<< 16-12-2019 >>
00:00:11disrupteksounds great so far.
00:02:32*clyybber joined #nim
00:02:41clyybberdisruptek: Ha, I know what the issue was
00:03:05clyybberI hadn't had mesa-intel-drm installed because from the repo I figured its just an alias for mesa
00:03:10clyybberbut apparently it is not
00:03:19clyybberand now everything just works TM
00:03:21clyybberawesome
00:03:26disrupteknice.
00:03:39disruptekhow's the alt-tab working out?
00:03:47clyybberrebooted
00:03:48clyybberlol
00:04:02clyybberbut holy shit those wobbly animations are smooth af
00:04:10clyybberfeels so weird
00:04:40clyybberthis is so fucking nice
00:04:46disrupteklike going back in time to 1998 and enlightenment wm.
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00:13:31FromGitter<bung87> `CONSTANT: MNT_CMDFLAGS flags{ MNT_UPDATE MNT_RELOAD MNT_FORCE }` I found this in machos.factor , what’s the type in nim?
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03:02:18yumaikasIs there an easy way to get at nim docs from the command line, or do you have to go through a web interface?
03:02:46disruptekgotta use the web.
03:03:03*yumaikas is tempted to try to change that...
03:03:05yumaikasBut not tnight
03:03:08yumaikas*tonight
03:03:12disruptek!repo ndoc
03:03:14disbothttps://github.com/nodeca/ndoc -- 9ndoc: 11js port of pdoc, with extentions 15 93⭐ 8🍴 7& 29 more...
03:03:25disrupteknope, that wasn't it.
03:03:29disruptek!repo disruptek/ndoc
03:03:30disbothttps://github.com/disruptek/ndoc -- 9ndoc: 11like pydoc but for nim 15 0⭐ 0🍴
03:03:41disruptekwe should build it.
03:05:23yumaikasPerhaps. I have a lot on my plat for now tho. TBH, even just a "dump all of the docs for a given module" so I can grep it would be a nice start
03:05:57disruptekyeah. well, rst is greppable.
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03:07:27yumaikasHrm... That is a fair point.
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03:23:41yumaikasSo, there doesn't seem to be a way to clear out a timer using asyncdispatch? Unless you just re-add one-shot timers over and over?
03:25:01disruptekyou could do that, or sleep in a loop and periodically do something fun.
03:26:41yumaikasHrm, I suppose I'd not thought about doing it that way.
03:27:01yumaikasAnd sleepAsync returns a future, which makes it a better fit for what I want to do anyway
03:27:42yumaikas(I was wanting to create an event loop that waits on a handful of futures, and then takes different actions depending on which one completed)
03:28:58disrupteksomewhere, i have a little proc that waits for any of a group of futures and yields the one that finishes.
03:29:18disruptekpretty sure it's in this rest thingy
03:29:21disruptek!repo disruptek/rest
03:29:23disbothttps://github.com/disruptek/rest -- 9rest: 11REST comfort 15 0⭐ 0🍴
03:29:50yumaikasYeah, C# has something called Task.WaitAny() that does something similar. Isn't there a part of the standard library that does something similar?
03:29:50disruptekyeah, `any`
03:30:10disruptekno, it's notably absent from the stdlib.
03:30:17disruptekthat's why i'm mentioning it. 😉
03:30:45yumaikasAh, fair
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03:31:40yumaikasI see a proc "first"?
03:31:56disruptekthat's the first proc.
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03:34:39yumaikasHrm, ok.
03:34:54yumaikasI also see you have a proc that drains a queue
03:34:59yumaikasof futures
03:35:03yumaikasor rather, an iterator
03:35:27disruptekwhat can i say?
03:35:30disrupteki'm a wild man.
03:36:03*yumaikas doesn't see it as that wild
03:36:23yumaikasI copypasta'd something similar into some C# code I was writing for work
03:36:53disruptekyou just might be a wild man, too.
03:38:08yumaikasI am writing Nim on a Sunday night
03:38:36yumaikaslol
03:38:46*yumaikas is trying to remember how to get stdin as an async file...
03:48:51*yumaikas could have sworn someone mentioned a way to get stdin as an async stream at on point
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06:05:26FromGitter<Varriount> @Clyybber @sealmove Commandant was a project for a university course
06:06:05FromGitter<Varriount> Even if I continued work on it, I don't see it gaining actual use - it's too different from other shells
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06:37:17liam_Is there a proc in the standard library that lists all the files in a given directory?
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07:00:18livcdliam_: for sure
07:00:35liam_Yeah I found it in the end
07:00:48liam_walkFiles
07:01:11livcdor walkDir
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08:17:40FromDiscord<Kaynato> I should stop doing advent of code..... it's been bad for my health..... I need to convince myself that a leaderboard position is pointless...
08:18:33lqdev[m]@Kaynato dude, a leaderboard position is pointless.
08:21:39FromDiscord<Kaynato> competitive programming can encourage bad practices... staying up to 4 AM each day with high stress is unhealthy...
08:22:02FromDiscord<Kaynato> thank you, hopefully after i sleep on it, it will get through my stubborn subconscious
08:24:56FromGitter<authenticode> Hi guys! I am very interested in Nim and have been learning Nim for about a week and it's been truly exciting! Thanks to you guys for making Nim such a great programming language!
08:25:35FromGitter<forthy> Ditto here!
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08:28:00FromGitter<authenticode> My humble question here - does nim have a plan to add a feature similar to interface in Java or protocol in Objective-C?
08:31:34FromDiscord<Kaynato> I think the new concept format posed in that RFC would be it
08:31:57FromDiscord<Kaynato> for now however, concepts are... not exactly safe to use in that way
08:33:46FromGitter<authenticode> yeah that's what i am talking about. even without it i am in love with nim. unfortunately i am not skilled enough to add that feature to nim...
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09:11:31PMunchKaynato, shush, don't let Araq hear you calling concepts for interfaces :P
09:12:05PMunchIf you look at how Streams are implemented that is the closest we have to interfaces in Nim at the moment
09:13:02PMunchOr rather it is what is recommended to replicate that pattern
09:23:55leorize!repo interfaced
09:24:51leorize!repo andreaferretti/interfaced
09:25:12leorizeoh disbot is offline :P
09:25:13leorizehttps://github.com/andreaferretti/interfaced
09:25:28PMunchDid it die?
09:25:39leorizeI think disruptek internet is gone
09:25:55PMunchAh
09:26:24PMunchWait, does he run it on his own machine?
09:26:36leorizeyep
09:26:57FromGitter<gogolxdong> How to get git2 wrapper from nimgit2?
09:27:41shashlick@gogolxdong what do you mean
09:28:47FromGitter<gogolxdong> get nim source code for git2
09:29:41leorizeshashlick: I think they wanted a static wrapper from nimgit2
09:30:22shashlickI see - you can nim c nimgit2 > abc.nim and then modify it as needed to work
09:30:44shashlickBut you won't get any of the getHeader stuff
09:30:52shashlickJust the cimport portion
09:31:26FromGitter<gogolxdong> `/mnt/c/nimgit2/nimgit2.nim(11, 13) Error: undeclared identifier: 'getProjectCacheDir'`
09:32:29leorizewhat version of Nim are you running?
09:32:34leorizegetProjectCacheDir is a new thing iirc
09:32:46FromGitter<gogolxdong> latest devel
09:33:27shashlickYou need latest nimterop for that
09:34:23shashlickWhat version do you have
09:34:35FromGitter<gogolxdong> 1) 3.3?
09:35:00FromGitter<gogolxdong> I think it's the latest.
09:35:13shashlickAre you importing nimterop/build?
09:35:20FromGitter<gogolxdong> yes
09:36:10shashlickWhat's your wrapper looking like
09:36:23shashlickDid you modify it
09:36:26shashlickhttps://github.com/nimterop/nimterop/blob/master/nimterop/build.nim#L141
09:47:08leorize@mratsim: weave looks really cool, but I'm rather curious of your decision to use parallelFor over a kind of for-loop macros
09:47:48leorizeI think for loop macros would look more integrated with Nim's syntax, but I might not be aware of its shortcomings
09:50:16FromGitter<gogolxdong> I didn't touch it.
09:50:24livcdwould weave eventually power parallel async/await?
09:59:46FromGitter<sheerluck> `proc toFloat(i: int): float` is not defined for `BiggestInt` that I got from `getFileSize` ⏎ How would I divide filesize by 3.1415?
10:00:34leorize@sheerluck: use `float()`
10:00:50FromGitter<sheerluck> Thank you
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10:15:32FromDiscord<Fern & Simula (They/Them)> does nim have something equivalent to python's enumerate iterator?
10:15:59FromDiscord<Fern & Simula (They/Them)> oh it just works TM
10:16:08leorizepairs()?
10:16:32leorizeiiuc it's not as good, but it works :P
10:16:51FromDiscord<Fern & Simula (They/Them)> i can just use `for i, val in myseq`
10:17:39leorizeyea, it implicitly calls pairs()
10:17:47FromDiscord<Fern & Simula (They/Them)> oh that's really nice
10:17:49FromDiscord<Fern & Simula (They/Them)> thanks :)
10:18:10leorizea `for` with 1 item calls `items()`, with 2 items calls `pairs()`
10:21:43FromDiscord<Fern & Simula (They/Them)> huh, that's interesting
10:22:17FromDiscord<Fern & Simula (They/Them)> does anyone else ever have trouble reading code with an indentation of only two spaces?
10:24:37leorizethere are probably people like so, but the majority of Nim code is written in 2-space indentation :P
10:25:31PMunchYou get used to it after a while
10:25:44PMunchAnd then all 4 space indented code looks so wasteful :P
10:25:54PMunchBut it helps to have an editor that will draw lines for you
10:26:18FromDiscord<Fern & Simula (They/Them)> i've been bitten a few times by emacs deciding to reindent something and breaking things
10:26:26FromDiscord<Fern & Simula (They/Them)> i'll have to set it up with dots or something
10:29:09PMunchIn Vim at least you can get line-
10:30:25leorizei guess emacs indentation plugin is terrible :P
10:32:41FromDiscord<Fern & Simula (They/Them)> i love emacs but my god its complicatedf
10:35:33leorizewell, it's emacs
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10:53:42FromGitter<bung87> fs[i].f_flags ` error: subscript of pointer to incomplete type 'struct statfs’` where fs is `ptr UncheckedArray[statfs]` how to fix this ?
11:04:09FromDiscord<Clyybber> disruptek: For some reason installing libreoffice fucked my fonts
11:04:17FromDiscord<Clyybber> only on wayland though
11:15:53FromDiscord<mratsim> @leorize: I don't mind rewriting as for-loop macros but I think "parallel" is important enough to be the first part of the statement and not hidden on the right.
11:17:02FromDiscord<mratsim> @livcd: for now at least, I don't plan to tackle parallel async/await. There are already asyncdispatch, reaktor and Chronos for that. I just plan to play well with them.
11:19:30FromDiscord<mratsim> Maybe the best would be to design some hook/point for the event loop to run or in the event loop design some hook/point for compute to run. It's a bit complex to do it well in a generic manner I think. I probably don't know enough. Anyway if you have suggestions to look into feel free: https://github.com/mratsim/weave/issues/22
11:29:27FromDiscord<Clyybber> libreoffice wasn't the culprit 😦
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11:49:34PMunchClyybber, sure it didn't leave some fonts in a directory with priority over your system installed fonts?
11:50:20PMunchbung87, hard to tell without knowing what statfs is/is supposed to be
11:50:47clyybberPMunch: I installed some fonts now, gonna try again
11:51:02clyybberHa
11:51:05clyybberWorks now
11:51:18clyybberI really don't get font configuration though
11:51:36PMunchWhat's so hard about it?
11:52:01clyybbermaking stuff use the fonts I have installed already
11:52:19clyybberand not having to install extra fonts
11:54:21PMunchWell if they are requesting a font by name it's easy
11:54:29PMunchDefault fonts might be a tad more tricky
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12:05:37FromGitter<bung87> @PMunch forget it , problem changed..
12:07:44FromGitter<bung87> how to cast cstring to string ? I does once
12:12:06PMunchYou can't cast it directly since they have different memory layouts. But you can convert with `$`
12:15:31lqdev[m]that's if it has a terminating null byte, otherwise you use newString and copyMem
12:17:06FromDiscord<mratsim> are there cstring without a null byte?
12:17:11FromGitter<bung87> I using `caststring (cstr) ` seems work
12:17:41FromDiscord<mratsim> I'm pretty sure that's relying on some flawed cast logic
12:17:50FromDiscord<mratsim> you really want a conversion here
12:19:17FromGitter<bung87> ok , the c version using `opts[0] = 0` ,so I need `newString` or `copyMem` ?
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12:22:42PMunchopts[0]?
12:22:51PMunchThat sets the first byte to a null byte..
12:23:03PMunchWhich means that it's a string of length 0
12:29:09FromGitter<bung87> `opts: array[400, char]` then `popts = cast[cstring](opts.addr)` `cast[string](popts)` that will not work ..
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12:38:34FromGitter<bung87> porting c still hard to me, maybe I’ll choose simpler task.
12:41:37lqdev[m]you do `var popts = newString(sizeof(opts)); popts.copyMem(opts, sizeof(opts))
12:44:52FromGitter<authenticode> maybe we can introduce a new keyword `protocol` for interface. Nim would be performing a compile-time check for protocols on the Nim level. When translated into C or JavaScript, protocols will be erased and have no effect... What do you think @dom96
12:46:41lqdev[m]there's already an RFC for a redesign of concept.
12:48:23livcdmratsim: but they are not parallel right ? or are they ? oO
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12:54:22lqdev[m]@mratsim yes, there are strings without a terminating null byte. look at OpenGL's KHR_debug callback, it gives you a string with a length
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13:02:36leorize@authenticode: https://github.com/b3liever/protocoled
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13:02:42leorizethat might be what you're looking fore
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13:27:01FromGitter<sheerluck> `for key in table.keys:` works, but `for key in sorted(table.keys):` gives `Error: undeclared field: 'keys'`
13:27:29PMunchsheerluck, that's because keys is an iterator
13:28:36PMunchWhat is your table?
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13:28:53FromGitter<sheerluck> str -> str
13:29:52FromGitter<sheerluck> oh, TableRef[system.string, seq[string]]
13:30:01PMunchfor key in toSeq(table.keys).sort:
13:30:14FromGitter<sheerluck> Thank you!
13:30:16FromDiscord<yewpad> for key in toOrderedTable(table):
13:30:26PMunch(this needs sequtils and algorithm)
13:30:40PMunchyewpad, OrderedTable is ordered on insertion order, not key order
13:30:47FromDiscord<yewpad> oh, aight
13:30:49FromDiscord<yewpad> my bad
13:32:36narimiranalso, take a look at `strtabs` if you have table with strings as keys: https://nim-lang.github.io/Nim/strtabs.html
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13:35:04clyybberkrux02: Do you have an idea whats causing/how to fix #12897 ?
13:35:15clyybberhttps://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/issues/12897
13:35:35krux02I can take a look
13:46:13clyybberThank you!
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13:46:57FromDiscord<Clyybber> I think its related to alignment and the static int
13:47:30PMunchUgh, the pain of working with bits and bytes..
13:56:08Zevvsaid the dude hacking away on the teenie weeniest MCUs still in use in 2019
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13:58:46PMunchHihi, the challenge is fun. Actually working with the bits and bytes are still a pain..
13:59:43PMunchI'm writing a macro that huffman encodes a bunch of sprites, and then creates a decoder proc using case statements for that specific tree
13:59:57PMunchTo see what kind of saving that might result in
14:00:11PMunchAnd whether the speed of decoding is acceptable
14:05:53krux02clyybber: I looked into it.
14:06:26krux02there is some lastOrd and first ord call on an unresolved type.
14:07:48krux02the type is ``0..static pred(n)``
14:15:01livcdThis is really funny if you think about it https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/issues/12833
14:21:07FromDiscord<Clyybber> krux02: Ah
14:21:21FromDiscord<Clyybber> krux02: How do you think it should be solved?
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14:23:53krux02I am not sure right now
14:24:29krux02the correct solution would be to compute the size when the type is resolved.
14:25:09krux02the way it is currently done is, the size computation is triggered when the type is incomplete, the computation returns garbage and the garbage causes an overflow.
14:26:22krux02I should probably investigaty why the size computation is already triggered
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14:39:57FromGitter<alehander92> and for (a, b) in c:
14:39:59FromGitter<alehander92> ops
14:40:02FromGitter<alehander92> works for tuples
14:40:06FromGitter<alehander92> i saw an old message ops
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14:53:51disruptekhearts and minds, people; hearts and minds!
14:55:16FromGitter<Willyboar> hey Dis
14:55:27disrupteksup mr. boar.
14:55:42disruptekit is time to make magic.
14:57:50aeverr[m]disruptek I've seen that message before, is that your opening nessage
14:58:02disruptekmy wut
14:58:22aeverr[m]Do you say that when you enter a chat room or whatever
14:58:46disrupteknah; i have a much longer monologue that i use when i enter a room.
14:59:11disruptekno, i don't get invited to many parties. why do you ask?
14:59:33aeverr[m]Ahahaha
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15:00:57disruptekdisbot: are you awake?
15:00:58disbotyep. 😊
15:01:02disruptekokay, cool.
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15:05:26FromDiscord<Clyybber> disruptek: Setup wayfire now
15:05:31FromDiscord<Clyybber> It is fucking amazing
15:05:40FromDiscord<Clyybber> its like compiz
15:05:43FromDiscord<Clyybber> on crack
15:06:02disruptekbut then i have to give up my sway.
15:06:17FromDiscord<Clyybber> the wobble and the blur will make you forget
15:06:20disruptekmy windows don't need to wiggle.
15:06:26aeverr[m]I heard compiz on crack
15:06:28aeverr[m]I'm in
15:06:34FromDiscord<Clyybber> aeverr[m]: wayfire
15:06:40FromDiscord<Clyybber> wayland equivalent of compiz
15:06:54aeverr[m]Well issue is is that I'm on x11 still
15:07:09FromDiscord<Clyybber> aeverr[m]: Me too, until yesterday
15:07:30aeverr[m]I'll watch and star it for now
15:07:46aeverr[m]Still alpha quality
15:07:50FromDiscord<Clyybber> yeah
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15:08:27sealmoveif I have a string which I know is of len 1, what is the best way to turn it into a char?
15:08:34sealmoves[0]?
15:08:35FromDiscord<Clyybber> also a productivity killer
15:08:39FromDiscord<Clyybber> sealmove: Yeah
15:09:09FromDiscord<Clyybber> I'm just constantly opening transparent terminals, putting asciiquarium on them and wobbling them around
15:09:10FromDiscord<Clyybber> pls help
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15:12:08FromDiscord<Clyybber> disruptek: You think they don't. But you'll come to a different conclusion after trying this
15:12:10disruptekblur, as a concept, is a useful one. but everything else in my env is pretty good. i know i'd be investing to switch, and then lose something. not least, swayipc.
15:12:28disruptekbut i don't move windows with a pointer.
15:12:35FromDiscord<Clyybber> i dont either
15:12:39aeverr[m]clyybber: make a script that will uninstall your wm if you fuck aroun dwith it too much :P
15:12:40FromDiscord<Clyybber> but now I'm addicted
15:13:01aeverr[m]am i the only one who doesnt move windows at all
15:13:07disrupteki get it. like i said, 1998 all over again.
15:13:13FromDiscord<Clyybber> aeverr[m]: Nope, I'm coming from bspwm
15:13:17FromDiscord<Clyybber> im not a floating guy
15:13:18FromDiscord<Clyybber> but damn
15:13:21aeverr[m]i mean, of course other than expansion
15:13:21FromDiscord<Clyybber> that wobble
15:13:25aeverr[m]maximization rather
15:13:26FromDiscord<Clyybber> that blur
15:13:30krux02clyybber, just took a look at wayfire, looks exactly like what I used 10 years ago
15:13:32disrupteki really only use 2-up.
15:13:34aeverr[m]blur is great tho
15:13:35krux02more than 10 years ago
15:13:46FromDiscord<Clyybber> krux02: What did you use?
15:13:51FromDiscord<Clyybber> emwh?
15:13:57krux02I don't know
15:13:59krux02breyl
15:14:03krux02or something
15:14:07disruptekyes, i believe someone put wiggle in fvwm in the '90s.
15:14:21FromDiscord<Clyybber> krux02: So compiz?
15:14:30FromDiscord<Clyybber> breyl was an old name for compiz afaik
15:14:39FromDiscord<Clyybber> wayfire is basically compiz
15:14:42krux02I don't know
15:14:57krux02it had a cube, it had flames and all types of particle effects
15:15:03krux02also wobbly windows
15:15:08FromDiscord<Clyybber> yep, that was compiz
15:15:10FromDiscord<Clyybber> probably
15:15:18aeverr[m]sounds like compiz alright
15:15:32krux02at some point in the past it removed a lot of featuers as far as I remember.
15:15:48leorizehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compiz#Beryl
15:15:48krux02but I am not doing this 3D desktop anymore.
15:15:49FromDiscord<Clyybber> yeah
15:15:58FromDiscord<Clyybber> it was rewritten in cpp
15:16:04FromDiscord<Clyybber> and then forked
15:16:09FromDiscord<Clyybber> (and still maintained)
15:16:12krux02I am interested in VR desktops, I think there is a lot of potential to hava a VR office.
15:16:14FromDiscord<Clyybber> the c version
15:16:15disrupteklife without window decoration is simpler. 😉
15:16:19FromDiscord<Clyybber> as compiz reloaded
15:16:19krux02But that is still far away.
15:16:36krux02I just live without compositing
15:16:40aeverr[m]i dont know man, i like my animations
15:16:55FromDiscord<Clyybber> I too don't need them. I was using no compositor on x11
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15:17:12FromDiscord<Clyybber> but hey, having two setups one for eyecandy and the other one for legacy isn't too bad
15:17:12leorizeyou don't get tearing?
15:17:15leorizedamn you're lucky
15:17:16krux02I like not to have animations, why wait for an animation when you can have the content instantly?
15:17:41krux02I have tearing on videos
15:17:45FromDiscord<Clyybber> krux02: My talking normally. But when the animations fill you with joy I can't be helped
15:18:00leorizekrux02: use picom
15:18:01krux02it's annoying, but I don't have tearing in games as far as I can see
15:18:03FromDiscord<Clyybber> leorize: Your brain ignores it after a while
15:18:13disruptekthe animations will get old, and then they'll just be in the way.
15:18:14leorizeit's a lightweight compositor that does vsync for you
15:18:23FromDiscord<Clyybber> its a compton fork
15:18:30FromDiscord<Clyybber> and its great
15:18:33aeverr[m]theres a delay for me to notice information anyway so why not fill it in with an animation
15:18:38krux02well the animations did fill me with joy, and then with frustration because they constantly brok with updates
15:18:49krux02and now I relate them with frustration.
15:18:56FromDiscord<Clyybber> I guess thats where wayland improves
15:19:09krux02but that was in 2006 or something like that
15:19:09disrupteki think i'd rather have content fulfilling my need for compu-joy.
15:19:28disruptekkrux02: bad news; software has only gone downhill since '06.
15:19:40aeverr[m]hey we all have different opinions
15:19:40krux02well, not everything
15:19:53disruptekpresent company excluded, of course.
15:19:57FromDiscord<Clyybber> aeverr: And exchanging them is fun 🙂
15:19:57FromDiscord<mratsim> I wonder if Wayland or Godot will come first, I'm still waiting
15:20:08FromDiscord<Clyybber> what
15:20:12krux02there are still people around who fight for high quality.
15:20:13krux02(me)
15:20:45krux02I still thing Nim is too much and because of that it has too many bugs.
15:20:53krux02It is simpler to keep simple software free of bugs.
15:21:04krux02I think Go here really shines as a programming language.
15:21:09aeverr[m]>me, loves animations yet uses an e-ink device
15:21:23krux02Everything in ther (except GC) is a simple easy to maintain and get right thing.
15:21:24disrupteki've found that using less of nim is a viable solution.
15:21:27FromDiscord<Clyybber> @mratsim Godot won't compete with the big engines ever IMO. Not until they get rid of their variant bullshit and improve their performance
15:21:43FromDiscord<Clyybber> And I say that as one who initially loved godot
15:21:48FromDiscord<Clyybber> loves godot still
15:21:49FromDiscord<mratsim> ah you failed for it, waiting for Godot 😉
15:21:51krux02it does't have this constant shift in paradigms like other programming languages.
15:22:04FromDiscord<Clyybber> @mratsim ah damnit. sry Im an uncultured swine
15:22:10FromDiscord<Clyybber> no theatre for me
15:22:33disruptekkrux02: it's a smart observation.
15:22:39FromDiscord<mratsim> @krux02, you didn't look into their channels, concurrency and goroutines
15:22:51krux02Clyybber: I don't think super high performance is the ipmortant part to get a good open source engine become the default.
15:22:59FromDiscord<mratsim> it's very well engineered, especially their data race tool, but it's a huge piece of code to maintain
15:23:25krux02what it needs is consistentcy. People who want to make godot great for a long time.
15:23:34krux02that is what made blender what it is today.
15:23:41FromDiscord<Clyybber> krux02: Exactly, and godot isn't really consistent
15:24:02aeverr[m]but didnt blender break a lot of shit on their 2.8 update
15:24:37FromDiscord<Clyybber> aeverr: by improving basically everything
15:24:41krux02well they changed a lot
15:24:48krux02in order to become more accessable.
15:24:52aeverr[m]that is true
15:24:54krux02for exapmle left click for select.
15:25:10FromDiscord<Clyybber> but its all configurable
15:25:12krux02every program has left click select, blender had since the beginning right click select.
15:25:22aeverr[m]that still puts them in a difficult position
15:25:23krux02confused everybody. Thas has changed now.
15:25:39FromDiscord<Clyybber> IMO godot is suffering from its accessibility
15:26:10FromDiscord<Clyybber> I feel like their scripting system could be a lot more elegant
15:26:12krux02yes everything is configurable, but that doesn't mean much.
15:26:24FromDiscord<Clyybber> if they had gone for composition instead of their strict inheritance
15:26:34krux02I didn't script in blenedr yet, but I really do like the python logging.
15:26:41krux02Every action is logged as a python command
15:26:54aeverr[m]oof since i learned nuim i started using composition more
15:26:55aeverr[m]nim
15:26:58krux02so if you know how to do semething manual, you get an idea of how to automate it.
15:27:21krux02aeverr[m], what composition do you mean?
15:27:35aeverr[m]the same one Clyybber mentioned
15:28:31krux02ah yes sorry overlooked it
15:29:00FromDiscord<Clyybber> to be concrete: Its really dumb having to extend a node and a script as a workaround to attaching multiple scripts to a node
15:29:24aeverr[m]sounds painful
15:32:10aeverr[m]my qualm with nim right now is the multithreading documentations
15:32:23aeverr[m]*{dont pluralize the last word sorry}
15:33:25disruptekmultithreading is a love story that is still being written.
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15:40:36disruptekneed some new bugs for nimph.
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15:43:10aeverr[m]so which is the multithreading system you use?
15:43:30disrupteknone. i'm waiting for weave.
15:43:46disruptekthreads are rarely the right solution for my code.
15:49:06FromDiscord<mratsim> nimph is bottlenecked by IO not compute
15:49:12FromDiscord<mratsim> it should use async not weave
15:51:23disruptekyes, but golden will use weave eventually.
15:52:29disrupteknimph might also use threads for git operations that i can't use async for.
15:52:51disruptekother than that, threads really aren't the right solution afaict.
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15:58:43FromGitter<alehander92> wow disruptek
15:58:45FromGitter<alehander92> poetic
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16:00:11disruptekooookay xet.
16:01:20shashlickI wrote a tool in Nim that used async and threads together 2 years ago and it still works
16:01:43leorizedisruptek: you can make it async by sourcing out to git cli instead :P
16:02:04shashlickLong running process that went thru 100+gb of data
16:02:09disruptekno point; libgit supports threading.
16:02:26*PMunch quit (Quit: Leaving)
16:02:37disruptekit's just not a priority because it will only help people who have huge pipes.
16:03:25shashlickUsed cheatfate's asynctools
16:03:29disruptekshashlick: us mortals need a paint-by-numbers threading solution.
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16:05:48disrupteki guess today's priority is setting up branch-tracking remotes.
16:06:07disruptekmaybe a downgrade command if that goes smoothly.
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16:45:23skrylar[m]hmm my blake port's checksums are coming out weird
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17:13:15FromDiscord<mratsim> blake2b?
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17:20:42skrylar[m]yup
17:31:34disruptek!package anycase
17:31:35disbotno packages match 😢
17:31:56disruptek!repo anycase
17:31:57disbothttps://github.com/lamartire/anycase -- 9anycase: 11Convert strings to any case 15 0⭐ 0🍴
17:32:15disruptekwut
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17:35:59FromGitter<alehander92> krux02 while this is true
17:36:01FromGitter<alehander92> i disagree
17:36:28FromGitter<alehander92> a programming language is a tool that is reused by potentially huge amount of other programmers
17:36:43FromGitter<alehander92> so making its implementation somewhat more complicated
17:36:50FromGitter<alehander92> is a *very* valid tradeoff
17:36:58*endragor quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
17:37:02FromGitter<alehander92> if a language is popular enough
17:37:16disruptek!repo release tags
17:37:18disbothttps://github.com/jgm/pandoc-templates -- 9pandoc-templates: 11Templates for pandoc, tagged to release 15 121⭐ 125🍴 7& 29 more...
17:37:21disrupteknope.
17:37:26FromGitter<alehander92> as this might ease the work of much more people as a result
17:38:29FromGitter<alehander92> making people reimplement code generation and generics and other basic features in 10 different incompatible ways just for go to be simpler: its a valid strategy but i feel misleading one
17:38:39FromGitter<alehander92> which just moves the complexity back to third party/the user
17:38:56FromGitter<alehander92> there is inherent complexity
17:39:07krux02maybe my words were not the right
17:39:37krux02complicated implementation often means complicated language with complicated features and complicated (hard to learn) behavior.
17:39:49FromGitter<alehander92> no, i agree with the overall premise that sometimes simpler features are best, but i wanted to show nuance
17:40:00krux02And this complexity you have to muliply with the amout of people who use the language to compute the cost.
17:40:02FromGitter<alehander92> but some of those features are inevitable
17:40:17FromGitter<alehander92> error handling and polymorphism have complexity in their problem domain
17:40:25FromGitter<alehander92> and when you move it to
17:40:37FromGitter<alehander92> each project to decide its own approach/manual alternative
17:40:52FromGitter<alehander92> this isnt always making things really simpler
17:41:06krux02GC is one of the best examples here. On the surface you solve the problem for the users, but in reality you often make it harder for the programmer to reason about performance because of the increased complexity.
17:41:24krux02not being against GC per se
17:41:27FromGitter<alehander92> and thats why its good to have options
17:41:44FromGitter<alehander92> different tradeoffs for different groups of people
17:42:57krux02yes, give the users more options that he has time to read them all.
17:43:02FromGitter<alehander92> no
17:43:07FromGitter<alehander92> what i meant was different languages
17:43:18FromGitter<alehander92> with different tradeoffs
17:43:46krux02I disagree that we need different languages. I think we can have one universal programming language that is suitable for everything, I just doubt that we will ever end up there.
17:44:01FromGitter<alehander92> but ... its absolutely impossible for this language
17:44:09FromGitter<alehander92> to not be very powerful => relatively complex
17:44:24FromGitter<alehander92> you can layer it
17:44:30FromGitter<alehander92> so people can use simpler subsets of it
17:44:34FromGitter<alehander92> i guess
17:44:58FromGitter<alehander92> and overally i feel this is just not the way we develop tools
17:45:40FromGitter<alehander92> people develop different projects, which influence each other and lead to new versions and generations of projects
17:45:47krux02well, scala tried this "layering" approach.
17:45:49FromGitter<alehander92> its like having just one brand of a car
17:46:06krux02by actively hiding scala features to make the interface look simpler than it actually was.
17:46:07FromGitter<alehander92> maybe good, but i dont know
17:46:12krux02it really backfires.
17:46:24lqdev[m]does returning a `cstring` from a proc make a copy of it, or do I have to handle the copying myself?
17:46:52krux02cstring doesn't copy
17:47:09lqdev[m]all right
17:47:50krux02a string has a size field and a '\0' terminator for this very reason
17:51:23FromGitter<Willyboar> By the way. Where is araq ?
17:52:15leorizelqdev[m]: careful, if you don't allocate memory yourself the gc might eat the string
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17:58:46krux02yea don't expect the cstring to live forever, far passing it down to functions there is no problem at all.
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18:12:56lqdev[m]leorize: that's what I did in the end. the library frees the string later, so I suppose that's what should've been done
18:13:38leorizeuhmm, if you allocate it using the Nim allocator, then don't let anything non-Nim free it
18:13:54leorizeuse `malloc` if you want to pass it to C and have them free it
18:14:11lqdev[m]why?
18:14:43leorizeNim uses a custom allocator
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18:14:48leorizeit's not compatible with malloc
18:14:53lqdev[m]shashlick: I think I found a bug in nimterop, this https://github.com/wren-lang/wren/blob/master/src/include/wren.h#L69 is wrapped as `type WrenLoadModuleFn* = proc (vm: ptr WrenVM, name: cstring): cchar`
18:15:03lqdev[m]leorize: thanks for the tip, I'll fix my code then
18:15:25lqdev[m]is it safe to use `copyMem` on the `malloc`-allocated memory?
18:15:43leorizenp, as long as you're not trying to free it
18:16:01leorizeor resize it :P
18:16:25leorizethe heap structures are different, but memory is memory so data can still be accessed normally :p
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18:17:39lqdev[m]what if the library allows me to specify a custom allocator? should I set it to Nim's `realloc`?
18:17:51lqdev[m](because `realloc` is precisely what the library needs)
18:19:22leorizeif all memory you ever pass to it is from Nim, then yes
18:19:35leorizebe sure to make a cdecl wrapper for it though
18:19:59lqdev[m]yeah, I know
18:20:17lqdev[m]let's see if it will work
18:20:37leorizenote that Nim's allocator is thread-local by default
18:20:56leorizeif the library does threading then give it the `Shared` versions
18:21:20lqdev[m]Wren's a single-threaded language, so I'll use the normal versions
18:22:18shashlick@lqdev - should return cstring right?
18:22:29shashlickcan you please open an issue?
18:22:35lqdev[m]shashlick: indeed
18:22:37lqdev[m]I'll do
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18:47:48lqdev[m]leorize: passing Nim's `reallocate` to Wren's `reallocateFn` seems to have been a success; is there any performance difference between libc realloc and Nim reallocate?
18:48:31FromGitter<zacharycarter> !repo colors
18:48:32disbothttps://github.com/treeform/chroma -- 9chroma: 11Everything you want to do with colors, in nim. 15 28⭐ 5🍴 7& 7 more...
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19:03:09Araqlqdev[m]: there is no reallocate, it's called 'realloc'
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19:06:50leorizelqdev[m]: iirc Araq uses an O(1) allocator for Nim, so it might be faster in soft realtime cases
19:07:11Araqthat's correct
19:07:55Araqunfortunately nobody ever made the algorithms threadsafe beyond the trivial "let's put it inside a lock" solution
19:08:10Araqso we're moving to mimalloc
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19:18:45disruptekAraq: wb
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19:19:32FromDiscord<Clyybber> krux02: That solution you posted on github sounds good. I remember someone proposed that on a different issue some time ago (I think it was dumjyl)
19:32:04lqdev[m]is it possible to echo the location where a ref object was constructed, in its finalizer?
19:33:02lqdev[m]I guess valgrind is the only solution?
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19:42:34FromGitter<bung87> is there a tool can show me why my pegAst does not match ?
19:48:49leorizelqdev[m]: location where it was constructed?
19:49:22leorize@bung87: usually the error messages are your friend
19:49:26leorizeare you using npeg?
19:49:38FromGitter<bung87> some experience like using regex in sublime or viscose?
19:49:50FromGitter<bung87> the std lib pegs
19:50:01krux02lqdev[m]: there isn't any tooling built into Nim for that purpose as far as I know
19:50:53FromGitter<bung87> any other tools will be ok even a online site
19:51:54leorize@bung87: no idea then, can we see your peg? and what you are trying to match?
19:52:52FromGitter<bung87> hold on, let me push it to github
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19:54:28FromGitter<bung87> I want to parse `elm` view
19:55:12FromGitter<bung87> https://github.com/bung87/nlm/blob/master/src/nlm.nim
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19:58:54FromGitter<bung87> maybe I’ll implement in this way, peg may too complicated to me https://github.com/pavanmishra/htmly/blob/master/htmly/htmly.py
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20:00:43leorizeI'd recommend npeg because pegs API seems to be a bit more complicated than it should be
20:06:21FromGitter<bung87> reading the doc, seems as peg’s complexity to me . but it atleast have debug flag
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20:16:17Zevvwhere is this syntax described?
20:16:32lqdev[m]leorize: yeah, just like valgrind shows you where a block causing a leak was allocated
20:17:37FromGitter<bung87> https://elm-lang.org/docs/syntax but not as peg
20:18:23FromGitter<bung87> I also found a grammar as .pegjs https://github.com/joeandaverde/elm-module-parser/blob/master/src/grammar/elm_module.elm.pegjs
20:19:01Zevvyou need all of the elm language, or only this html subset
20:19:20FromGitter<alehander92> i think it would be easier to port the view dsl
20:19:21FromGitter<alehander92> to nim
20:19:31FromGitter<alehander92> or use an elm native parser
20:19:37FromGitter<alehander92> if you just need it once
20:19:38FromGitter<bung87> I tried one day, but it seems many package broken as elm version update
20:19:47FromGitter<alehander92> ah
20:19:55FromGitter<alehander92> dont they have their own parser lib
20:20:29FromGitter<bung87> they have but write in elm
20:21:48FromGitter<bung87> I only want the view parts can be use as a html template
20:23:36FromGitter<alehander92> ah
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20:23:48FromGitter<bung87> the day I try elm I face problems: network condition, packages incompatity with elm newer version , packages small as nodejs ecosystem.
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20:24:06Zevvbung87: in your example, A uses commas to separate items, but B does not
20:24:08Zevvhow does that work
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20:25:23FromGitter<bung87> ah , sorry , A coming from official website , B comming from a repo using fsharp to parse it
20:25:38Zevvbut are they both valid?
20:25:53FromGitter<bung87> https://github.com/asmundstavdahl/fsharp-simple-html/blob/master/SimpleHtml.fs if you interested you can see it
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20:29:01FromGitter<bung87> I can’t confirm B , but B syntax seems less coding.
20:30:42FromGitter<bung87> I guess I prefer B syntax, even it not functional as A
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20:34:57Ckatany way to span sql querries over multiple lines?
20:35:30Ckattheres a severe lack of community behind nim where I can just search for these random questions
20:35:38Ckatmaybe I missed it in an example though
20:36:26FromGitter<bung87> https://nim-lang.org/docs/manual.html#lexical-analysis-triple-quoted-string-literals ? this one
20:37:09Ckatah those might do the job
20:37:37Zevvbung87: for what it's worth: http://ix.io/24CJ
20:37:47Ckatyup, cheers
20:37:48FromGitter<bung87> the lib you using may have `sql””” “””`
20:37:56Ckatit did, neat
20:38:06Zevvnot sure of the syntax, some elements have attributes and children, some have text, some elements are only text, etc
20:38:13Zevvbut it might get you started
20:38:34Ckatfor my fully plaintext sql querry needs, the triple quotes work out
20:38:35FromGitter<bung87> @Zevv you really did ? wow let me check
20:39:30Zevvnpeg is a bit inside out from normal pegs, it mostly uses prefixes instead of suffixes because the npeg grammar is parsed by the nim parser
20:40:08FromGitter<bung87> OMG, how could you write this in short time...
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20:41:15Zevvhttp://zevv.nl/div/elm.png comes with the package
20:41:32Zevvto make things even more confusing :)
20:42:27FromGitter<bung87> Thank you very much ! yeah you really did it.
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20:44:54Zevvyw
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20:47:06Zevvyour strings probably need to be able to handle escaping
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21:02:23FromGitter<bung87> ah I see , if there is `\”` it will end up matching rest to string
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21:06:19Zevvright
21:06:47FromGitter<bung87> how do I aware of tag end ?
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21:07:47Zevvadd a code block to the 'kids' rule
21:08:13Zevvoh no wait, what exactly do you mean by a 'tag end' in this case?
21:08:47FromGitter<Willyboar> Sa
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21:11:15FromGitter<sheerluck> @Zevv can I use https://github.com/zevv/aoc2019 as a tutorial?
21:11:42FromGitter<bung87> maybe it’s not about npeg, I need something like `enter` `leave` so I can appending eg.`</html>` to result html string
21:12:35Zevvsheerluck: I can't stop you: https://github.com/zevv/aoc2019/blob/master/LICENSE :)
21:13:10Zevvbung87: enter and leave I usually do with empty matches. One second, I'll give an example
21:13:57Zevvbung87: http://ix.io/24CX
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21:17:30Zevvsheerluck: I'm honoured
21:17:48Zevvbut I think stuff is a bit to terse here and there
21:19:21FromGitter<bung87> ah That works, I only need check previous tag info , then ending the tag.
21:20:36Zevvyeah, but you can recurse into childs, so you probably need to keep track of your state on a stack
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21:21:45Zevvlike so: http://ix.io/24D3
21:25:21FromGitter<bung87> cool, using stack I can fetch previous n tag
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21:25:57FromGitter<bung87> solve my big problem.
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21:29:39FromGitter<bung87> I have another question, I see you write a http report parse as example, does it efficient than some http lib I’v seen , using O(n) method
21:30:04Zevvoh no don't use that in real life, it's just an example
21:30:16ZevvPEGs are often not the right solution
21:30:32FromGitter<bung87> ok, I get it.
21:30:51Zevvteriffic for quick prototyping and oneoffs, but if you need raw performance you're better of hand coding in 99% of the cases
21:30:56FromGitter<bung87> but as template parse it fit the use case ha?
21:31:05Zevvoh sure, why not
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21:32:12FromGitter<bung87> cool
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21:33:04Zevvand npeg can be fast: the json parser keeps up well with nim's default json parser
21:33:15Zevvbut that might also say something about nims default json parser, of course :)
21:33:31disruptekshhhh
21:33:35disruptekhearts and minds.
21:33:50Zevvdisruptek spreading the love
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21:34:23FromGitter<bung87> I guess for performance they might choose fastjson lib
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21:38:04FromGitter<bung87> @ disruptek you sleeping less than 6 hours? I think
21:39:50Zevvhttp://zevv.nl/div/disruptek.png
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21:40:28Zevvthat's dutch time. Seems like a pretty normal sleep/wake pattern to me. A solid 8 hours of sleep!
21:40:46Zevvhe seems to be kind of a morning person though
21:41:17leorizedid you made that from his commit history :p
21:41:24Zevvirc log :)
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21:42:02FromGitter<bung87> you using a tool automatic analyse this and generate a chart ?
21:42:24Zevvleorize: you are a mess dude: http://zevv.nl/div/leorize.png
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21:42:42Zevvbung87: grep -r 'leorize>' irc/2019/ | cut -d ':' -f 2 | sort | uniq -c
21:42:44Zevvand gnuplot
21:43:19leorizehmm I do believe I sleep 8 hrs or so :p
21:43:28FromGitter<Willyboar> i think i am the late guy
21:43:34FromGitter<bung87> never thought someone do this kind of thing
21:43:47shashlick@Zevv - this is dangerous info 🙂
21:43:53leorizealso disruptek is utc-5, at least from his commits :P
21:44:00Zevvleorize: makes sense
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21:56:13Zevvbung87: I'm off to ZzZzz, it you have any other issues drop me a line here, I usually read back
21:56:17dom96hello all
21:56:21dom96Holidays finally here
21:56:32Zevv\o/
21:56:41Zevvtwo solid weeks of Nimming, right! :)
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21:56:59FromGitter<bung87> OK，very thanks, you give me a bright morning
21:57:09dom96hah, I wish.
21:57:23dom96Some flights plus some time with family here and there
21:57:53Zevvyeah, that's what you get from having parents. your own fault!
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21:58:14Zevvfamily, pffff
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22:00:24shashlickIn Soviet Russia, your parents have you
22:00:34Zevvfunny, here also
22:00:35shashlickUh wait
22:00:39Zevv:)
22:03:34dom96:)
22:03:52dom96In any case, if there are things you want me to look at, PRs, issues, etc. now would be the time to send me links :)
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22:06:46dom96I like how some want everything to be output by Nimble, whereas others don't https://github.com/nim-lang/nimble/issues/749
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22:11:02ZevvI like my tools to be silent by default: if all is well, just say nothing.
22:11:08FromGitter<bung87> sounds reasonable, they can just copy paste test result.
22:11:13ZevvI always hated nims hints and output.
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22:12:04Zevvit is actually the only compiler I know that tells me what it is doing for every file
22:12:37dom96please be around the next time people argue that `nimble build` should output everything
22:12:48Zevvping me :)
22:13:29FromGitter<bung87> just need a cli flag
22:13:44solitudesf-nimble build should output everything
22:13:49dom96hm, NiGui is maturing fast
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22:15:24FromGitter<bung87> ```task test,”loop” ⏎ exec “nimble test"``` [https://gitter.im/nim-lang/Nim?at=5df801fb7ce7ea1e3597bdd4]
22:15:32ZevvMy CD has finished, now it's really time for bed. laters!
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22:23:04federico3dom96: I usually disable hints: the are mostly useless
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22:24:58federico3the problem is in the compiler. Nimble should just forward the output or stay silent
22:25:35federico3even better if it dumps the compiler output only on error by default
22:31:03FromDiscord<mratsim> @Clyybber, I'm on my way to fix the deadlock once and for all. I manage to get my system modelized in a formal verification tool, and reproduced the deadlock
22:31:15FromDiscord<mratsim>
22:31:15FromDiscord<mratsim> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/371759389889003532/656262088586690572/unknown.png
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22:32:02skrylar[m]i don't see how pegs are necessarily slower than doing it by hand, but then i'm used to red/janet pegs which are fairly potent
22:32:08dom96federico3, nimble will stay silent, for certain commands
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22:46:07federico3dom96: that's a bit part of the problem
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23:19:12FromDiscord<Clyybber> @mratsim Ooh, intetesting. Keep me updated
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23:19:50FromDiscord<mratsim> well that deadlock is actually not interesting I didn't understand how to have a thread do several thing 😛
23:20:08FromDiscord<mratsim> so it doesn't send the termination signal in the trace
23:20:16FromDiscord<mratsim> because it asked for work ...
23:20:18FromDiscord<Clyybber> heh, are you still going to rewrite it using a statemachine?
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23:25:39FromDiscord<Clyybber> @mratsim ping
23:26:20FromDiscord<mratsim> not now
23:26:38FromDiscord<mratsim> for now I'm doing formal verification of the concurrent stuff so that it doesn't deadlock
23:27:29FromDiscord<Clyybber> cool, would there be a performance improvement\decrease with a statemachine approach?
23:27:35FromDiscord<mratsim> The state machine is a bit complex because I would need to create some state diagram to understand where I'm going
23:27:45disruptekpffbt
23:28:22FromDiscord<mratsim> no idea. maybe maybe not. Hopefully it's an increase as the synthesis generates pretty tight code
23:29:27FromDiscord<mratsim> what's for sure is that it should be easier to follow what's going on and to understand where you would adjust some nuts and bolts if you want to add new behaviours
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