<<23-01-2013>>
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10:28:26gradhatest results from my mac at http://dl.dropbox.com/u/145894/t/testresults.html
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13:34:27Araq_welcome HFT
13:34:48HFThi there
13:34:50HFT:)
13:54:39Araq_usually action starts at night here ;-)
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15:10:18gradhathe best way to have action is to start it
16:00:04*dom96 starts the action
16:00:07dom96hey HFT
16:01:51dom96gradha: I see you've been busy today
16:02:03gradhait only looks that way
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16:04:26*dom96 is already distracted with a Prison Architect GameSpot stream
16:05:06*gradha scratches head, goes back to mowing lawn
16:05:31*dom96 wishes he had a lawn to mow
16:05:51gradhanever said it was mine!
16:11:20dom96Prison Architect looks quite good actually: http://www.twitch.tv/gamespot
16:13:02gradhasounds like the sims with chains
16:16:42dom96heh, true
16:18:59dom96I like these types of games
16:19:51gradhafrom what I've read you could like dwarf fortress, a text game I believe
16:21:06gradhaoh, look, it even has "wikipedia" pages http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dwarf_Fortress
16:24:47dom96yeah, i've played it once
16:24:54dom96Never really got into it.
16:25:00dom96Prefer Nethack.
16:25:57gradhaI've always liked the "idea" of games with depth, but end up always settling for graphics, preferably in youtube non interactive form
16:27:48gradhaI've ended up kickstarting http://www.robertsspaceindustries.com, though it clearly didn't need my help. The dev team said they plan to support occulust rift
16:28:33dom96ahh yeah. It looks good, but it will take them a while to finish it.
16:29:01dom96I saw a video of people trying the Occulus Rift at CES (IIRC), and they were very amazed.
16:29:07gradhaI'm still waiting for http://aa-project.sourceforge.net/aalib/ to create a kickstarter where they promise to bring ASCII in 3d for the occulus rift, imagine nethack with that
16:29:09dom96So i'm looking forward to it too.
16:29:45dom96that would be interesting, nethack would benefit from real graphics though.
16:30:21gradhadon't they have isometric/tiled versions of the game?
16:31:04dom96yeah. But I didn't find it very impressive from the screenshots, I couldn't get it running.
16:40:57dom96But yeah, every time I play nethack I always die a different surprising way. I haven't played any other games which have so much surprises.
16:42:02gradhadoes nethack have a concept of savegames?
16:42:24dom96yeah, but as soon as you die your save does too.
16:42:35dom96you could cheat of course
16:43:03gradhaand being open source I guess nobody has hacked nethack to make them persist?
16:43:52gradhaI used to do that when playing xcom, save game, shoot alien, fail shoot, reload game, shoot alien, killed, ok, continue
16:44:30dom96well it's a part of the game
16:44:36dom96there is a lot of variants of nethack
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16:56:17gradhahmm... a nimrod variant of nethack
16:58:08dom96yes! :D
16:58:11dom96Make one :P
16:58:35dom96We already have a library for this sort of stuff wrapped.
16:59:10gradhaI would need to know nethack, do you mind me playing first a few years "for documentation" purposes?
17:00:38dom96lol. I do, yes.
17:00:50dom96I will give you 5 minutes play time.
17:01:20gradhascreenshots... err textshots should be enough
17:01:51dom96The key to a good nethack-like game is a good story line.
17:01:57dom96IMO
17:02:08gradhaoh, I thought nethack was random like diablo?
17:02:37dom96yeah, well it is procedurally generated
17:02:45dom96But there is still objectives and stuff
17:03:37dom96You have to get some amulet or something
17:03:57dom96and you find interesting things, I guess there isn't really traditional story line like in Skyrim
17:04:02dom96But it's still quite interesting
17:04:09gradhadoes the storyline tell you why you want the amulet?
17:04:23*dom96 can't remember
17:04:54dom96http://nethackwiki.com/wiki/Main_Page
17:06:36dom96http://nethackwiki.com/wiki/Story
17:09:24dom96It's a bit hard to explain
17:09:36dom96I guess it is like Diablo
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17:56:30dom96Now this is cool, custom Portal 2 level to test for possible job applicants: http://jobs.wibidata.com/puzzles/portal/
17:58:49gradhathey don't seem to make it a requirement though
18:01:45dom96still pretty cool
18:02:33gradhathe idea is nice, shame I don't have any interest in big data
18:07:53gradhaeverybody is working now on big data like the most fascinating thing and I still don't get "the web", sigh
18:14:49gradhatalking about web, can jester be used to generate static web pages? what are the requirements for a cheap host, just cgi-bin or something more advanced?
18:16:41dom96no. Jester is designed for dynamic websites.
18:16:48dom96It is essentially a clone of Sinatra.
18:25:54dom96as for a cheap host: github pages seems fine for static things
18:27:07gradhaI've written some crappy google appengine page and thought about moving it to a crappy nimrod implementation to compare
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18:47:06gradhathat's it, let's wrap http://www.webtoolkit.eu/wt/ in nimrod, for maximum lolz
18:47:33gradhadom96: can you go there and try use the chat of the web page? I want to see if it truly works or its a gimmick
18:48:11gradhathe chat is somewhat collapsed on the bottom right of each page, and seems to "wander" around during navigation
18:48:50dom96Works for me?
18:49:16gradhacool, thanks
18:50:19gradhanice, it even displays that you "logged out", I guess closing the tab/browser
18:51:08gradhaI wonder if such a web chat could be cross-linked into irc through a proxy bot
18:51:16gradhaor just about anything, like jabber
18:51:35gradhasounds like a support nightmare though
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19:09:28reactormonkhow do I create namespaces for import? So from kwin import client is valid?
19:11:23dom96I don't think that is possible.
19:11:42dom96unless 'client' is some object or function
19:11:51reactormonkhmm
19:12:09gradhadon't know what you want to do, maybe export client to users of your module?
19:12:42reactormonkwell, I'd like that stuff to be namespaced.
19:12:57reactormonkcurrently I have 5 files 'globals, ...'
19:13:07gradhaAFAIC if you import something, that something doesn't get exported
19:13:18gradhaat least I had to explicitly make it available to outsiders, see https://github.com/gradha/epak/blob/master/nimrod/nimepakoo.nim
19:14:23gradhawhat's the arrangement of your globals files? sounds like pain
19:14:46dom96I think the Nimrod way is to name your module 'kwinclient'
19:15:03dom96Araq dislikes hierarchies.
19:19:49reactormonkaww
19:20:19dom96But do try to convince him otherwise :P
19:22:20reactormonknot worth it.
19:24:00reactormonkdom96, name == filename?
19:26:21dom96yeah
19:27:22reactormonkhm
19:27:35gradhaamazing, the geniuses behind python decided that in xml when you have an empty string you actually want a None object
19:28:06reactormonkgradha, hm. Is "" falsy in python?
19:28:37gradhayes
19:28:49reactormonkgradha, lol.
19:29:15gradhalooks like <tag /> and <tag></tag> are the same thing, in some parallel universe
19:29:59gradhaand this parallel universe happened to dump itself on this one, so now I have to manually convert None objects to "" because otherwise stuff breaks due to strings being expected. Yay!
19:31:21dom96gradha: Speaking of parallel universes, you ever watched Fringe? :P
19:31:31reactormonkgradha, according to #xml, those two are the same things
19:31:38gradhaand here we have again a case for types saving the day
19:31:48gradhadom96: I did a few episodes
19:31:53gradhareactormonk: no kidding!?
19:31:57reactormonkgradha, yep
19:32:24reactormonkAnkh | reactormonk, yes (outside of Web browsers)
19:33:00gradhaso it's impossible in xml to have an empty string? amazing
19:33:11reactormonkgradha, go ask yourself, can't tell you
19:40:39gradhawhy do I keep waking up in the wrong universe
19:41:16reactormonkgradha, :-P
19:42:23gradhadom96: I stopped watching fringe when I saw terminator-grandma take off her skin and show a cybernetic arm, that was enough WTF for me
19:42:34dom96haha
19:42:49dom96I watched all of it :P
19:44:18gradhathe whole first season?
19:44:25reactormonk http://sprunge.us/bAKD
19:44:31dom96gradha: All the seasons
19:44:48reactormonkI added path="kwin" to nimrod.cfg
19:44:54reactormonkbut import kwinglobals, kwinworkspace, kwinclient, kwinoptions, kwintoplevel
19:45:00reactormonktiling.nim(1, 18) Error: cannot open 'kwinglobals'
19:45:14dom96try: --path:kwin
19:45:27dom96in the config
19:45:30reactormonkdoesn't help
19:45:50dom96you have an extra 's' in your import :P
19:47:04reactormonk*head -> wall*
19:47:22reactormonkconverter toQVariant(obj: expr): QVariant = result = cast[QVariant](obj) <- valid?
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19:49:19*dom96 isn't sure if you can use 'expr' in converters
19:50:34reactormonkvar geom_15001 = workspace.activeClient.geometry_10009;
19:50:37reactormonkgeom_15001.height_9012 -= 100;
19:50:39reactormonkworkspace.activeClient.geometry_10009 = geom_15001;
19:50:41reactormonk... kinda nice
19:51:52reactormonkNice guide to create a babel package?
19:55:33dom96https://github.com/nimrod-code/babel#example-babel-file
19:56:14reactormonkno code in there?
19:59:16reactormonk http://sprunge.us/THOj any way to shorten that?
20:01:24dom96Not currently. We might get anonymous object creation soon enough though.
20:04:06dom96can you actually do that? (omit the return type?)
20:05:07reactormonkdom96, nope. ;-)
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20:48:08dom96This is quite cool: https://github.com/search?q=extension%3Anim&type=Code&ref=searchresults
21:03:49Araqhi everyone
21:06:46dom96hey Araq
21:21:04NimBotAraq/Nimrod 3c51a7a Grzegorz Adam Hankiewicz [+0 ±2 -0]: Adds some documentation related to exceptions.
21:21:04NimBotAraq/Nimrod 0e5618b Araq [+0 ±2 -0]: Merge pull request #312 from gradha/pr_adds_some_docs_about_exceptions... 3 more lines
21:22:08NimBotAraq/Nimrod 73501ed Grzegorz Adam Hankiewicz [+0 ±3 -0]: Moves addr out of tutorial into manual, indexing it too.
21:22:08NimBotAraq/Nimrod f5e9c00 Araq [+0 ±3 -0]: Merge pull request #315 from gradha/pr_adds_example_of_addr_cast_usage... 3 more lines
21:22:32NimBotAraq/Nimrod 45e2a4d Grzegorz Adam Hankiewicz [+0 ±1 -0]: Fixes rst format for enumerated list in html output.
21:22:32NimBotAraq/Nimrod fa614d4 Araq [+0 ±1 -0]: Merge pull request #313 from gradha/pr_fixes_rst_format_enumerated_list... 3 more lines
21:23:32dom96And now it will boot strap 3 times.
21:23:32NimBotAraq/Nimrod 7b68c01 Grzegorz Adam Hankiewicz [+0 ±1 -0]: Documents two-variable for loop with sequences.
21:23:32NimBotAraq/Nimrod ff7153e Araq [+0 ±1 -0]: Merge pull request #311 from gradha/pr_documents_two_variable_for_loop... 3 more lines
21:23:36dom964
21:23:56Araqwhat?
21:24:08AraqI thought you prevent that
21:24:13dom96Just thinking out loud. I should make it more efficient with this.
21:24:36Araqif 2 pushes arrived in a short period of time, it wouldn't rebuild again
21:24:46Araqyou said something like that
21:25:04dom96I don't think so...
21:25:09Araqand I was impressed by this feature :P
21:25:35dom96Maybe you thought it up yourself :P
21:28:05Araqmaybe ...
21:28:12dom96My plan was to check what files changed and determine whether a rebootstrap was necessary
21:28:34Araqwell you can indeed do that for the documentation files
21:28:43dom96yeah, but not for the stdlib.
21:28:50dom96Sadly.
21:29:25Araqwell we could make the compiler output a list of stdlib modules that it uses :P
21:29:49Araqfixed that osproc bug btw?
21:30:04dom96no. I will have lots of time tomorrow
21:30:08dom96and Friday
21:30:28NimBotAraq/Nimrod e273d40 Grzegorz Adam Hankiewicz [+0 ±7 -0]: Renames each proc to map, each is left deprecated.
21:30:28NimBotAraq/Nimrod 2c9ca92 Araq [+0 ±7 -0]: Merge pull request #316 from gradha/pr_renames_each_to_map... 3 more lines
21:30:55Araqso will I :-)
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21:31:18dom96cool :D
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21:41:52NimBotAraq/Nimrod 3e21825 Grzegorz Adam Hankiewicz [+0 ±1 -0]: Adds randomize(seed) for repeatable pseudo random numbers.... 3 more lines
21:41:53NimBotAraq/Nimrod df9893d Araq [+0 ±1 -0]: Merge pull request #306 from gradha/pr_adds_randomize_with_specific_seed... 3 more lines
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23:08:23Araqwhy is everbody in love with 'repr'? I never use it
23:08:45dom96why not?
23:08:50gradhawhat else do you use to show random data structures?
23:08:58gradhayou suggested it yourself, IIRC
23:09:26AraqI never work with random data structures I guess
23:09:45gradhayou always implement a $ proc for them?
23:09:45Araqin the compiler I have 'debug' for the common data structures
23:10:27Araqno I don't use many different data structures in the first place
23:10:32gradhahow do you use this debug? it's not in the index
23:10:44Araqit's only for the compiler's internals
23:10:54Araqand it's *old*
23:11:04gradhathere you have it, repr all the way
23:11:30AraqI don't mind repr but somebody should improve it
23:11:48Araqthe addresses are ugly and only to allow to look after wrong sharing or cycles
23:14:52gradhawhat changes do you have in mind, get rid of the addresses in the output?
23:15:23Araqyeah
23:17:04gradhadoesn't sound like a really big change
23:17:51gradhado you think repr is taking away the love spotlight from other procs?
23:18:33Araqnot really but it turned out to be more buggy than other things
23:19:02Araqwhich is exactly what you need for debugging
23:27:14gradhaoh, just noticed, Zerathul: en taro Adun!
23:29:32ZerathulEn Taro Tassadar
23:30:11gradhawill you be coding in nimrod for Aiur?
23:31:16ZerathulA mighty weapon in deed. ;)
23:32:21gradhagood to hear, don't hesitate to ask for support
23:39:08Araqgradha: Zerathul is a good friend of mine; it's likely he'll PM me instead ;-)
23:40:21gradhaI figured out was somebody known, otherwise you would have welcomed
23:40:44Araqgood point
23:40:55gradhaI watched today several times Kerrigan's trailer, so I couldn't resist
23:41:45Araqyou'll be glad to hear then that "Araq" is an unkown Zerg cerebrate :-)
23:42:07ZerathulHehe.
23:42:13gradhamakes tingle my mutated dna
23:45:34gradhaI'm reading a note about idetools not being to locate a proc if the OO dot syntax notation is used, do you want me poking around that or is idetools still a work in progress
23:46:03gradhahad to test it in Aporia first, maybe it's a vim problem
23:46:24gradhas/had/have/
23:46:40Araqidetools is always work in progress like the rest ...
23:47:48gradhaok, will open a ticket if I manage to make a test case
23:48:07Araqok ...