<<10-07-2012>>
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06:11:51SchalaZealwell I did a pull request on PCRE updates
06:12:00SchalaZealsupports JIT now
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17:21:13dom96hello
17:27:05fowlmorning
17:27:22dom96Where do you live!?
17:27:28dom96It's 6pm here
17:28:14fowlnoon here
17:28:43fowl(Usa)
17:29:11dom96I see.
17:29:16dom96UK here
17:30:55dom96Rate of new issue being submitted on the Nimrod issue tracker is rising.
17:30:58dom96*issues
17:31:04dom965 today already :O
17:33:09dom96Araq: Is it just me or are most of these related to the fact that your new changes usually break examples/some of the stlib?
17:33:19dom96Looks like we really do need to start branching.
17:33:43fowlgit gets extra complicated when you start branching
17:34:27dom96How so?
17:36:47fowlyou have to know what rebasing is, hard resets, merging
17:36:50fowlit makes my head hurt
17:37:04fowlwhen i get to that point i usually recreate the repo >_>
17:37:10dom96As long as you know how to merge you should be able to survive I think :P
17:38:56fowli miss svn's linear revision numbers too, what does a8e82d8b tell you about a commit? nothing >:(
17:47:15Araqhey, people want other integer promotion rules
17:47:26Araqbut when they get them they moan it breaks stuff :P
17:48:00dom96Yes, the classic cycle of feature requests.
17:48:17Araqbut I think I am done now and the new rules work
17:48:25Araqand everything compiles again
17:48:38Araqwould be nice if the tester would run on windows though :P
17:49:27dom96Yeah... would be nice if I had more time D:
17:49:37dom96I'll probably be off on Thursday though
18:20:39dom96Araq: btw I have an idea. I'll plug in my usb stick and use that as the swap for my Pi :P
18:21:34AraqI'd prefer if you activated the windows tester instead
18:21:49Araqarm works, bootstrapping in release mode worked :p
18:21:49dom96... fine.
18:22:00dom96Yeah, but we don't know the test results ;)
18:24:24Araqwell test the threading on ARM too
18:24:41Araqbut apart from that the tests are likely not very interesting in the first place
18:24:58Araqbooho the regex test fails .... yeah, who cares ...
18:29:03Araqspeaking of which
18:29:20Araqnimbuild needs to improve the test results rendering
18:29:27AraqI don't want scroll that much
18:29:38Araqit should only show the tests that fail/are still ignored
18:30:07Araqobviously we don't care about green tests ... though I must admit that I spotted a bug there too once
18:32:02dom96hrm.
18:32:12dom96I don't have enough time D:
18:32:20Araqok np
18:32:40dom96I will do it.
18:32:47dom96It might take a while though :(
18:32:48Araqpriority is to port all your code to the new version ;-)
18:33:04Araqotherwise we'd have lots of broken code on github ...
18:33:07dom96But I want to change a few things on the nimbuild site anyway.
18:33:20Araqno need to hurry
18:33:36dom96I actually wish I had a free summer now.
18:33:46Araqthough I want to release 0.9.0 this summer ...
20:36:56dom96I really need to finish babel.
20:37:05dom96I want to be able to do `babel install jester` on my Pi :(
20:37:41Araqwell jester should compile with the latest compiler for that for a start :P
20:37:54Araqwhich I bet it doesn't
20:37:55dom96Damn. You broke everything didn't you?
20:37:59Araqyep.
20:38:21Araqbut nobody moaned yet
20:38:37AraqI could easily make it not break that much code :P
20:41:11dom96Lets see how hard it is to fix Aporia
20:43:50AraqI've been telling you that for *days* :P
20:44:26dom96yes, I know.
20:44:44dom96oh god.
20:44:59dom96Am I going to have to cast each int into an int32 because cint == int32?
20:46:21dom96I guess I should make the field type int32 in the first place
20:46:47dom96Araq: ^
20:47:10Araqwell yes
20:52:51dom96wait, if I was using 32bit would this just compile?
20:53:03Araqno
20:53:19dom96on 32 bit, int = int32, no?
20:53:24Araqthe compiler doesn't use the current CPU setting for type compatibility
20:53:44dom96Yeah, I figured. It would be weird.
20:53:48dom96How does it do it though>?
20:53:51Araqso sizeof(int) == sizeof(int32) on 32 bit, but they are still different types
20:54:00dom96ahh, right
20:54:13Araqyou simply get the same error messages on 32 bit ;-)
21:00:14dom96hrm, i guess cint has to always be int32 :(
21:00:34Araqunless it is int64 ... yes
21:00:39dom96And C libraries use cint everywhere ... so I have to cast everything to int32
21:00:51Araq'cint' is supposed to be 'C's int'
21:01:06Araqon some platforms it's 64bit though
21:01:22Araqbut on no platform that nimrod has yet been ported to
21:01:30dom96So er, what's the benefit of this change?
21:01:39dom96All I currently feel is irritation
21:02:04Araq'int' is 64bits on a 64bit cpu
21:02:17Araqso conversion to int32 loses information
21:02:30Araqand nimrod doesn't do that anymore implicitely
21:02:54Araqmost conversions to int32 are *bugs* ;-)
21:03:40Araqbut I agree it's annoying
21:04:40dom96Maybe this should be like the taint mode?
21:05:20Araqhow many lines of code is aporia?
21:05:41dom96Dunno, why?
21:06:02Araqwell it's interesting how many lines of code I broke :-)
21:06:25dom96Answer my question ^^
21:06:46Araqtaint-like mode is not a bad idea
21:08:17dom96I guess I would have to see how annoying this is when I am just coding.
21:08:30dom96Because obviously it's annoying when all you're doing is fixing this particular thing
21:10:23dom96If you know what I mean?
21:10:30Araqof course
21:10:46AraqI had to change 200K loc ;-)
21:11:50Araqand I'm suprised adrianv hasn't raged already
21:12:10Araqhe has some amount of nimrod code too I think
21:13:10dom96Well I must say. Nice job. Now Nimrod is even stricter on the types which is at least safer :P
21:13:46Araqpersonally I just love that the compiler is finally as smart as me with (x and 3) + 7
21:14:05dom96I doubt I will ever even use that feature :P
21:14:28Araqin fact, I plan to change 'random's interface so that the compiler sees the modulo operation :D
21:14:38Araqso that:
21:14:42Araqcase random(2)
21:14:47Araqof 0: ..
21:14:49Araqof 1: ...
21:14:52Araqcompiles :-)
21:15:36dom96cool
21:17:27dom96Something tells me that:
21:17:33dom96int32(s.parseInt())
21:17:35dom96is quite unsafe
21:18:41dom96What happens if the number does not fit in an int32?
21:19:05Araqexception in debug mode
21:19:18Araqstrange things in release mode
21:19:28Araqand yeah it's indeed quite unsafe
21:19:42Araquse parseutils.parseInt with an explicit range
21:20:00dom96meh, it should be alright
21:20:11Araqconfig file reading?
21:21:13dom96yeah
21:21:30dom96Oh look: Error: internal error: analysis not implemented for: nkForStmt
21:21:45Araqargh
21:21:52Araqwtf
21:22:03Araqthat's new, right?
21:22:13dom96That's when I did nimrod check aporia.nim
21:22:23Araqbut it compiles?
21:23:40dom96Not yet...
21:23:45dom96I'm still fixing the int issues
21:23:55dom96I just thought I might as well get all the errors
21:24:04dom96Instead of recompiling each time
21:24:13Araqwell turn thread analysis off
21:24:21Araqthen 'check' should work
21:24:47Araqbut yeah that's a bug, but I know the cause already
21:24:51Araq --threadanalysis:off
21:30:27dom96mmm. You should switch off thread analysis when doing `check` :)
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21:32:18Araqno, I should fix the bug instead
21:32:20Araqit isn't as trivial as I thought though
21:32:22Araq:-/
21:34:10Araqoh btw
21:34:33AraqI finally implemented inheritance depth checking for overload resolution
21:35:01Araqthis means you don't need to convert to a subtype in GTK as often
21:35:17dom96Brilliant.
21:35:32dom96How come you're implementing so much stuff when I have so little time to test it?
21:36:02Araqperhaps it's because I get distracted less as you have no time to talk with me :P
21:37:43dom96I should really implement being able to run `check` in aporia.
21:37:53dom96^^ haha
21:38:11dom96That is true.
21:38:41Araqwhat about:
21:38:43Araqdeprecate ``var x, y = 0`` as it's confusing for tuple consistency
21:38:48Araqit's in my todo?
21:38:53Araqfine with you?
21:39:23Araqwell especially 'var x, y = (0, 0)' is weird
21:39:36Araqas both x and y then are the tuple (0,0)
21:39:45Araqnewcomers stumbled upon this ...
21:40:02dom96No tuple unpacking then?
21:40:06dom96I think I use this feature a lot.
21:40:31Araq'var (x, y) = (0, 0)' is fine and will remain untouched
21:40:36dom96ahh.
21:40:39dom96That's fine then.
21:41:08dom96Also this would be cool: `var z@(x, y) = (0, 0)`
21:41:18dom96z is the whole tuple :P
21:41:22dom96Something like that.
21:41:31Araqpointless and arbitrary :P
21:41:39dom96I guess :P
21:41:44Araqbetter implement real pattern matching instead :P
21:41:51dom96yep!
21:42:01Araqbut it can be easily done with a macro :-)
21:42:15Araqand the compiler itself wouldn't benefit much from it
21:42:38Araqas an AST node uses a variable number of children
21:43:00Araqso it's very low priority for me
21:44:41dom96There :P
21:44:56Araqthe effort seems to be reasonable
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22:09:36Araqhi KarmaScript
22:09:43KarmaScriptHello world
22:10:01dom96hello KarmaScript
22:10:11KarmaScriptHi dudes
22:12:32KarmaScriptWhat a brave language!
22:13:30Araqwhy 'brave'?
22:14:17KarmaScriptJust kidding
22:15:10KarmaScriptI don't know anything about programming, but I would spreed the word
22:17:36Araqwhich word?
22:17:46Araqsorry btw my connection today is really *bad*
22:19:23Araqso KarmaScript, if you don't know anything about programming, how did you find the way to here?
22:20:18*pinchila joined #nimrod
22:20:36KarmaScriptBy pure chance
22:20:58dom96and who might this be?
22:21:09Araqhi pinchila, welcome to nimrod
22:21:55KarmaScriptThe first time that I was in Freenode, I did try some random #words
22:22:20Araqha I do that too
22:22:28Araqbut no luck, no porn channel ...
22:22:30KarmaScript(Sorry about my EN)
22:22:39Araq(just kidding)
22:23:07KarmaScript:D
22:23:54KarmaScriptI just wanted to know if this Chan was still available
22:24:17Araqhey it's more alive than ever
22:24:41KarmaScriptThat's all, I don't want to trolling
22:24:57Araqah so you dislike nimrod? :-)
22:26:34dom96KarmaScript: Where are you from?
22:27:15KarmaScriptArgentina
22:27:25KarmaScriptMy Ip is visible
22:27:36dom96ahh, yeah. Can't tell much from an IP address.
22:28:07dom96Anyway, I should be heading to bed.
22:28:09dom96Good night
22:32:47pinchilahai
22:32:50pinchilaumm
22:33:07Araqhi pinchila
22:33:10pinchilathis programming language is web or app
22:33:25Araqmostly app
22:33:32Araqcan be used for web too though
22:33:51pinchilalike java?
22:33:52Araqand you can even translate a subset of it to JS
22:34:16Araqwell it translates to C
22:34:24dom96pinchila: I made a sinatra-like framework for it, which you can use to write server-side stuff in.
22:34:24Araqso no VM involved
22:34:48pinchilawhat have this laguage
22:34:56pinchilasomething "special"?
22:35:41Araq*cough* IMHO it's "D done right" ;-)
22:36:22Araqwe use it for everything; scripting, web apps, GTK apps
22:36:26Araqgames
22:36:41Araqand you can also write an OS in it
22:36:51pinchilaseriously, is another language in the web
22:37:00Araqor program your AVR microcontroller
22:37:08pinchilaC > nimrod
22:37:18Araqhow so?
22:37:34Araqthere is not a single thing that Nimrod does worse than C ...
22:38:05Araqwhich isn't hard as C is not a very good programming language to begin with ...
22:38:18pinchilayes there is
22:38:29Araqand that would be?
22:39:06pinchilaC have a lot of support
22:39:26pinchilanimrod have no famous
22:40:01dom96I think you are forgetting though: Nimrod compiles to C.
22:40:09Araq*shrug* just write your scripts in C then ... oh
22:40:15Araqsomehow nobody does that?
22:40:22Araqstrange ...
22:40:39Araqsupport is no inherent language quality
22:40:49pinchila>Nimrod compiles to C
22:41:04Araqand C compiles to assembler
22:41:11Araqassembler is much better obviously
22:41:42pinchilaare you saying nimod is a software to compile code?
22:41:45pinchilalike
22:42:02AraqNimrod is a programming language
22:42:02pinchilamonodevelop'
22:42:14dom96I was referring to the Nimrod compiler.
22:42:15Araqand one that is still in heavy development
22:42:31Araqand yet it's way more useful than C already
22:42:34dom96The Nimrod compiler compiles Nimrod code to C.
22:42:47Araqdepending on what your needs are obviously
22:43:11dom96Which means you can obviously use every C library in existence.
22:43:23dom96From Nimrod.
22:43:32dom96Very easily :P
22:43:46pinchilameh
22:44:05pinchilathe libraries can be finded in the web
22:44:36pinchilayu can't find easily support on internet
22:44:39*Trix[a]r_za is now known as Trixar_za
22:45:24pinchila>support is no inherent language quality
22:45:39pinchilayea?
22:45:45pinchilaoh really?
22:46:09pinchilawhen soomething is pretty good have support from they users
22:46:35pinchilalook the P2P programs
22:46:44pinchilalook the GNU
22:46:58dom96pinchila: What OS do you use?
22:47:00Trixar_zalol
22:47:07Trixar_zaGNU? Good? lol
22:47:23pinchilai use fedora
22:47:37dom96haha
22:47:54Trixar_zaSpeaking of GNU, I find most people don't get the GPL
22:48:06dom96Well, Windows has a lot more users than Linux.
22:48:12dom96That doesn't make Windows good.
22:48:20Trixar_zaJust familiar
22:48:55pinchilawindows is mostly used in pirated versions
22:48:58Trixar_zaThere is actually a nice article on it
22:49:53dom96Meh. Well I actually do need to sleep.
22:49:54Trixar_zahttp://linux.oneandoneis2.org/LNW.htm
22:50:00Trixar_zaBest article ever written on the topic
22:50:50Trixar_zaIt explains what User-friendly really means, which is basically familiarity and not simplicity as some believe
22:50:51dom96pinchila: If you're going to miss out on a great language just because it's not popular (yet) then you are going to make a big mistake :P
22:51:21pinchilado96: you are wrng, i never say that
22:51:34pinchilai am talking about support
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22:52:06Trixar_zaWell, I'm pretty sure Python and Perl only had like 2 people that knew it when it started out.
22:52:29dom96"Support" is basically the community.
22:52:31Trixar_zaPython's support still sucks, but Perl has grown to be pretty nice
22:52:37dom96i.e. how popular the language is.
22:52:45dom96But anyways. Good night for real.
22:52:51Trixar_zaNight dom96
22:52:58AraqSchalaZeal: have you actually tested the pull request?
22:53:33AraqI fear it'll break code :P
22:53:55Trixar_zaLike you're changes doesn't do that sometimes ^^
22:53:59Trixar_zayour*
22:54:01*Trixar_za hides
22:54:15AraqTrixar_za: hey I do it on purpose
22:54:36pinchilapython is ore simply than nimrod
22:55:03Trixar_zaSpeaking from a Python coder, Nimrod's syntax is easier
22:55:10Trixar_zaas a*
22:56:21Trixar_zaOh and we have case statements. Python 2.x doesn't. And have you SEEN Python 3's syntax? Omg.
22:56:57*Trixar_za rubs his % for string insertions
22:57:08Trixar_zaMy precious...
22:57:50pinchilait's easy
22:59:06Trixar_zaIt's annoyingly complicated. Yes, the new insertion method is WAY more flexible, but it adds an unneeded level of complexity to the language. So you can now arrange the variables like you want and have the insertion place them correctly. Doesn't really add to the readability of it.
22:59:50Trixar_zaAnyway, a binary still runs faster than any scripting language could
23:01:09*pinchila quit (Quit: Ex-Chat)
23:01:38Trixar_zalol
23:01:56Trixar_zaI didn't even get to talk about inheritance
23:02:23Araqfirst troll here
23:02:27Araqa good sign :-)
23:08:10ccssnettroll! where?
23:08:56*ccssnet reads backlog
23:09:16ccssnetTrixar_za: yea your right, most people dont understand the GPL's at all
23:10:25Trixar_zaI think most people get stuck at the "You can sell it" part
23:10:43ccssnetyea, you can actually sell it if you read the damn license :)
23:11:17Trixar_zaOnly two things that are required are "Credit where credit is due", "Include this license with the original and changed code" and "Provide source code at request"
23:11:23Trixar_zaOk, so it's three things
23:11:23Trixar_za:P
23:11:32ccssnetwell i met a linux geek today
23:11:51ccssnethis car broke down and he pulled in my drive way. i was wearing my libreplanet tshirt
23:12:30ccssnetsaid he works at green host
23:12:34Araqgood night guys
23:12:35ccssnetlooking them up now
23:12:39ccssnetttyl Araq
23:12:43Trixar_zaNight Araq
23:13:32ccssnetor maybe it was greengeeks?
23:13:35ccssnetnot sure
23:13:40Trixar_zalol
23:14:17SchalaZealoopsy
23:14:24SchalaZealI zoned out
23:17:02ccssnetspeaking of zoning out
23:17:09*ccssnet lights a fat joint
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