? |
| 22:36:35 | ekarlso- | but I guess people are too busy -,,- |
| 22:37:33 | flaviu | matkuki: var foo: Foo |
| 22:38:00 | EXetoC | which someone claimed wasn't really a problem |
| 22:38:20 | matkuki | I mean an example in context of "P" and "T"? |
| 22:38:43 | flaviu | Well, var foo: TFoo would be valid |
| 22:39:03 | flaviu | but if T was removed and the first letter wasn't sensitive, then that would fail to compile. |
| 22:39:51 | Araq | git pull --rebase |
| 22:39:53 | Araq | Cannot pull with rebase: You have unstaged changes. |
| 22:39:54 | Araq | Please commit or stash them. |
| 22:40:04 | Araq | bah |
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| 22:40:50 | flaviu | so commit or stash them |
| 22:40:55 | flaviu | git stash |
| 22:40:59 | flaviu | git pull --rebase |
| 22:41:01 | flaviu | git stash apply |
| 22:42:02 | matkuki | Ok, why not go to full case sensitivity? |
| 22:42:35 | flaviu | matkuki: If some library author loves his underscore_identifiers, then you can still use underscoreIdentifiers |
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| 22:51:24 | matkuki | flaviu: Now that you pointed it out, why is Nim so stiff about underscores? |
| 22:51:26 | matkuki | BTW, I'm not bashing Nim, I just want to logic behind the decisions. |
| 22:52:07 | flaviu | matkuki: Araq might be a better person to ask |
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| 22:54:12 | Araq | matkuki: discussions about coding style take lots of resources which would be better spent on more important things |
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| 22:54:44 | Araq | so the idea was to make the compiler don't care so that the editor can render the AST however you want |
| 22:54:50 | gokr1 | Anyone here who have done "class hierarchies" in Nim - and ... if so, did you set up newXXX to call a specific initializeYYY proc in the superclass? |
| 22:55:07 | Araq | gokr1: that's what I've seen yes. |
| 22:55:17 | sillesta | hi, is eval(code) supported in nim? i noticed the compiler had an interactive mode, but couldn't find any info related to it |
| 22:55:43 | gokr1 | Kinda like in Smalltalk then, an inititalize method that starts by calling the initialize in super. |
| 22:55:44 | matkuki | Araq: Thanks. |
| 22:55:45 | flaviu | sillesta: Not without quite a bit of work, it hasn't been done yet. |
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| 22:56:38 | Araq | sillesta: I still have some code lying around that does that ... |
| 22:57:03 | gmpreussner | what is the convention for creating Nim bindings to external libraries - do you retain the original names of functions, types and constants, or do you adjust them to match the Nim coding style? |
| 22:57:44 | flaviu | gmpreussner: http://goran.krampe.se/2014/10/16/nim-wrapping-c/ |
| 22:58:00 | flaviu | seems the convention is to remove the prefix, but to leave them mostly as-is |
| 22:58:14 | Araq | gmpreussner: match the Nim coding style, c2nim supports --nep1 for that |
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| 22:58:26 | gmpreussner | cool thx |
| 22:58:39 | gokr1 | gmpreussner: Not sure if my article mentions it - but generally I think most wrappers are in two layers, one autogenerated - and then a "pure" lib on top that makes it Nimish. |
| 22:58:44 | gokr1 | Araq: Right? |
| 22:58:53 | EXetoC | keeping the names is a pain in the ass when writing high level interfaces |
| 22:59:00 | EXetoC | unless you want to keep ugly enum names and such |
| 22:59:31 | Araq | gokr1: mostly right. but for the big wrappers like GTK we don't have a higher layer |
| 22:59:48 | gmpreussner | id rather not have ugly names, but a counter argument would be that it better matches any documentation for the original libs. i don't know if that is important or not. |
| 22:59:50 | gokr1 | gmpreussner: If you sniff around in lib/pure and lib/wrappers I think you can see this pattern. |
| 23:00:18 | gokr1 | Since big wrappers are a pain to maintain a high level of I guess. |
| 23:00:27 | sillesta | flaviu: cool, is it a planned feature or is nim going to be strictly a compiled language? |
| 23:01:16 | wtw | is it possible in nim to write something like in haskell seq1.map( * 2), i.e. currying? |
| 23:01:16 | flaviu | sillesta: It's a planned feature, at least in some old conversations. But "<Araq> sillesta: I still have some code lying around that does that ..." |
| 23:01:46 | flaviu | sillesta: I may sound like I know what I'm doing, but Araq is the one who wrote most things :) |
| 23:01:56 | sillesta | okay, thanks :) |
| 23:01:57 | wtw | probably not, but to put it differently, do I always need to write proc(...) for a map or filter |
| 23:02:31 | gokr1 | wtw: There is some slick stuff in future.nim |
| 23:02:34 | gokr1 | lambdas |
| 23:02:51 | Araq | and I just fixed a showstopper bug for => ... :-) |
| 23:03:43 | gokr1 | Also... I wrote an article on seq showing adding some behaviors for it: http://goran.krampe.se/2014/12/03/nim-seq/ |
| 23:03:45 | wtw | ah, ok, googling :) |
| 23:03:52 | wtw | thx |
| 23:04:01 | gokr1 | It tries to show most of what you can do with seq at this time. |
| 23:04:10 | Araq | wtw: so 0.10.2 works out of the box on FreeBSD? |
| 23:04:28 | gokr1 | Funny enough I failed to check for "copy" of a seq - but hey - that's just assignment :) |
| 23:04:39 | wtw | well I'm not sure yet, but at least it's running :) |
| 23:05:02 | wtw | I found nim's features to interesting/compelling to dig further into the build problems :D |
| 23:05:36 | wtw | also I have to compile/link everything twice, the first run gives unresolved depedencies |
| 23:05:54 | wtw | I'll report tomorrow or so if I find the time |
| 23:05:55 | Araq | oh yeah use --parallelBuild:1 to get around that |
| 23:06:07 | Araq | there is something wrong with osproc on BSD |
| 23:06:21 | wtw | I see, ok |
| 23:06:22 | Araq | the compiler runs the C compiler in parallel and the linker afterwards |
| 23:06:42 | Araq | but on BSD it calls the linker too early |
| 23:06:45 | MyMind | Araq: how many threads use for build by default? |
| 23:07:16 | wtw | is this also for single files? probably yes as the stdlibs are also always included...? |
| 23:07:35 | Araq | MyMind: it checks how many CPUs you have |
| 23:07:57 | MyMind | nice feature :) |
| 23:08:12 | Araq | MyMind: but you can set --parallelBuild:8 to run 8 things in parallel |
| 23:08:39 | MyMind | is the equivalent to make -j8 right? |
| 23:09:16 | Araq | yup |
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| 23:13:09 | wtw | ah "future.nim" is not about futures (the language feature) but future features of the language :D |
| 23:13:21 | wtw | looks nice |
| 23:13:30 | Araq | yeah we copied that from python for |
| 23:13:37 | Araq | from future import `=>` |
| 23:16:39 | wtw | ah, the lambda syntax is working, nice |
| 23:16:50 | gmpreussner | is c2nim compilable @ master? i'm getting errors :/ |
| 23:17:01 | Araq | gmpreussner no sorry, only with devel |
| 23:17:20 | Araq | wtw: don't push it too hard ;-) |
| 23:17:31 | wtw | ;) |
| 23:17:40 | gmpreussner | Araq: i don't see a devel branch. is this in https://github.com/nim-lang/c2nim ? |
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| 23:18:23 | Araq | gmpreussner read this please: http://forum.nim-lang.org/t/738 |
| 23:19:39 | gmpreussner | yikes ok |
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| 23:21:03 | ekarlso- | Araq: you got a preference on GET /packages should return all the releases pr package as well ? |
| 23:21:27 | ekarlso- | or anyone else.. |
| 23:22:18 | gmpreussner | Araq: the requirements for working with c2nim aside, shouldn't i still be able to compile c2nim itself with the devel nim compiler? |
| 23:22:41 | gmpreussner | i guess i haven't synced in a few days. that may be why |
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| 23:23:14 | wtw | Araq: just tried a fresh build for master, it's working now under freebsd 10.1. The only thing I would change is in build.sh 'cc' instead of 'gcc' as 'cc' will point to the system's default compiler. |
| 23:24:03 | wtw | this is all with default clang 3.4 btw |
| 23:24:04 | Araq | wtw: no that's stupid, we do the testing with GCC. |
| 23:24:27 | wtw | but cc should be gcc if nothing else is installed? |
| 23:25:12 | Araq | so check if gcc is available and if not use 'cc' with a warning perhaps |
| 23:25:20 | ekarlso- | Araq: +1 btw for slapping me to read the tutorial |
| 23:25:59 | Araq | gmpreussner I built it with devel myself yesterday |
| 23:26:09 | Araq | but my devel was not up to date ... ;-) |
| 23:27:38 | def- | Araq: what's missing to do testing with clang? |
| 23:29:23 | Araq | def-: we need a testing machine that uses clang instead of gcc |
| 23:29:48 | Araq | and ... I don't know ... let's see ... perhaps test results that I can look over |
| 23:30:25 | Araq | but Varriount is working on that (...right?!) |
| 23:30:52 | wtw | just checked, 'cc' works fine on all of my Linux machines with only gcc installed |
| 23:31:15 | Araq | wtw: that's not the point |
| 23:31:16 | def- | wtw: we're worried that there may be bugs with clang |
| 23:31:27 | wtw | ah I see ;) |
| 23:31:28 | def- | because only gcc is tested regularly |
| 23:31:48 | wtw | yep, got it |
| 23:32:12 | flaviu | Araq: I can switch my arm buildbot to clang |
| 23:32:32 | Araq | flaviu: that would help if somebody would look at the test results |
| 23:32:33 | def- | because clang builds a lot faster and all programs i tested in nim were faster with clang |
| 23:33:00 | wtw | same here |
| 23:33:02 | def- | I find clang interesting because* |
| 23:33:46 | wtw | although that's strange since usually clang is like 10% slower, at least for my benchmarks |
| 23:34:05 | wtw | (meaning compile time as well as runtime) |
| 23:34:09 | * | Araq doesn't like the 'cc' environment variable |
| 23:34:25 | wtw | ;D |
| 23:34:32 | flaviu | please start liking $CC |
| 23:34:43 | flaviu | I don't want to have to symlink clang to gcc |
| 23:34:48 | flaviu | err, gcc to clang |
| 23:35:35 | Araq | flaviu: you can set cc in your nim config |
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| 23:36:09 | flaviu | I've still been unable to figure out how to do that. |
| 23:36:24 | def- | flaviu: cc = clang |
| 23:36:29 | def- | instead of cc = gcc |
| 23:37:05 | flaviu | Ok, thanks! |
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| 23:37:36 | flaviu | I suppose I just read over that without reading when I looked in there. |
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| 23:40:55 | Araq | flaviu: apparently you also never read our FAQ :P |
| 23:41:13 | flaviu | I read nimc.html |
| 23:41:37 | flaviu | I found the FAQ! |
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| 23:49:52 | gmpreussner | Araq: compiled fine now with both c2nim and nim @ head |
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