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04:56:53 | Zor | Araq: the only special case is passing null which means "get handle to main executable" |
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15:42:57 | * | gour wonders what is the impact for of "FFI support at compile time " for nimrod end users |
15:50:22 | gour | s/for of/of |
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16:05:08 | dom96 | gour: well for me it means that there will finally be a proper REPL. |
16:14:06 | gour | dom96: how? |
16:16:33 | gour | when one uses external C libs, like e.g. gtk? |
16:17:03 | gour | i haven't consider to use nimrod's interpreter feature... |
16:17:09 | dom96 | FFI support at compile-time will allow you to use such libs. |
16:20:05 | gour | now i got it |
16:20:44 | gour | remember playing with ghci in the past... |
16:23:32 | * | gour notices qt5 released |
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20:27:17 | gradha | I had an old tetris clone implemented in C+liballeg4, but it seems liballeg4 doesn't work on macosx any more and liballeg5 breaks badly backwards compatibility (eg. no more gui menus) |
20:27:37 | gradha | so since I'm going to rewrite it anyway, and the logic of a tetris is not that much, do you recommend any nimrod lib? |
20:28:39 | Araq | hm |
20:28:47 | Araq | sdl? |
20:29:01 | dom96 | sfml |
20:29:17 | dom96 | or maybe try Vladar's nimgame library |
20:36:25 | gradha | so I guess it's time to get babel to avoid getting in nimgame's dependency hell |
20:38:14 | gradha | yay: $ ./babel |
20:38:14 | gradha | could not load: libssl.so(|.1.0.0|.0.9.9|.0.9.8|.0.9.7|.0.9.6|.0.9.5|.0.9.4) |
20:38:33 | gradha | that's it, I'm going to write it in basic |
20:38:52 | gradha | gwbasic, and run it in a dos emulator, on freedos, in a vm |
20:39:49 | Araq | you could also fix it the dll path |
20:40:25 | Araq | or compile babel without SSL support if that makes any sense |
20:42:10 | dom96 | it does not :P |
20:42:15 | gradha | want a github bug for http://pastebin.com/xx6HhDXN ? |
20:42:46 | Araq | I'd prefer a fix |
20:43:01 | gradha | ah, Error: unhandled exception: Sorry, you cannot use recvLine on an unbuffered SSL socket |
20:43:09 | gradha | but if I use buffered sockets, they don't work on macosx |
20:43:20 | Araq | I'm sure macosx has openSSL in some awesome dylib |
20:43:38 | gradha | the pastebin works for me, the else picks the dylib |
20:43:51 | Araq | oh alright |
20:45:46 | Araq | no need for a ticket :P |
20:46:10 | gradha | this irc command thing is amazing, it should do taxes too |
20:49:14 | * | gour is 1st nimrod user (according to ohloh.net) ;-) |
20:50:04 | Araq | that's good; do you in fact really *use* it, gour? ;-) |
20:51:16 | gour | Araq: for now, i was reading about its features and tried some of FFI tools (c2nim), and will do more, but not feel well in last days and/or busy with other non-computer-related stuff |
20:52:21 | gour | wonder about taht hight peek of code lines july-2010-march-2011? |
20:53:17 | gour | *high |
20:55:16 | Araq | ohloh is stupid |
20:55:21 | Araq | that's why |
20:55:33 | Araq | "written in C" ... er ... no? |
20:56:07 | gradha | maybe you should rename nimrod to NotWrittenInCRod |
20:58:16 | Araq | I could also truncate history |
20:58:47 | Araq | people don't like the csources.zip files in git anyway |
20:59:13 | Araq | but then I've been told that will break all forks |
20:59:25 | gour | i can only imagine what stats i'd get by adding nimrod project kept under fossil VCS :-) |
20:59:40 | gradha | yes, rewriting history on a forked repo is a nice recipe for hate |
21:00:05 | gour | gradha: use fossil which does not have, by design, rebase ;) |
21:00:40 | gradha | without rebase everybody would see my endless silly commit mistakes |
21:01:11 | gour | gradha: no, you e.g. use private branches and then commit when 'ready' |
21:02:03 | gour | with other DVCS-es, you can use MQ etc. |
21:02:14 | gradha | that's the problem: it keeps you away from commiting, so you lose on source control |
21:02:41 | gour | why? MQ patches are also stored under vcs |
21:03:01 | gradha | don't know what MQ patches are |
21:03:36 | gour | http://mercurial.selenic.com/wiki/MqExtension |
21:04:23 | gour | bazzar has looms or something similar...like fossil's private branches |
21:04:45 | gour | iow, rebase is not required to have 'tidy/clean' history |
21:05:18 | gradha | ok, so fossil doesn't have public rebase, but has private rebase |
21:05:48 | gour | no, it's not rebase..rebase loses history |
21:06:00 | gradha | how? |
21:09:45 | gour | gradha: read this http://www.fossil-scm.org/xfer/doc/trunk/www/fossil-v-git.wiki |
21:10:46 | gour | and as you wrote, there are enough horror stories around about havoc created by rebase |
21:16:04 | gradha | so fossil/mercurial are more pedantic with regards to history tracking but then accept it sucks and provide extensions to go around that, seems sensible |
21:16:47 | gradha | I love the seventh point, whenever I've had a serious power outage+crash the whole fs died, so not sure what advantage there is from one format to another |
21:20:45 | gradha | dom96: do you have any nimgame or sfml examples to get started? With nimgame I have the "there are too many files and I don't know which should I start with" problem |
21:21:54 | dom96 | gradha: Vladar might be able to help you with nimgame, if he's here. Also there is a demo here: http://forum.nimrod-code.org/t/47 |
21:22:22 | dom96 | as for sfml, https://github.com/fowlmouth/nimrod-sfml/blob/master/examples/particles.nim |
21:23:43 | gradha | thanks, the sfml example looks good enough |
21:24:12 | gour | gradha: after trying and using so many DVCS-es, i settled on fossil which is the best after darcs and here are some of the reasons i pretty much agree with written by richard hipp (sqlite/fossil author): http://pastebin.com/72NCzzx1 |
21:24:19 | dom96 | perhaps I should push my ludum dare game |
21:24:44 | dom96 | fowl: When will you submit your projects to babel? |
21:24:53 | gradha | just read ludum dare had about 25 haxe games |
21:25:03 | dom96 | 25? more like 1 thousand |
21:25:35 | gradha | I follow some guy doing periodic news, so maybe he handpicked the best? |
21:27:23 | gradha | wait, got that completely wrong http://blog.skialbainn.com/post/38314849187/haxe-roundup-128 |
21:27:31 | gradha | so it was ludum dare 25th |
21:27:36 | gradha | and there were x haxe games |
21:27:39 | gradha | not 25 |
21:27:46 | gradha | man, I suck at reading |
21:30:05 | gradha | gour: I'll try to use fossil at some point and see how my brain cycles go |
21:30:40 | gour | gradha: good. i hope you'll be happy |
21:30:57 | fowl | dom96: i want to see it :) |
21:35:39 | gour | the other day (or was it yesterday), Araq told me that the 'func' idea (mentioned in the manual) to have nosideeffects procedure (aka function), is dead idea...anything else like this not rm-ed from the docs' |
21:35:41 | gour | ? |
21:37:15 | Araq | the "future directions" are not cast in stone |
21:37:59 | Araq | that's why it says "future" |
21:38:13 | Araq | future is uncertain :P |
21:38:38 | gour | that's ok...docs should reflect the present :-) |
21:39:36 | gour | usually pragmas are used to test features before finding appropriate syntax... |
21:39:50 | Araq | even the posix standard has "future directions" iirc |
21:41:01 | dom96 | fowl: https://github.com/dom96/ld25 |
21:42:59 | gour | Araq: that's ok, but if you know today that it won't happen, then it might be good to simply remove it from the docs |
21:43:19 | gour | no more, no less :-) |
21:43:28 | Araq | but the "func" keyword may make many people happy :P |
21:43:46 | Araq | so if enough people vote for it, it will be done |
21:43:47 | * | gour is one of 'em :-D |
21:44:06 | gour | :-) |
21:44:14 | fowl | dom96: updating nimrod and babel to try my package right now |
21:44:25 | dom96 | fowl: great |
21:44:59 | gour | Araq: 'func' might create havoc amognst haskellers ;) |
21:45:33 | Araq | we don't care about haskellers; they will never use anything else anyway :P |
21:45:44 | dom96 | hey, i'm a haskeller *cough* |
21:45:56 | dom96 | ok, fine. ex-haskeller. |
21:46:06 | dom96 | obviously :P |
21:46:36 | Araq | lol true |
21:47:37 | dom96 | I don't see a problem with 'func' though. |
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21:47:44 | SimonM | yo |
21:47:54 | dom96 | hello SimonM! |
21:48:00 | Araq | hi SimonM |
21:48:58 | SimonM | I just found out about Nimrod |
21:49:10 | * | gour wonder how |
21:49:16 | SimonM | xD |
21:49:23 | dom96 | forced advertisement by me :P |
21:49:41 | SimonM | sort of |
21:49:49 | gour | hmm, those modern methods work |
21:49:55 | SimonM | well |
21:50:01 | SimonM | I heard of the language before |
21:50:10 | SimonM | but didn't have time |
21:50:14 | SimonM | and lost it |
21:50:17 | dom96 | Also I believe this is the highest amount of users we've ever had here. |
21:51:41 | Araq | dom96: sshhtt, that's sad ;-) |
21:51:51 | SimonM | lol |
21:51:54 | SimonM | doesn't matter |
21:51:59 | dom96 | no! It's a reason to celebrate! |
21:52:00 | SimonM | It's just a chat |
21:52:21 | SimonM | I like smaller internet communities |
21:53:57 | SimonM | well I'll be going now |
21:53:58 | SimonM | cya |
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21:54:37 | Araq | that was quick ... |
21:54:52 | fowl | dom96: how can i test the package before i submit it |
21:55:03 | dom96 | babel install |
21:55:06 | dom96 | in the directory of the package |
21:55:20 | gour | one when i was in #modula-2, one user there recommended me it's better (for my use case) to use ada than modula-2...when i got free advertisement from nimrod deve...err. user, i was told to use, in any case, nimrod...now we're here |
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22:00:46 | fowl | dom96: do i need to pull request on packages.json? |
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22:02:35 | dom96 | fowl: yeah |
22:03:06 | gradha | fowl: I'm trying to run nimrod-sfml on macosx but it seems at some point a symbol is not found and exits |
22:03:40 | gradha | unfortunately I get no stacktrace from nimrod nor info on what dynlib failed, so I'm stuck |
22:04:57 | Araq | no stacktrace from nimrod? that's strange |
22:05:36 | fowl | gradha: are you on 2.0RC or the csfml from git |
22:05:37 | gradha | it has never done so for missing importc/dynlib on mac, should it have? |
22:05:48 | gradha | fowl: got the 2.0RC from the web |
22:06:03 | Araq | gradha: ah yeah I guess it shouldn't |
22:06:21 | Araq | but it should tell which lib couldn't be loaded |
22:06:41 | gradha | it does, but not which line is failing or what symbol is missing |
22:06:59 | Araq | what does it say exactly? |
22:07:12 | fowl | gradha: im gonna branch it and backport to the RC, currently its based on CSFML from git |
22:07:47 | fowl | gradha: right now you could comment out line 1004 of csfml.nim |
22:08:27 | gradha | Araq: could not load: libcsfml-graphics.dylib |
22:08:27 | gradha | Error: execution of an external program failed |
22:08:40 | gradha | fowl: great, have just arrived to that line commenting/uncommenting |
22:08:51 | Araq | well there you have it |
22:09:00 | Araq | what else should it tell you? |
22:09:18 | gradha | what line is wrong? |
22:09:21 | Araq | it couldn't load the dylib, it's not that some symbol is missing |
22:10:37 | gradha | fowl: I've commented out the whole transformFromMatrix block since I made other changes and line numbers don't match |
22:11:03 | fowl | gradha: the let identityMatrix = ... line |
22:12:09 | gradha | ok, so that makes the csfml module compile and run, but jstest still fails loading the dylib |
22:13:21 | gradha | actually, I'm missing an identityMatrix = ... line ? |
22:13:51 | fowl | gradha: its at the end of the transform functions |
22:13:58 | fowl | let IdentityMatrix*: TTransform = transformFromMatrix( |
22:14:19 | gradha | ah, cases |
22:15:41 | gradha | Araq: with procs defined like proc getMatrix*(transform: PTransform, matrix: ptr cfloat) {. |
22:15:41 | gradha | cdecl, importc: "sfTransform_getMatrix", dynlib: LibG.} |
22:15:56 | gradha | is it possible to make dynlib say what line failed loading the importc? |
22:16:25 | Araq | it's loaded before the program starts running |
22:16:37 | Araq | so I cannot see what you like to see |
22:16:40 | fowl | gradha: usually it says which symbol failed importing |
22:16:47 | gradha | it doesn't, that's the problem |
22:17:06 | Araq | it can't import the dylib itself |
22:17:20 | Araq | so it doesn't matter which symbol triggered it |
22:17:41 | Araq | but you can edit lib/system/dyncalls.nim |
22:17:54 | Araq | if that's of any help |
22:18:37 | gradha | maybe the fsml binaries have done something like the libiconv people and prefixed everything? |
22:18:53 | gradha | ah, no, you say it doesn't load at all |
22:37:13 | gradha | what are the reasons a library could fail loading? I'm testing now manually with dynlib.LoadLib and it returns nil for the specific full path of the library file |
22:38:34 | Araq | that usually means that the dylib hasn't been built properly by GCC |
22:38:39 | Araq | sounds strange I know |
22:38:52 | Araq | but I couldn't find any other explanation |
22:39:01 | Araq | had that problem often too |
22:41:24 | gradha | looks like it's a build switch or something, I compiled the libraries myself now and still don't work |
22:41:34 | Araq | maybe you built a 32bit version and try to load it from a 64bit binary |
22:41:46 | gradha | or could it be they depend on something else I might not have installed? |
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22:55:25 | Araq | good night |
22:55:46 | gradha | bye |
22:55:47 | fowl | config/nimrod.cfg(36, 11) Hint: added path: '/home/fowl/.babel/libs/' [Path] |
22:56:00 | fowl | i dont have ~/.babel/libs |
22:56:06 | fowl | i have ~/.babel/lib though |
22:56:51 | dom96 | it should be ~/babel/libs |
22:59:43 | dom96 | Will be changed to a hidden dir though |
23:02:41 | NimBot_ | nimrod-code/packages 00407fe Billingsly Wetherfordshire [+0 ±1 -0]: added sfml to packages.json |
23:02:41 | NimBot_ | nimrod-code/packages 5042363 Dominik Picheta [+0 ±1 -0]: Merge pull request #4 from fowlmouth/patch-1... 3 more lines |
23:05:31 | * | gradha quit (Quit: gradha) |
23:06:20 | dom96 | fowl: thanks for adding it |
23:06:33 | dom96 | I like how every package is MIT licensed :P |
23:30:55 | fowl | i dunno how to run your game |
23:31:00 | fowl | how do i tell it where to find sfml |
23:33:14 | dom96 | --path:/path/where/nimgame/dir/is |
23:33:20 | dom96 | it imports "nimgame/csfml" |
23:33:42 | dom96 | so you can either do that, or place the nimgame directory in with my game |
23:33:52 | dom96 | Anyway, I need to go to sleep |
23:33:59 | dom96 | bye |
23:38:42 | fowl | night |