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| 18:36:00 | Araq | hi ekselkiu |
| 18:36:09 | ekselkiu | Hello Araq |
| 18:36:34 | Araq | I came to the conclusion that abstract interpretation is too hard :-/ |
| 18:36:43 | ekselkiu | lol |
| 18:37:16 | ekselkiu | Thing is, if you're using it for correctness (like a type system), it needs to be intuitive for the programmer. |
| 18:37:38 | Araq | perhaps ;-) |
| 18:37:55 | Araq | however, tooling can patch over anything |
| 18:38:11 | Araq | C# taught me that a language's complexity does not matter |
| 18:38:19 | ekselkiu | Uhuhuh. |
| 18:38:26 | Araq | as long as the tooling is good and it stays memory safe :P |
| 18:39:16 | ekselkiu | If the type checking is all heuristic, and even if it produces nice error messages, the programmer still needs to understand what the compiler accepts and what it doesn't, in order to correct a problem. |
| 18:39:21 | ekselkiu | Otherwise it's just guessing. |
| 18:39:37 | ekselkiu | Which is very frustrating. (Why yes, I have used ATS. How did you know? :P) |
| 18:40:08 | Araq | I wasn't really serious ;-) |
| 18:42:09 | Araq | I haven't used ATS. Does that happen often? |
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| 18:44:11 | Araq | I remember someone saying that strings in ATS suck as you need to prove index out of bounds can't happen |
| 18:44:15 | Araq | or something like that |
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| 19:07:39 | ekselkiu | No. Strings suck in ATS because there are three different types of them. String literals are of type "string", and most functions in atslib take "string", but type "string" is not linear, which means a lot of the functions in atslib are unsafe if you're not using the garbage collector. |
| 19:08:31 | ekselkiu | The linear string type and string container type are better, but few functions use them. |
| 19:09:37 | ekselkiu | But I think that can be solved with better library design. |
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| 22:04:27 | Araq | so how will annotate the stdlib with the new tags? |
| 22:05:03 | Araq | *who |
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| 23:07:39 | reactormonk | Araq, no "easy contributions" part in the wiki |
| 23:07:56 | Araq | reactormonk: what do you mean? |
| 23:08:20 | reactormonk | Araq, is it an easy job? |
| 23:09:30 | Araq | except for FTime I think so |
| 23:10:24 | Araq | proc readLine(...) {.tags: FReadIO.} # simple, hu? |
| 23:11:36 | reactormonk | no propagation frrom the primitives here? |
| 23:12:13 | Araq | indeed there is propagation |
| 23:12:31 | Araq | readLine is a primitive though |
| 23:12:36 | Araq | well ok, not really ;-) |
| 23:13:38 | reactormonk | I remember that code :-P |
| 23:14:45 | Araq | changing the nick is evil :P |
| 23:15:29 | reactormonk | >:) |
| 23:18:13 | reactormonk | Araq, well, can't you go and grep for importc stuff |
| 23:18:40 | Araq | sure I can |
| 23:19:06 | Araq | and I guess it'll be faster than moaning about someone else's work |
| 23:19:39 | reactormonk | how about renaming that to `import` btw? |
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| 23:20:18 | Araq | used to cause problems as 'import' as a keyword |
| 23:20:28 | Araq | but should be possible now |
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| 23:31:05 | Araq | I have to sleep now, good night |