<< 13-01-2018 >>
00:03:05GitDisc<treeform> I think people hate GC, but they should be hating pointers everywhere and no stack allocations in their languages instead. People seem to have completely forgot how to use profilers to find slow paths in their code, and just blame GC over and over.
00:14:43FromGitter<RedBeard0531> Also there is a conflation of stack vs heap allocation with embedding vs pointing. I often want type A to embed an instance of type B even when neither of them will technically be "stack allocated"
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02:24:59FromGitter<nitely> It seems github uses https://github.com/Varriount/NimLime for highlightning Nim code
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03:01:46FromGitter<data-man> @nitely: Yes
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04:31:34FromGitter<nitely> ok, just issued a PR for basic multiline docs support
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06:47:14FromGitter<Varriount> @nitely Merged.
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07:45:01FromGitter<alehander42> @dom96 I think the gray ones are the best too
07:45:48FromGitter<alehander42> @cabhishek yeah, I had the side by side comparison idea too, will probably do it on Monday
07:46:46FromGitter<alehander42> ah, I thought of showing examples that way, having an online playground would be also cool, but not a priority right now
07:52:45FromGitter<alehander42> we will publish some kind of blog article too probably, when it becomes a little bit more mature
07:54:16FromGitter<alehander42> @RedBeard0531 yeah, I've used them for similar purposes, but I preferred something more Nim-aware in this case
07:56:48FromGitter<alehander42> ok, now fmt is expanded to `%`, and if I can't use it instead of `%` when I import e.g. json
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08:01:18FromGitter<alehander42> even the example from the docstring which says "no conflicts", and if I define `%` with fmt instead, everything works fine
08:01:33FromGitter<alehander42> is it possible that I have some kind of local problem somehow? or is that the case
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08:14:25FromGitter<Varriount> I still think fmt is better than some symbol
08:18:16miranwe now have an option to use both fmt and %, no?
08:20:11FromGitter<data-man> Yes, both
08:23:41AraqI think my template misses a 'bind' statement
08:25:23FromGitter<alehander42> bind fixes it indeed
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08:44:56FromGitter<data-man> @Araq: Do you have a SourceForge account?
08:45:12Araqmaybe, why?
08:46:18FromGitter<data-man> https://github.com/rizonesoft/Notepad3/issues/284#issuecomment-357418425
08:47:23FromGitter<data-man> Nimrod should be renamed to Nim in Scintilla.
08:47:51FromGitter<data-man> And in SciTE.
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09:17:12FromGitter<Yardanico> @data-man maybe he can answer in github issue?
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09:24:08FromGitter<data-man> @Yardanico: Main repo is hosted on SF.
09:24:14Yardanicooh
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09:26:59FromGitter<data-man> @Yardanico: https://github.com/search?q=Neil+Hodgson&type=Users :-)
09:27:23FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> I have forked the Nim repo. Going to have a look at some of the issues next week.
09:28:14Yardanicodata-man ?
09:28:46miranervin: thumbs up!
09:29:25FromGitter<alehander42> @miran I added some basic examples to the py2nim README, thanks for the reminding us yesterday
09:29:40miranwill take a look immediately :)
09:30:30Yardanicoalehander42: about fmt - you don't need to remove it with "import strformat except %"
09:30:49Yardanicoyou can still use it (but you can't use `%` from strformat if you use this import)
09:31:48miranalehander42: examples look very nice!! (in a sense that your tools does a nice job)
09:33:22Yardanicoalehander42: also maybe in the future you can move all py2nim files in py2nim directory (it would look better on github and also maybe you will installation from nimble (of course user will still need to have python3 installed) :P)
09:33:34Yardanico*will add possibility of
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09:34:13FromGitter<data-man> @Yardanico: Neil Hodgson - the author of Scintilla & SciTE.
09:34:22Yardanicodata-man: but why I need him? :)
09:37:46FromGitter<data-man> How should I know. :-)
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09:41:00FromGitter<alehander42> @miran thank you, but keep in mind a lot of basic cases might still malfunction, I hope we'll have some time to improve them next week
09:41:36miranit is a nice start nonetheless
09:42:27FromGitter<alehander42> @Yardanico when it gets ready for use, we'll surely make a nimble package, good note about the dir structure
09:44:53Yardanicoalehander42:https://github.com/metacraft-labs/py2nim/issues/12#issuecomment-357418860
09:45:45FromGitter<alehander42> @Yardanico I commented eariler here, that this seems broken currently for me
09:46:13FromGitter<alehander42> Araq said he needs to add `bind` in the fmt template
09:46:55FromGitter<alehander42> is the fmt docstring example working for you with devel?
09:48:27Araqpushed
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09:53:13FromGitter<alehander42> awesome, thanks
09:58:04FromGitter<alehander42> ok, fmt usage fixed in my case too, using `%` from now on in other cases < 3
10:00:13mirananyone here has some experience with go? a guy on reddit would like to hear comparison between nim and go
10:00:35Yardaniconim has generics! :D
10:00:42FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> my nimble opinion is that that should go away
10:01:28Yardanicowhat should go away?
10:01:28FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> go is a very limited language which dumbs you down. Nim is cool with freedom and speed
10:01:35FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> I was just kidding
10:01:46FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> its a play with words GO away
10:02:13FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> https://github.com/kostya/benchmarks
10:02:18FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> speed comparisons
10:02:33FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> nim is faster
10:03:06FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> https://www.slant.co/versus/126/395/~golang_vs_nim
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10:03:38Yardanicowell it is
10:03:46FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> The only reason why Go is popular because of Google standing behind it with a massive marketing budget
10:04:04Yardanicoyeah, rust wasn't very popular too until mozilla picked it up :)
10:04:08FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> I hate go, tried it been there and its as bad as it can
10:04:28FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> For example error handling in Go is a massive pain
10:05:09FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> And depends on your taste but Go doesnt have exceptions
10:06:38FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> I am planning to sneak in Nim into apple stack. Basically we are developing an app in swift 4 (Osx and iOS) the cross platform layer is in c, c++ and rust
10:07:03FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> I am about to migrate some of the c stuff to Nim, once published we can say that Nim is there
10:07:20Araqyou're using too many different languages :P
10:07:43FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Time constraint, lack of resources available libraries
10:07:45FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> I agree
10:08:20FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Long term plan is to consolidate everything under 1 language, Nim as it compiles to C, C++ and Objective-C
10:08:34Araqit's the "programming language is a tool" falicy. :-)
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10:09:20FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> as I have explained earlier I know of the problem and I was about to write our own set of tools when I have found Nim which s 99% what I wanted to get rid of the languages
10:10:00Araqit's not a tool, it's a building material.
10:10:12FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> I know that
10:10:28Araqyeah sorry, I didn't mean to lecture you.
10:10:37FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> I said I wanted to write our own tool when I got here, I didnt say Nim is a tool
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10:11:02AraqI'm trying to get the wrong ideas out of #nim, not out of you.
10:11:05FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Nim is a platform I would say
10:11:16FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> anyway
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10:11:47FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> I still have lack of time, it will take us 6+ months to get where we want to be, teh transition is gradual
10:12:27FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Also want to help with the compiler, and while we/I are using it will find out where to focus with the help to help you help us etc
10:12:48FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> I know what Nim is
10:13:04FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Nim is freedom of thught
10:13:13FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Which ismy philoso
10:13:57FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Sorry need to get back to coding, speak ater
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10:15:11FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> @araq what is the ETA for Nim 2.0 approx?
10:15:52Yardanico:P
10:15:54FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> @araq we are cool, I am not easily offended and or let be lectured :D don’t worry
10:16:46Araqfyi lecturing me is the best way to offend me.
10:16:59FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> haha
10:17:21AraqETA? uh, we're after the Duke Nukem forever experience here.
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10:17:41FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> ok
10:17:45YardanicoAraq, just curious - did you develop any programming languages except nim(rod) ?
10:17:49Araqeventually we produce something underwhelming.
10:18:08FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> I need to get back to code, speak later.
10:20:43AraqYardanico: no, only DSLs and preprocessors to work around the limitations of the programming languages I happened to use at that time
10:21:20Yardanicook, thanks
10:22:15FromGitter<data-man> But DSL is language :-)
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10:22:39Yardanicoprogramming language? :)
10:23:10FromGitter<data-man> ok, thanks :-)
10:25:01FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Nim is the coolest programming language around IMHO. Fast with fast learning curve.
10:25:15livcddid you want to code already ? :)
10:25:54FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Yeah just keep comng back here, couldnt stop throw stuff here :D I am off, need to write some Nim :D
10:28:42FromGitter<data-man> @Yardanico: True color in a terminal is so wonderful, isn't it? ;-)
10:28:52Yardanicoit is, but I don't use Konsole :)
10:29:19yglukhovAraq: `%` in strfmt has already been noticed: https://github.com/metacraft-labs/py2nim/issues/12 ;)
10:31:22livcdit's interesting to see the usage of programming languages based on countries...too bad (or good?) that behemoths like java/csharp/js are used almost everywhere proportionally
10:31:58FromGitter<data-man> @Yardanico: I using the GNOME terminal.
10:32:03Yardanicoah, I use it too
10:32:18FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> @livcd what is your observati
10:33:54livcdmy observation is that if you want to have your avg corporate/startup job anywhere in the world you go with java/C#/js but if you want to use profesionally eg Ruby in Korea it's going to be tough
10:34:07livcdbut then again programmers in Korea are treated like bricklayers
10:35:50FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Well possibly I am not a fan of either of those languages. But I think its more of the “What problem do you want to solve” rather than “what language you want to use"
10:36:35FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> I am more like a Python/C guy most of the time, but as we all know its hard to run python on iOS (possible to wrap it up though, but its not natural)
10:37:50FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> For example in my case we try to be cross platform while keeping stuff native and Nim can help with that as with one language we can taget Objective-C or C or C++ or JS
10:38:30FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Kotlin would be the other choice btw
10:39:20FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> But because of its Java origin I am staying away
10:44:12livcdwell in most cases you gotta use what your team uses unless you can persuade them to try something else. At the end of the day it's not the building blocks that matter but the final product that does
10:44:59FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> yes, in my case we use what I say we use :D joking but close.
10:45:14FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> its more about delivery and timelines yes
10:45:23FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> and spec
10:51:50FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Sorry but I disagree with you here building block do matter, or after a certain time you will have a giant headache of maintaining stuff , quality issues and a billion of other things that can hit the fan real fast
10:52:16Yardanicoso you'll need to do a full rewrite :P
10:52:34FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> yeah
10:53:30livcdpeople rewrite stuff because of your next shiny new js framework appeared to solve the 0.001% wart you had with the previous solution
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10:53:45FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> well we avoid that crap
10:54:16FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> rewrite if imporvement makes sense, reduced dev time, reduced memory footpring, faster runtime and so on
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10:55:06FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> you know those 2 lorries on the 2 lane highway taking over each other 1 is at 70 mph and the other is 70.0001 mph???
10:55:28FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> same nonsense
10:56:40Yardanicodom96, so you'll be streaming today? :)
10:57:17livcdwow is he ?
10:57:40Yardanicowell he asked me yesterday to enable twitchrelay (irc-twitch bridge) because he will be streaming today
11:01:55livcdahh i was thinking the other day that i would love to see flappy bird in nim...using nimx and rod ? :D
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11:16:28Yardanicobtw, about go: just look a this switch/case statement: https://github.com/42wim/matterbridge/blob/265457b45171dcae96a1aac9454e3bda2cd0557a/bridge/irc/helper.go#L41
11:16:45Yardanicoapparently you can't match for multiple values in one `case` :)
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11:19:55FromGitter<alehander42> nope currently you can
11:19:59FromGitter<alehander42> it might be old code
11:20:10Yardanicoah, ok :)
11:22:28livcdyup you can
11:22:54Yardanicoyeah, apparently it was written 2 years ago
11:23:58livcdthough i cant seem to digest Go's channels...or i am dumb af. I shot myself in the foot too many times not closing the channels properly
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11:46:59Yardanicoalehander42: I found a little problem with python-deduckt: if python project uses unittest in tests you can't trace it because it exits with "SystemExit" exception in "interpreter" mode
11:47:21Yardanicoalehander42: https://gist.github.com/Yardanico/6b6aa6191614d9e155e46df5a70e3f06
11:49:06Yardanicoalehander42: https://stackoverflow.com/questions/9202772/tests-succeed-still-get-traceback
11:49:47Yardanicoit's easy to fix it though, just change unittest.main() to unittest.main(exit=true)
11:51:43FromGitter<alehander42> ha, interesting, the only problem is actually that the exit code is not zero, so py2nim assumes something's wrong with python-deduckt, the trace actually should have already happened
11:52:16Yardanicoalso it seems that py2nim forgets to add space after "not" in generated Nim code :)
11:52:25FromGitter<alehander42> no, it's a problem with renderer.nim
11:52:30Yardanicooh
11:52:36FromGitter<alehander42> which we have to improve a bit next week
11:52:51Yardanicoyou'll make PRs to compiler/renderer? nice
11:52:52FromGitter<alehander42> we generate only PNode-s :D
11:53:14FromGitter<alehander42> well it seems better, than to create our own custom generator
11:53:58livcdis any of the py to nim usable ? :D
11:54:06livcdsorry i have not read any discussion about it anywhere
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11:56:34Yardanicodon't consider my py2nim as real py2nim :P
11:57:29livcdnah no worries. I can whip out some python but I never learned it properly as I like ruby more :)
11:59:17FromGitter<alehander42> well you can translate some small libs with it, but the output still isn't very good, let's say, next week or two it should be more usable :D
12:00:19FromGitter<alehander42> actually, we also have a ruby version of python-deduckt (python-deduckt started from an early python port of this ruby approach :D) somewhere in our internal repos
12:01:23FromGitter<alehander42> we might open source it too if we make the output format more similar to the python-deduckt one, hypothetically one can reuse stuff from py2nim to write ruby2nim with it too
12:02:29livcdah that sounds interesting
12:04:18Yardanicoalehander42: are you trying to implement https://github.com/micklat/NimBorg ? :D
12:04:26Yardanico(something like it :P)
12:06:27FromGitter<alehander42> haha that's impressive :D
12:08:14Yardanico(I think it was just a PoC)
12:08:39FromGitter<alehander42> yeah, still cool
12:09:25FromGitter<alehander42> I think nimbord is peaceful transition
12:09:37FromGitter<alehander42> different interpreters continue to work together in harmony
12:10:10FromGitter<alehander42> I like to think x2nim is a more assimilating approach :D
12:18:16FromGitter<alehander42> btw can I produce header files with `--header`? It doesn't seem to generate any definitions for me
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12:19:43FromGitter<alehander42> hm https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/issues/905
12:19:51FromGitter<alehander42> @Araq is that supported at all ?
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14:22:14dom96hello everyone
14:24:10livcdstream is going to start ? ^^
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14:24:32dom96Maybe in a couple of hours
14:24:37dom96Still not sure what to do
14:25:09livcdflappy bird in nim
14:28:22dom96lol
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14:28:30dom96already been done I think :P
14:28:39livcdah really ?
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14:29:37dom96hrm, maybe not, can't find it
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14:41:55dom96Maybe I'll just fix random bugs/my PRs
14:42:20FromGitter<nc-x> `nim c --run main.nim > a.txt` adds the `CC: main` etc etc lines also to a.txt. ⏎ Would it make sense to write the `CC:...` lines to `stderr` instead of the current `stdout`?
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16:35:32FromGitter<data-man> @dom96: Can you make a poll about your stream' topic? :-)
16:36:04dom96that would require more than one idea of what to do :)
16:36:55FromGitter<data-man> Have you only one? ;-)
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16:38:26dom96Not sure I'll do a livestream anymore. Feeling a bit discouraged
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16:39:14Yardanico_ooh, why ? :(
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16:42:34dom96I've been trying to make a nice flyer for FOSDEM but it hasn't been going well
16:42:43PMunchNeed some help?
16:43:18PMunchI've done some graphical design in my days. Not an expect by any means but I can try to help :)
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16:47:07dom96PMunch: Sure, I'll PM you :)
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16:53:35dom96also, it seems that there isn't that many Nim people around during the weekend. That might be implying that most Nim users are using it at work :O
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16:54:17FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> I know I might have asked this. Is it possible to turn off the GC. There is a very long story behind this why I am asking.
16:54:42dom96--gc:none
16:55:06FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> ok so how the code would like then?
16:55:23FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> any doc somewhere, I guees I need manage manually
16:55:29Yardanico_without freeing (it will be freed by system after closing app)
16:55:31Yardanico_why do you need that?
16:55:44Yardanico_I mean GCed memory will not be freed until process exits
16:55:52Yardanico_most part of the stdlib uses GC
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16:56:36Yardanico_you can find some info about GC here https://nim-lang.org/docs/gc.html
16:57:19FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Okay, so the long story short. Some of the libs I have developed is on Rust, which is ok but lately we have found out that the library generated for armv64 et al has no bitcode or its incompatible with the current LLVM compiler generated bitcode used to compile our iOS app
16:57:50FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> so I need to target C so that I can feed that into the project as an intermediate representation
16:58:03Yardanico_hmm, I don't fully understand your issue but some people successfully have nim with objective C on iOS/android/js
16:58:16Yardanico_yglukhov made a game which is cross-platform (he's not here sadly)
16:58:16FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> yes the problem is rust
16:58:31Yardanico_but if you need to target C - why disable GC?
16:58:54FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Rust generates a lib that is incompatible with the bitcode of Apple hence we cant publish the app
16:59:00FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> GC is another headache
16:59:05FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> in this case
16:59:13FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Not if thats a dektop app
16:59:17FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> I dont care then
16:59:18Yardanico_GC in nim is less headache that in other languages :)
16:59:30Yardanico_well without GC it would be a lot harder to do stuff
16:59:43FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Ok but I need to investigate how to initialize that say from Swift 4
16:59:47Yardanico_because you're basically left without most part of stdlib and third party nim libraries
16:59:56FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> right
17:00:10FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Ill test a boilerplate now and see how it goes
17:00:29livcddom96: do an offline screencast :P
17:00:31dom96You can control when Nim's GC runs
17:00:40Yardanico_ervin: you can also compile nim code as a library
17:00:49FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Rust completely fell out of our radar due to this issue, we have to have bitcode enbaled in our builds so that Apple is kept happy hence I need the code in C
17:01:00dom96livcd: the best thing is the community interaction though :)
17:01:12dom96ervinbosenbacher: is it a known Rust issue?
17:01:27livcddom96: ahh i thought you wanted to create more content to hook people in
17:01:42FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> https://github.com/Geal/rust_on_mobile
17:01:43dom96I do in some way :)
17:02:40FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> you can publish an iOS app to the App store of Apple but not for say Apple TV or apple watch which is a big no no
17:02:53FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Ill test Nim
17:03:01Yardanico_maybe compile for apple tv/ apple watch/ ios separately?
17:03:09FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> see how it goes, I will ask questins if I am stuck
17:03:21livcdah i completely forgot that people probably use Rust on iOS as well
17:03:23livcdor is it ?
17:03:43Yardanico_ervin: yeah, I think you'll need Araq for your questions :)
17:03:44FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> The problem is I dont want separate code for Apple tv or iphone
17:03:50Yardanico_not code
17:03:55Yardanico_just separate compilation maybe?
17:04:02Yardanico_for another platform
17:04:10FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> The problem is rust
17:04:44dom96I ask again, is this a known issue reported in Rust's repo somewhere?
17:05:06FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> And I dont want to compile Rust and keep the compiler in sync with the current LLVM compler patched by apple which in occasion is a headache as they are late to commit back their pathces to the swift llvm toolset
17:05:12FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Yeah
17:05:19FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> @dom96 possibly
17:05:27FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Id rather test Nim
17:05:35FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> so we have a C output
17:06:00FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Note that cargo-lipo does not support bitcode yet
17:06:13FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> https://github.com/wojteklu/rust-to-ios
17:06:25FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> @dom96 yes it is a known issues
17:06:39FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> Which is an issue for me
17:07:03dom96do you have a link to the issue?
17:09:49FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> https://github.com/wojteklu/rust-to-ios
17:10:06FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> ``````
17:10:57FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> I am not going to fight this, easier to have the code in Objective C or C
17:13:06FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> This puts back my full attention to Nim :D
17:13:47dom96awesome
17:14:00dom96When it works out be sure to write a blog post why you're using Nim and not Rust ;)
17:14:15FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> I will
17:14:56FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> working on an ios app prototype with module support Swift and Objective C bridge between the Nim libs… WHen I am done I wil do a blogpost
17:15:48livcdso you mean you will be able to call in swift libraries ?
17:16:26FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> I will also put my attention to the issues if we publish our OSX and iOS apps (phone, watch, tv) with Nim Ill put resources in place to help Nim get better (myself first)
17:16:29FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> yes
17:16:42FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> @libvcd I am inevstigating a whole series of things
17:16:58FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> But 100% we are dropping Rust
17:17:38FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> or I go back to c/c++
17:17:48FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> but rather not
17:24:26livcdah ok
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17:58:52FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> how do I create a dynamic lib? any examples quickly somewhere?
18:00:18FromGitter<singularperturbation> https://nim-lang.org/docs/nimc.html#dll-generation some info here @ervinbosenbacher
18:03:49FromGitter<singularperturbation> I think you have to compile with "--app:lib" too
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18:35:32FromGitter<ervinbosenbacher> i think i simply target objc and done
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19:36:05Calinoudom96: hi, I may go to FOSDEM :)
19:36:13CalinouI read there will be a Nim stand?
19:36:30dom96yep
19:39:24dom96We'll be selling T-shirts and books :D
19:39:59miranplural? :D
19:40:31dom96yeah, why would we sell just one?
19:40:43miran:P
19:41:45miranbut there is still just one nim book, right? nothing has changed there?
19:42:46Yardanicoyes
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19:44:49dom96I don't think my sentence implies that there are different books. We'll be selling multiple copies of the same book :)
19:45:13miran;)
19:46:30miranbtw, i took your advice and started typing what some day might be "nim for beginners", if i don't give up in the mean time
19:47:11miranmotivated by that reddit thread were guy asked if there is something more basic than current tutorials
19:48:10miran*where
19:48:25livcdmiran: do nimcasts
19:48:31livcdsee i even got a name for you
19:49:13miranlivcd: nah, you came up with the name - you do that :)
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21:32:48yglukhovhey guys, whats the state of salt.bountysource vs bountysource vs opencollective? and gratipay link is dead. what should i use?
21:33:51dom96yglukhov: PayPal is preferred now
21:34:38yglukhovhuh? =)
21:34:51yglukhovthats not even mentioned anywhere
21:35:01yglukhovor did i miss it...
21:35:04dom96https://nim-lang.org/donate.html#other-ways-to-donate
21:35:36yglukhovooh
21:35:48yglukhovok, i was looking at the README.md
21:35:55dom96ahh
21:36:04dom96Guess we need to update the readme
21:36:19dom96opencollective is probably preferred to bountysource now, but it's still largely unproven
21:36:33dom96They seem to want invoice evidence for every withdrawal
21:37:15yglukhovpaypal is not as transparent though
21:38:12dom96True
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21:43:36yglukhovok, switched to paypal
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21:46:05subsetparkdom96: you guys prefer PayPal? Aren't you spooked by the horror stories?
21:46:15dom96definitely
21:46:26dom96In the long run I want to set up patreon
21:47:10dom96but for now it's the best option I think
21:48:18yglukhovwhat are the stories?
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21:50:31subsetparkPaypal has developed a reputation for unexpectedly deciding that somebody's account is suspect for some algorithmic reason, and freezing their funds, and essentially offering an endless bureaucratic labyrinth as recourse that takes months if ever to unfreeze.
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23:14:22GitDisc<awr> I hear Square is good? never tried it
23:21:06subsetparkSquare Cash is great as an app. Dunno if they're set up for donation processing
23:34:03FromGitter<Yardanico> https://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/7q6ida/jai_libraries_discussion/?utm_source=reddit-android
23:34:19GitDisc<awr> does anyone know what technical reason is there for stack traces being unavailable when nimrtl is used?
23:38:18FromGitter<Yardanico> They're available
23:38:31FromGitter<Yardanico> Are you on 0.17.2 maybe?
23:38:37FromGitter<Yardanico> It's fixed in devel afaik
23:38:47GitDisc<awr> 0.17.3
23:39:00FromGitter<Yardanico> Hm
23:39:14GitDisc<awr> i updated recently so I haven't checked if it was fixed or not
23:40:21FromGitter<Yardanico> https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/pull/6716
23:41:09GitDisc<awr> awesome!
23:41:42FromGitter<Yardanico> Well you can create an issue if it doesn't work for you
23:42:08GitDisc<awr> i might be mistaken but iirc the other problem with nimrtl was that threading was unavailable, has that been fixed?
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