<< 23-03-2017 >>

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00:22:45	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> Compiling nim on android now :) via termux
00:23:38	ftsf	\o/
00:24:21	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> Seems bad that there's no nim package in termux, I need to contribute to https://github.com/termux/termux-packages/
00:25:09	*	ftsf has never heard of termux before
00:25:59	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> It' like an terminal emulator, but with its own repository
00:26:19	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> it doesnt require root
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00:29:38	jivank_	TiberiumPY you could probably compile nim in termux with gcc
00:30:16	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> Yeah
00:30:30	ftsf	i've just used ConnectBot in the past, quite nice.
00:30:45	ftsf	but never really done local development on my android device
00:30:48	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> But how can I pass custom options to build.sh?
00:31:08	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> I need to add -landroid-glob
00:36:03	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> Nevermind
00:36:13	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> SUCESS
00:36:39	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> Now I need to build nim using nim
00:38:06	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> Oh no, koch complains
00:38:25	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> CC: compiler_koch Error: unhandled exception: No such file or directory Additional info: Could not find command: '/bin/sh'. OS error: No such file or directory [OSError]
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01:10:07	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> Wow, Nim also supports snake_case
01:10:40	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> I find it useful: you can have snake case locally, but commit with camelCase
01:19:38	ftsf	i take it you got your nim running on android?
01:20:57	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> Yeah, but I will contribute to Termux packages anyway
01:23:05	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> Hmm seems it can't run
01:24:48	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> The issue is that bash in Termux located in /data/data/com.termux/files/usr/bin/bash (because /bin/bash is root-writable only, and it's not easy to get root on some android phones)
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01:52:56	ftsf	scripts looking for #!/bin/bash ?
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11:02:09	sleepy998	what does 'illegal capture' mean?
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11:02:27	sleepy998	did the compiler go poaching?
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11:05:41	sleepy998	i have a proc with object param (mc), used as a member function. mc.foo() the fn sets some members: mc.x = 3, etc. so, does the mc param need to be declared 'var'?
11:07:28	sleepy998	the compiler doesn't mind its absence.. is var just a static type checking thing, or can its absence lead to run time errors?
11:08:21	sleepy998	i assumed i didn't need it, and it's an {.async.} proc.. i added 'var' while chasing a bug and the compiler told me 'illegal capture'
11:09:27	Araq	it means it cannot translate 'var T' in an .async context
11:09:51	sleepy998	do i need the 'var'?
11:09:56	Araq	no.
11:10:06	sleepy998	ok
11:10:21	Araq	not unless the compiler complains about mutablity issues
11:10:42	FromGitter	<vegansk> @Araq, I fixed https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/pull/5580 on windows
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11:23:31	sleepy998	why can i define procs with the same name and different params, but not the same name and different return type?
11:25:28	Araq	because 'let foo = overloadedProcHere()' would be ambiguous
11:25:54	Araq	and if your API design makes me write 'let foo: T = overloadedProcHere()', it's a stupid API design.
11:26:02	sleepy998	yeah but it would be so awesome if the compiler let me make it not ambiguous
11:26:10	sleepy998	why?
11:27:09	sleepy998	if the result already has a type defined, there's no need to specify.. if its not overloaded, theres no need to specify..
11:27:37	Araq	but you want to overload it in this fashion.
11:27:54	sleepy998	only sometimes
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11:28:35	sleepy998	let foo = initT() vs let foo:T = init() not much different
11:28:49	sleepy998	and gives more versatility
11:29:49	Araq	how do you define versatility when 'let foo = init()' is not even possible
11:30:17	sleepy998	only impossible if init is overloaded
11:31:08	Araq	"let's do A, it will only cause harm when it's actually used" is not an argument for me.
11:31:22	sleepy998	i suppose that could be a pain, adding an import to existing code, causing a new overload, breaks existing code.. hmm.
11:31:34	stisa	isn't overloading on return a planned feature? See https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/issues/1070
11:32:26	Araq	it's definitely not gonna make it into v1 and I think it's a bad idea in general.
11:32:47	Araq	note that I never said anything in this thread.
11:33:51	Araq	we don't need more ways to write constructors. the initT vs newT is simple, already everywhere and flexible.
11:34:20	Araq	and it avoids the "factory" problem that's always overlooked by the alternative proposals.
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11:49:30	zachcarter	whoa setting up cygwin and mingw-w64 is a PITA
11:49:39	zachcarter	I forgot why I hate developing on windows so much
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11:53:07	Salewski	Araq, nimsuggest highlight command seems to give no info for keywords or comments at all, and "<" is reported as a template.
11:53:20	Salewski	That may make text coloring not very easy.
11:53:47	zachcarter	Does anyone in here use Windows for Nim dev?
11:54:33	Salewski	zachcarter: I think Araq does!
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11:55:06	zachcarter	no shit...
11:55:07	cheatfate	zachcarter, check appveyor.yml in Nim's github repo
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11:55:13	zachcarter	okay
11:55:20	stisa	zachcarter I do, but I just download mingw w64, click install, add to path and it works. Maybe I'm doing simpler things than you
11:55:29	cheatfate	you will obtain link, you will obtain what you must to do with PATH and you will get it
11:55:40	zachcarter	gotcha thanks all
11:55:56	zachcarter	I’m trying to test out my game framework on all OS’s
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12:01:48	zachcarter	cheatfate: thank you for that link it’s perfect, question since you’re a contributor
12:02:21	zachcarter	I need to set up a CI solution for my project that has nim installed along with nimble and nake
12:02:30	zachcarter	would you recommend staying away from Travis?
12:02:37	zachcarter	I’ve heard horror stories
12:02:43	cheatfate	why? Travis is one of the best
12:03:09	zachcarter	okay if it’s good enough for you guys it’s good enough for me then
12:03:26	zachcarter	I’ve just heard solutions like gitlab’s seem to be superior
12:03:33	zachcarter	and people often struggle hard with Tavis
12:03:35	zachcarter	Travis*
12:03:52	cheatfate	You can ask Araq about gitlab :)
12:03:53	zachcarter	but I don’t have a lot of first hand experience with either, minimal with both
12:03:56	zachcarter	ahahaha okay
12:04:10	zachcarter	we’re already on github anyway so we’ll go with Travis :P
12:04:10	cheatfate	Travis for Linux/MacOS and appveyor for Windows
12:04:17	zachcarter	okay thanks
12:04:35	zachcarter	I may be borrowing that appveyor script
12:04:37	cheatfate	and still looking for CI for BSDs
12:04:48	zachcarter	thank god I don’t have to support bsds
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12:04:51	cheatfate	zachcarter, there other work based on appveyor.yml
12:05:16	cheatfate	https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/wiki/BuildServices
12:05:31	zachcarter	ahh thank you
12:05:42	cheatfate	but this version uses `release` version of Nim
12:05:49	cheatfate	not `devel`
12:05:56	zachcarter	okay
12:06:07	zachcarter	yeah I’ll definitely need devel
12:06:28	zachcarter	regardless thanks for pointing me to that I should be able to cobble together something
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12:07:43	Araq	saleswski I don't remember how highlight works, sorry
12:07:57	Araq	I think VS Code uses 'outline' instead
12:08:20	Araq	oh and of course keywords and comments are not nimsuggest's business at all
12:08:21	Salewski	Araq, do you not use it for your nimedit?
12:08:44	Araq	we could support it now after my recent changes
12:08:58	Araq	but in the past nimsuggest didn't touch the Nim lexer
12:09:09	Salewski	Outline command seems to give only an overview.
12:09:18	Araq	so anything the lexer knows is lost in nimsuggest
12:10:19	Araq	I personally find highlighting that goes beyond the lexing step more confusing than helpful and editors can the lexing much faster than nimsuggest
12:10:22	Salewski	I was thinking indeed about highlighting keywords locally, by using a hash table lookup. But it is not fully accurate.
12:11:42	Araq	highlighting that reflects what the language does at the lexical level is helpful. highlighting that renders types different from vars (for example) means your highlighter conflated different language spec levels.
12:11:59	Salewski	Indeed, the gtksourceview highlight is fine already. I just tested nimsuggests highlight just for fun.
12:14:10	Salewski	Do you know how fast a highlight query is for nimsuggest? It transfers very many data, so it may take a more than a millisecond?
12:15:47	Araq	yup.
12:16:04	Araq	don't run it on every single keystroke to highlight tokens
12:17:07	Salewski	Yes, I have to think about it. One single keystroke can change much in some cases...
12:17:19	Salewski	I will do some testing, bye.
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12:28:37	vivus	in: https://nim-lang.org/docs/db_mysql.html should I use raw SQL statements to search for text in specific columns ?
12:32:18	Araq	not sure what that means. use ? in your query and substitute the search term(s)
12:33:11	vivus	Araq: to clarify, should I use db.exec(sql()) to search or are there built-ins in the library ?
12:35:28	FromGitter	<brechtm> Is there something in Nim similar to Python's context managers (with statement)?
12:36:31	Araq	brechtm: use a template with body: untyped as the last parameter
12:37:30	Araq	vivus: exec doesn't even return anything. use for x in theDb.fastRows(sql"select * from myTestTbl"):
12:37:30	Araq	echo x
12:37:45	Araq	which is part of the "Larger Example" on that very page you linked
12:38:08	FromGitter	<brechtm> Araq: that doesn't make much sense to me at this point :-) But it'll do as a starting point, thanks!
12:39:00	Araq	vivus: but point taken, we should have a "Retrieving data" section
12:39:27	vivus	Araq: that is good enough for me. will use that as a basis to understand more
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12:48:17	krux02	I want to veryfy that visual studio code does not work properly with nim-include files, but I can't get the nim-plugin installying
12:48:31	krux02	I press install, but it just doesn't finish
12:48:49	krux02	is there a way, that I can see progress/log of the install of a visual studio code plugin?
12:49:05	couven92	krux02, Help -> Toggle Developer Console -> Console
12:49:46	couven92	or maybe it's Developer Tools, i'm not sure... but do a string.startsWith compare of all menu items and search for strings starting with Developer :P
12:50:29	couven92	Ah! It's "Toggle Developer Tools"
12:52:25	krux02	well I found it, and I have a German VSCode
12:52:46	krux02	but the console doesn't print anything from the install process
12:53:14	krux02	the button that was install is on 'installing' but it just doesn't finish
12:57:22	couven92	really? :O That's weird... I had some problems a while back (before I came up with vccexe)... But I could then clearly see my the erroneous configuration of system that led to the error
12:57:39	couven92	I'm uninstalling Nim from VS Code now... let's see...
12:58:16	FromGitter	<brechtm> What editor offers the most IDE-like experience (code navigation, debugger) for Nim at this moment?
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12:59:02	couven92	@brechtm I'd say VS Code
12:59:04	FromGitter	<brechtm> I'm trying VSCode now, which looks promising. Haven't tried debugging yet.
12:59:19	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> *really* I dream about good NIM plugin for IntelliJ IDEA. Yeah, IntelliJ IDEA is big, full-blown IDE with JVM
12:59:38	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> But, for example in Python world PyCharm is the most used Python IDE
12:59:49	couven92	I have plans for NimVS for Visual Studio! But that may take some weeks... :P
13:00:03	FromGitter	<brechtm> Attempting to debug, I get these kinds of error messages: "undefinedBFD: /Applications/Xcode.app/Contents/Developer/Toolchains/XcodeDefault.xctoolchain/usr/lib/arc/libarclite_macosx.a(arclite.o): unknown load command 0x2d"
13:00:05	Tiberium	couven92, sadly there's no Visual Studio for linux :(
13:00:17	Tiberium	only vscode
13:00:19	FromGitter	<brechtm> But I probably just need to build debug binaries
13:00:30	couven92	Tiberium, it's getting there though... Considering that we have VS for Mac
13:00:43	Tiberium	couven92, yeah, I believe there will be VS for linux too
13:01:10	Tiberium	because if you want to choose a full-blown IDE for any popular language - it will be an IDE from JetBrains most of the time
13:01:17	Tiberium	(I mean on Linux)
13:02:19	couven92	I can see that... Well, I have the luxury that I have always developed on Windows and that I mainly program in C#... And I have to say: VS and C# on Windows is AWESOME!
13:02:49	Tiberium	couven92, btw, there's new C# IDE from JetBrains
13:03:21	krux02	well nim plugin for visual studio code is still installing
13:03:21	couven92	Yeah... I have seen it... Not thoroughly looked at it yet, though
13:03:25	krux02	doesn't seem to finish
13:03:57	krux02	I can tell you, when you develop enough, then a good idea becomes less important for you
13:04:27	krux02	on linux the best 'IDE's are still emacs and vim if you have configured them correctly
13:04:28	couven92	krux02, do you have nimsuggest in you path? what Nim version are you using?... I'm not really sure whether that is relevant, but let's find the easy reasons first... :P
13:04:37	FromGitter	<brechtm> Do I only need `--debuginfo` to build a debug binary?
13:04:49	krux02	i have nimsuggest in my path an nim in development branch build yesterday
13:04:55	couven92	hmm...
13:05:19	couven92	does it state the nim compiler headline in the devloper tools console?
13:06:04	couven92	Mine says sth like: Nim Compiler Version 0.16.1 (2017-03-01) [Windows: amd64]
13:06:04	couven92	and so on...
13:06:25	krux02	well the plugin doesn't install, so no
13:06:34	Tiberium	couven92, wait, my VSCOde Nim plugin is working, but I don't have nimsuggest. If I install it, how can I add it to VSCode?
13:06:49	krux02	http://ix.io/pco
13:06:56	couven92	Tiberium, I think the Nim Plugin actually builds it's own nimsuggest
13:06:59	krux02	but that is command line
13:09:38	krux02	couven92, I hope not
13:09:49	couven92	Hmm... you're right... The install of the plugin is remarkably silent...
13:09:57	krux02	I have nimsuggest, and I don't want the plugin to use something else that my system nimsuggest
13:10:09	couven92	and my computer it just magically works... :/
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13:10:59	couven92	krux02, maybe log an issue on https://github.com/pragmagic/vscode-nim
13:11:11	krux02	that is what I just wanted to do
13:11:32	couven92	Hmm... because I have no better idea
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13:16:09	Tiberium	how can I add 'nake' to path if I installed it from nimble?
13:16:39	couven92	On Linux: export PATH=$HOME/.nimble/bin:$PATH
13:16:52	Tiberium	couven92, thanks
13:17:29	FromGitter	<brechtm> anyone debugging with gdb on macOS?
13:17:51	couven92	Tiberium, not that this will add ALL nimble package binaries into your PATH! :P (But yeah, you'd want that anyways)
13:17:57	FromGitter	<brechtm> Apple is making stuff diffuclt again...
13:18:00	couven92	s/not/note
13:18:01	Tiberium	couven92, I know it :)
13:18:09	Tiberium	I also installed latest Nim compiler and added it to path
13:18:15	Tiberium	(it fixed one nimx issue for me)
13:18:22	chemist69	Hi, does anyone know of a nim library to extract plain text from html?
13:19:06	krux02	ok, the issue is now submitted
13:19:07	krux02	https://github.com/pragmagic/vscode-nim/issues/47
13:19:23	krux02	chemist69, regular expressions?
13:19:50	chemist69	now I have two problems... ;-)
13:19:56	couven92	:D
13:20:04	Tiberium	wait, nim supports path / path syntax?
13:20:09	chemist69	I had hoped for a slightly more higher level solution
13:20:18	Tiberium	dir / filename
13:21:20	krux02	chemist69, maybe you can translate html with pandoc to txt
13:21:27	krux02	never tried it, but maybe that is what you want
13:21:45	chemist69	krux02: good idea, thanks.
13:22:04	FromGitter	<Jeff-Ciesielski> Tiberium: Yes. the `os` module provides a `/` proc which aliases joinPath
13:22:23	FromGitter	<TiberiumPY> @Jeff-Ciesielski wery nice
13:23:02	Tiberium	hmm, I'm trying to install nimsuggest
13:23:04	Tiberium	it fails
13:23:18	krux02	Tiberium, it should be bundled with nim
13:23:23	FromGitter	<Varriount> Isn't nimsuggest bundled with nim now?
13:23:32	Tiberium	ah I see
13:23:36	couven92	yup
13:23:38	chemist69	I thought nimsuggest is part of Nim nowadays, it is installed automatically.
13:23:46	couven92	@Varriount, yes it is
13:24:02	FromGitter	<Varriount> It's not installed with Nimble, it's just in ./tools
13:24:19	couven92	chemist69, no, it itsn't, you'll still have to run `koch tools` to build nimsuggest
13:24:41	FromGitter	<Varriount> Is `koch tools` documented?
13:24:51	chemist69	ok, right, yeah I have a script that does that every time I update Nim.
13:25:28	Tiberium	how can I install compiled nim system-wide?
13:25:51	couven92	@Varriount, well depends... If you run `koch --help` it says: `tools builds Nim related tools`
13:26:33	couven92	Tiberium, on Linux: `./koch geninstall && sudo ./install.sh`
13:26:52	Tiberium	couven92, thanks again :)
13:27:30	krux02	can I disable linenoise in nimsuggest?
13:27:47	couven92	(Proceed with caution though! Maybe split it it up into two commands, I am a Windows guy giving suggestion on how to do stuff on Linux!!! :P )
13:28:16	couven92	krux02, what's linenoise?
13:28:50	krux02	well that is a very poor library that lets you input a line on the command line
13:29:11	krux02	normally gnu readline is used, but for licensing issued, it was replaced by linenoise.
13:29:33	krux02	but linenoise doesn't even have basic file completion
13:29:56	krux02	would prefer to have no line editor and start nimsuggest with rlwrap
13:30:11	krux02	rlwrap is a shell script that wraps any program to use gnu readline
13:30:29	krux02	as long as it doesn't do anything on it's own to provide line editing
13:32:46	couven92	Hmmm... Ask Araq?
13:32:50	couven92	:P
13:33:11	Tiberium	very newbie question, but how to pass html from httpclient.getContent to parseHtml in htmlparse?
13:33:55	FromGitter	<brechtm> great, got debugging to work in VSCode!
13:34:28	couven92	@brechtm Cool! On Linux using the GDB integration?
13:34:48	FromGitter	<brechtm> @couven92 macOS using GDB
13:35:25	onionhammer	nim has a gitter now!? :-O
13:35:37	FromGitter	<brechtm> Needed to codesign the gdb executable though (https://sourceware.org/gdb/wiki/BuildingOnDarwin)
13:35:41	krux02	well I can enable linenoise for "nim secret"
13:36:05	krux02	that means "rlwrap nim secret" is awesome
13:36:16	FromGitter	<brechtm> can't see any variables though...
13:36:18	couven92	Nice! :) I think step-by-step debugging using the VS Debugger in Windows is possible, but probably a long way down the road... I'll have to set aside time to write my MSc. as well I am afraid... :/
13:36:30	demi-	brechtm, i would highly recommend not using GDB
13:36:38	demi-	use LLDB instead
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13:37:10	krux02	brechtm: you can have some gdb support, when you put some python scripts
13:37:13	couven92	demi-, that uses LLVM?
13:37:16	cheatfate	demi-, could i ask you for help
13:37:27	cheatfate	?
13:37:33	FromGitter	<brechtm> @demi- why, and how would I go about it (a webpage reference would be fine)
13:37:56	krux02	I don't think you want to fuzz with that stuff, but I one did something to get gdb know a bit more about nim, but very far away from being ready
13:37:57	demi-	couven92: yeah, GDB is not officially supported on OS X anymore, been that way for ages. LLDB comes with the xcode command line tools, which you presumably have for building nim and homebrew stuff
13:38:27	krux02	https://github.com/krux02/opengl-sandbox/blob/master/includes/nim-gdb.py
13:38:27	couven92	Hmm... interesting...
13:38:30	demi-	cheatfate: sure, what's up? (don't have much time atm but can answer what i can)
13:38:45	krux02	https://github.com/krux02/opengl-sandbox/blob/master/includes/debug.nim
13:38:56	krux02	the last file to embed the python script into the executable
13:39:05	krux02	does only work on systems with elf files
13:39:09	cheatfate	demi-, i need your debugging skills on macos, to resolve coroutine's fail on tests/coroutines/twait.nim
13:39:17	krux02	I think that just excludes windows
13:39:47	demi-	heh, cheatfate if it is alright with you i might need to postpone that to a bit later, about to go look at some apartments so will be AFK for a bit.
13:40:00	cheatfate	ok
13:40:13	demi-	but i'd be happy to help with what i can
13:40:56	krux02	apple is very fast at dropping support for things that basically everybody relies on
13:41:04	FromGitter	<brechtm> @demi- Nice, using lldb-mi in VSCode does list variables
13:41:17	krux02	flash, openGL, gdb, ...
13:41:35	FromGitter	<brechtm> thanks for the tip
13:42:14	demi-	krux02: apple hasn't officially supported GDB for like 10 years?
13:42:18	FromGitter	<brechtm> inspection of object attributes doesn't seem to be possible...
13:42:26	demi-	this isn't new
13:42:30	cheatfate	demi-, thanks
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13:42:46	Tiberium	how can I make httpclient to output page body as utf8?
13:42:46	krux02	demi-, well the latest openGL version that apple supports is 7 years
13:42:53	krux02	whatever that means
13:43:18	Tiberium	cyrillic text looks like this: � ������� �����������
13:43:38	krux02	Tiberium, what http client?
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13:43:42	demi-	brechtm, other thing i would suggest is ensuring you have debugging info enabled with the nim compiler
13:43:47	Tiberium	krux02, nim's httpclient
13:43:50	Tiberium	source code - http://pastebin.ca/3784890
13:43:56	Araq	httpclient doesn't output text
13:44:04	FromGitter	<brechtm> @demi- `--debuginfo`?
13:44:12	Tiberium	Araq, not exactly httpclient
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13:44:19	Tiberium	Araq, http://pastebin.ca/3784890 how can I output utf8 text there?
13:44:26	demi-	you should be able to get everything as you would get it in C, variables object introspection, breakpoints in the nim code, etc
13:44:33	demi-	brechtm, yeah i believe that is it
13:45:50	FromGitter	<brechtm> @demi- no difference with or without `--debuginfo`... so I must be doing something wrong
13:47:13	flyx	Tiberium: well the URL you query returns its data with header „Content-Type:text/html; charset=windows-1251“
13:47:14	FromGitter	<brechtm> But I'm building using a nakefile. I'll first try with a test file.
13:47:20	Tiberium	flyx, ah
13:47:22	demi-	sorry i would need to have a better idea of what you are doing and what you expect, i'm not familiar with vs-code's lldb integration so i don't know what i can say about that; i have personally used it from the command line w/o issue
13:47:28	Tiberium	flyx, so how can I decode it?
13:47:32	Tiberium	and encode to utf8
13:48:02	flyx	Tiberium: you can use the package encodings
13:48:17	Tiberium	flyx, I found it on the forum already, thanks :)
13:49:27	Tiberium	flyx, works, many thanks!
13:51:14	couven92	krux02, btw, are form Aachen? I couldn't help but notice the RWTH IP when you joined earlier...
13:51:42	krux02	yes I am in Aachen RWTH
13:51:53	krux02	why?
13:52:14	couven92	nice... I grew up there and did my Abitur in Aachen before I moved to Norway
13:52:16	couven92	:)
13:52:42	krux02	Well I live here since I made my Abitur :)
13:53:04	flyx	although arguably, this is a bug in htmlparser. parseHtml transforms entities to UTF-8-encoded characters, so it better transformed the rest of the content into UTF-8
13:53:07	krux02	but I never know that people would remember ip addresses and where thay are from
13:53:31	couven92	well for you it says: 178-169.eduroam.rwth-aachen.de
13:54:04	couven92	pretty obvious! :) And if you're a student things like eduroam automatically stand out :P
13:54:11	krux02	ok, that is obvious
13:54:49	krux02	I like eduroam
13:54:50	flyx	eduroam is also for scientists, not just for students ;)
13:55:01	krux02	I hated it in the beginning, because it was a pain the the ass to set up
13:55:07	krux02	especially on linux
13:55:11	krux02	it just always failed
13:55:25	krux02	but now it does work and it also works for example in Holland
13:55:54	flyx	my university managed to fix the process for Linux, Windows and Mac. now we can just go on a website, download stuff and it works
13:55:57	couven92	yup... eduroam is nice! Especially here in Norway, where eduroam router are also setup at all kinds of public places... Every Airport in Norway has eduroam!
13:56:17	FromGitter	<brechtm> @demi- I'm seeing variables names T1_, T2_ etc.
13:56:26	FromGitter	<brechtm> (running lldb from the command line now)
13:56:38	Tiberium	just curious, is there telegram channel for Nim programming?
13:56:55	couven92	Telgram has channels? :O
13:57:34	flyx	why is it that people are so interested in having additional channels on other chat services
13:57:50	couven92	Yeah... IRC FTW!!! :D
13:59:17	couven92	PMunch and I (we're TAs here at UiT) try to push out students to use IRC... It's our official help and support channel in the subjects where we teach! :P Some students comply... :D
14:00:00	flyx	my students just drop by at my office
14:00:16	flyx	or write Mails
14:01:06	couven92	well, ours do to... But there are times (usually around 2 a.m.) where we aren't in our office)
14:03:11	Tiberium	flyx, because IRC isn't so popular right now :(
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14:10:58	flyx	Tiberium: we had that discussion and there's the Gitter room which is bridged here
14:11:08	Tiberium	flyx, I know
14:11:11	krux02	yea irc is weird here and there
14:11:38	krux02	there is no thumb sized button to join the channel
14:11:51	krux02	you have to type /join #<channel-name>
14:13:11	krux02	and then you can't just use pictures in the chat
14:13:39	FromGitter	<brechtm> @demi- passing `--debuginfo` doesn't make a difference for me. In the global scope, all variables are named "T1_", "T2_", ... In the local scope, they have the name I assigned, but (ref) object's attributes cannot be inspected.
14:13:51	krux02	but emoji's do work, if the other side has the right font (which they don't)
14:14:09	flyx	krux02: it's accessible. people with command-line clients see the picture's URL, people with fancy clients see the picture
14:14:33	krux02	what clients do support pictures?
14:14:39	flyx	Textual
14:14:48	krux02	I have hexchat
14:14:55	flyx	the other fancy OSX client as well, though I don't remember the name
14:14:59	flyx	Linkinus, was it
14:15:51	krux02	I can't find those in the AUR
14:15:58	flyx	well they are OSX only
14:16:10	krux02	well that does not help very much
14:16:25	krux02	I mean I sit in between two unused imacs
14:16:31	FromGitter	<brechtm> @demi- plain objects can be inspected though
14:16:38	flyx	I guess people wanting fancy IRC clients are expected to use Macs.
14:16:56	flyx	perhaps there are alternatives, but I don't know about them
14:18:14	flyx	anyway, we're going quite off-topic
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14:18:51	lounge-user82	krux02 here, trying out another client can you send me nude pics please?
14:19:48	krux02	lounge-user82, random image: https://raw.githubusercontent.com/wiki/ocornut/imgui/web/code_sample_01.png
14:20:04	lounge-user82	oh year it works, thank you
14:20:16	*	lounge-user82 quit (Client Quit)
14:20:25	krux02	yea sorry for spamming here
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14:21:39	krux02	Is there documentation about nimsuggest?
14:22:20	Tiberium	I know this is too much for a compiled language, but will be there some fancy formatting like f'{a+b}' in Python? so maybe these expressions will be unpacked at compile-time
14:24:17	stisa	There's https://nim-lang.org/docs/nimsuggest.html
14:29:27	stisa	Tiberium : like https://nim-lang.org/docs/strutils.html#%,string,openArray[string] ? your example would be " $1 " % [$(a+b)] I think
14:30:25	Tiberium	stisa, oh, thanks, but something like "#{a+b}" looks cleaner :) anyway, as I said, it's too much for a compiled language
14:32:20	flyx	Tiberium: you can write a macro to do something like that
14:32:28	Tiberium	flyx, wow
14:35:37	stisa	well, $(a+b) would stringify the result of a+b, the problem is if you want "result: $(a+b)" you have to do "result:" & $(a+b) or something like that
14:43:31	def-	Tiberium: https://lyro.bitbucket.io/strfmt/
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14:48:46	federico3	"interp" is really nice
14:50:52	couven92	krux02, Araq tasked med with re-writing the nimsuggest documentation the day before yesterday...
14:51:56	couven92	I'll get to it as fast as I can, meanwhile you can mind-merge https://nim-lang.org/docs/nimc.html#nim-idetools-integration and https://nim-lang.org/docs/nimsuggest.html to get a better understanding of what nimsuggest can do
14:53:34	couven92	otherwise go to nim-lang IRC logs and see Araq and me discussing nimsuggest on https://irclogs.nim-lang.org/21-03-2017.html#08:32:51
14:53:54	krux02	well from the command line I can actually get the correct output from nimsuggest for my file
14:54:05	krux02	it is just that the information I got was simply wrong
14:54:12	Araq	Tiberium: f"{a+b}" is a macro away
14:54:32	krux02	I could not just pass the path of the project I needed to pass the exact root file of the project otherwise it did not work
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14:55:25	Tiberium	Araq, but I'm a newbie, I think this will be too hard for me:)
14:55:34	flyx	Tiberium: proof of concept: https://gist.github.com/flyx/21623fabc89e84f0dbc3dd7e225bc227
14:55:38	krux02	and when I press Ctrl+D in interactive mode, nimsuggest becomes weird
14:55:46	Tiberium	flyx, wow
14:56:17	Tiberium	flyx, wait, will this evaluate at runtime or at compile-time?
14:57:00	Tiberium	it actually works like python's
14:57:08	FromGitter	<andreaferretti> tiberium, as others have mentioned, the macro was already written: https://lyro.bitbucket.io/strfmt/#how-interp-works
14:57:16	flyx	Tiberium: the last line gets rewritten at compile time to `echo "$1 + $2 = $3" % [$a, $b, $(a + b)]` which will be evaluated at runtime
14:57:59	krux02	I also hava a macro like that: https://github.com/krux02/opengl-sandbox/blob/master/includes/macroutils.nim#L78
14:58:17	vivus	the more time you spend here, the more you realize that nim is likely to move towards Pythons direction in terms of code simplicity
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14:59:07	krux02	well I do not only care about code simplicity, but I do also care about performance
14:59:24	krux02	and I do not like very much that the printing creates a lot of temporary strings
15:00:16	def-	flyx: no, interp is transformed to fmt and fmt is also evaluated at compile time: https://lyro.bitbucket.io/strfmt/#how-fmt-works
15:00:18	couven92	krux02, so you don't like format strings in C's printf either?
15:00:47	flyx	def-: I am talking about my code
15:01:15	def-	flyx: ah, ok
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15:03:33	flyx	this was more for showing how it's done. it obviously is not production-quality
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15:08:26	Araq	parseutils.interpolatedFragments
15:08:36	Araq	pity that nobody is aware of it ;-)
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15:13:45	krux02	couven92, I think format strings in C are fine, because they work without temporary strings
15:14:13	couven92	hmmm...
15:14:14	krux02	all arguments of printf are passed as the argument itself, they are not first converted to a temporary string
15:14:17	couven92	I see...
15:15:26	Araq	krux02: thats an argument for system.echof :-)
15:15:44	krux02	a lot of temporary strings consume time for allocation, and because they still are allocated on a garbage collected heap, they also consume time for the garbage collector
15:16:05	krux02	I have never used system.echof
15:18:11	krux02	I think the best string interpolation would accept a first argument for output channel
15:18:23	Araq	no, it's argument for having something like echof
15:18:36	krux02	the equivalent of sprintf and fprintf
15:18:39	Araq	there is no echof in system right now.
15:18:51	krux02	Ah ok
15:19:06	Araq	oh sprintf is just addf
15:19:29	krux02	Araq: if it is the addf that I remember, then almost
15:19:39	Araq	once concepts land in Nim, it can take a general 'sink' concept
15:19:45	krux02	addf creates temporary strings for all arguments
15:19:55	Araq	does it?
15:20:01	Araq	it shouldn't
15:20:27	Araq	I think we should optimize the array construction
15:20:35	krux02	https://nim-lang.org/docs/strutils.html#addf,string,string,varargs%5Bstring,%5D
15:21:11	krux02	from the documentation varargs[string, `$`], creates a temporary string for each argument
15:21:35	Araq	no it does $arg
15:21:50	Araq	and $ for strings is a nop
15:22:20	Araq	so ok, if you pass integers and floats, it's a bit bad and should be done as a macro then
15:22:23	krux02	for string it is nop, but for integers it is not a nop
15:22:49	krux02	and basically anything else than a string
15:23:48	krux02	it would be fancy if all `$` overrides could magically be used to create a string at the end of another string
15:24:29	krux02	but I doubt it, because the result variable is required to be initialized with at leat ""
15:25:06	Araq	yeah, that is in fact still in the planning phase
15:25:35	Araq	the problem is that proc x(...; result: var string) can be easily transformed into proc x(...): string
15:25:44	Araq	but not the other way round
15:26:27	Araq	turning void procs into expressions would be a superb rewrite rule
15:26:43	Araq	but it has to be done in the language to be feasible
15:27:49	krux02	and it does not handle format parameters
15:28:41	krux02	I think about a general proc format(out: sink; format: stringview; value T)
15:30:11	krux02	then something like this could be possile stdout.echof("my matrix: \n%2.2$mymatrix \n TADA!!!")
15:30:53	krux02	sink is either `var string` or a stream like stdin/stdout
15:31:17	krux02	strigview is like openarray[char]
15:31:33	krux02	but with the difference that it can point into a string
15:32:02	Araq	as if I couldn't imagine
15:32:03	krux02	and in this case it would just be the "2.2" part for ``mymatrix``
15:32:35	krux02	yea you know, I already made a suggestion for the general pointer size pair
15:32:44	krux02	this would be a nice use case
15:34:31	krux02	And I don't need a concept would be necessary for this feature
15:36:09	*	Tiberium quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
15:37:55	krux02	type sink = File | string
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15:43:15	Tiberium	ok, so I will start learning nim with rewriting my social network bot in Nim (originally it was written in Python)
15:44:06	Sentreen	Could it be that the profiler module is broken? Just want to be sure I'm not doing something stupid before I submit an issue.
15:44:17	Sentreen	$ nim build -d:release --profiler:on --stackTrace:on dre
15:44:19	Sentreen	lib/system/profiler.nim(92, 23) Error: undeclared identifier: 'framePtr'
15:47:48	Araq	do you import profiler?
15:47:53	Araq	cause you must not.
15:48:13	Sentreen	Nope, only nimprof
15:50:40	Sentreen	It seems to work for a minmal example though, so there might be something wrong in my nims file
15:52:05	yglukhov	there's a bug in profiler.
15:52:29	yglukhov	its code should be wrapped into stacktrace:off, afair
15:53:07	Tiberium	how can I convert things like \u0414\u0430\u043D\u0438\u0438\u043B to normal string?
15:53:35	Tiberium	ah
15:53:39	Tiberium	it's because of json
15:53:39	Sentreen	yglukhov: Any idea if I can work around this somehow?
15:55:57	yglukhov	i managed to fix it a couple of months ago, but never made a pr because it was done on my teammates machine. those changes are lost now. but they were rather trivial. but i dont remember exactly =))
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16:03:51	Tiberium	That's the preferred paste service for this IRC channel?
16:04:59	Tiberium	*What's ?
16:06:04	krux02	def-, I just realized I talked a lot about stuff you aready linked too :/
16:06:28	krux02	that is pretty exactly what I want in the standard library for nim
16:06:37	*	couven92 quit (Quit: Leaving)
16:06:39	def-	Tiberium: gist.github.com or pastebin I guess
16:06:48	*	couven92 joined #nim
16:06:54	Tiberium	Why this code throws an exception? http://pastebin.com/YbK1HPZ9
16:07:15	Tiberium	Error: unhandled exception: node.kind == JObject [AssertionError]
16:08:01	Tiberium	I get an exception only if I'm trying to iterate over resp at lines 13 and 14
16:08:21	def-	Well node is probably not a JObject
16:08:31	def-	but some other JSON stuff
16:08:36	Tiberium	ah
16:08:38	cheatfate	krux02, do you know that printf() has limitation on size of generated output? and this limitation can vary for any stdlib/os?
16:09:01	*	vlad1777d quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
16:09:03	cheatfate	last time i checked windows version is limited to something like 1024-2048 bytes
16:09:29	krux02	no I did not know that
16:09:39	krux02	why is that?
16:10:03	cheatfate	because most of printf() implementation has something like char buffer[2048]; inside of function
16:10:41	krux02	and the buffer can not be too big because recently someone told me the stack on windows is only about one MB in size
16:11:02	*	arnetheduck quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
16:11:25	cheatfate	somebody was wrong... stack of size depends on compiler/linker and information about stack size stored in PE header
16:11:28	krux02	at least i did not have a problem with that yet
16:12:34	krux02	cheatfate, that guy who told it actually knows a lot, but that doesn't protect from being wrong
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16:13:00	krux02	but he didn't say it like it was always the case, he was talking about the default
16:13:21	krux02	maybe it is just me who is reflecting it incorrectly
16:14:03	cheatfate	right now i have opened 3 PE executables and all 3 has different stack sizes
16:14:29	cheatfate	so if you need more you can get more stack easily
16:16:29	krux02	well I never managed stack size
16:16:38	krux02	I neven even looked up any stack size
16:16:44	krux02	it was always just enough
16:16:56	krux02	but I am on Linux, maybe that is a difference
16:17:35	FromGitter	<brechtm> Does Nim have an equivalent of Python's super()?
16:20:53	krux02	brechtm, I think you have to use cast ant proccall
16:21:29	Tiberium	How to convert JSON object to Nim object? I want to create a library to work with website API
16:21:40	krux02	https://nim-lang.org/docs/system.html#procCall,expr
16:21:54	rauss	Tiberium: https://nim-lang.org/docs/json.html
16:22:27	Tiberium	rauss, so I need to convert ALL fields manually?
16:22:38	krux02	Tiberium, json alone does not give you types
16:22:39	rauss	No idea, I just linked you to it
16:23:03	Tiberium	krux02, for example, I want to convert my json to object (so all json's fields will be strings)
16:23:16	FromGitter	<brechtm> @krux02 thanks, but that doesn't allow automatically determining the superclass's method?
16:23:22	rauss	It's a starting point for what you need, but you might need a light wrapper around it
16:24:26	krux02	there is the fields and fieldPairs iterator
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16:24:49	krux02	so you can use that to set all fields of your types from json
16:25:21	krux02	brechtm, yes you still need to cast manually
16:25:45	krux02	brechtm, I guess you could write a macro that does super for you :P
16:29:39	krux02	macros.getTypeImpl and then in that tree you get you probably have a symbol to the parent object
16:31:09	Tiberium	is there any examples of a libraries which do stuff with some JSON web api's?
16:38:37	FromGitter	<brechtm> @krux02 should be easy enough, since there is no multiple inheritance... but would I need to search the AST?
16:39:18	flyx	Tiberium: you can convert JSON to Nim objects directly with nimyaml.org, look at the JSON example
16:39:30	krux02	just print the treeRepr of the type and then you will see if you can use something
16:41:20	Tiberium	flyx, oh, very nice! and what about json like {"response":actual json data} ?
16:41:32	Tiberium	sure I can remove it using slices
16:43:48	flyx	Tiberium: you mean like, `actual json data` being some deep JSON construct?
16:44:00	Tiberium	flyx, yeah
16:44:11	Tiberium	simplest example: {"response":[{"id":210700286,"first_name":"Lindsey","last_name":"Stirling"}]}
16:44:12	flyx	Tiberium: define a matching type hierarchy in Nim
16:44:57	flyx	for example, type Person = object ; id: int ; first_name: string ; last_name: string
16:45:14	Tiberium	flyx, yeah I've done that
16:45:22	flyx	type MyRoot = object ; response : seq[Person]
16:45:37	flyx	and then it just works
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16:47:00	FromGitter	<brechtm> @krux02 how do I get a NimNode from a type?
16:47:43	demi-	cheatfate: i'm back now
16:48:17	flyx	brechtm: getType(int)
16:48:39	krux02	brechtm you have to implement super as a macro
16:48:51	FromGitter	<brechtm> thanks!
16:48:53	flyx	brechtm: there's also getTypeInst and getTypeImpl depending on what you need
16:48:53	krux02	then you have already a nimNode in your argument
16:49:10	krux02	you should just use getTypeImpl in your case
16:49:43	krux02	getTypeInst is the generic expression of the type and getTypeImpl is the actual implemenation
16:49:51	krux02	and getType should be deprecated
16:49:55	krux02	in my opinion
16:50:00	krux02	no need to keep it
16:50:49	FromGitter	<brechtm> doesn't work on refs, I suppose...
16:50:53	krux02	and then you should get an ast that has somewhere a symbol
16:51:03	krux02	brechtm: it does
16:51:11	krux02	you need to have a typed macro
16:51:21	FromGitter	<brechtm> Error: request to generate code for .compileTime proc: treeRepr
16:51:46	krux02	yes I told you, you have to implement it in a macro
16:51:54	krux02	you can't operate on nimNode at runtime
16:52:05	krux02	NimNodes don't exist anymore at runtime
16:52:07	FromGitter	<brechtm> aha
16:52:45	FromGitter	<brechtm> down the rabbit hole...
16:52:59	Tiberium	flyx, oh, thanks!
16:53:03	krux02	macro super(arg: typed): untyped = ...
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16:53:31	Tiberium	thanks god
16:53:37	Tiberium	there's JSON schema for this API
16:53:43	Tiberium	so I can autogenerate all API types
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16:57:35	flyx	Tiberium: you can also tell YAML to ignore parts of the JSON by calling ignoreInputKey(MyRoot, "response")
16:57:44	flyx	Tiberium: if you don't need those values
16:57:56	Tiberium	flyx, wow, thanks again! I'm not afraid now
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17:02:10	FromGitter	<brechtm> @krux02 I'm not sure what I'm doing here: macro super(typ: typedesc): untyped = echo treeRepr(getTypeImpl(typ))
17:03:07	FromGitter	<brechtm> The output produced by "super(Ship)" seems very simple: ⏎ ⏎ ```BracketExpr ⏎ Sym "typeDesc" ⏎ Sym "Ship"``` [https://gitter.im/nim-lang/Nim?at=58d3ffca01bcf42439a5c094]
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17:04:16	FromGitter	<brechtm> I should read up on macro's...
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17:25:57	krux02	brechtm: http://ix.io/pcG
17:28:37	FromGitter	<brechtm> @krux02 thanks... doesn't give the same result with C = ref object ...
17:28:52	krux02	that's true
17:29:21	krux02	it might be that you have to write a bit of massage code, to handle ref type cases
17:30:10	FromGitter	<brechtm> @krux02 how could I change this to accept an object type name instead of an instance?
17:30:52	krux02	well try it,just try out a lot of stuff
17:31:03	krux02	and echo treeRepr
17:31:26	krux02	what is treeRepr when you pass a typedesc?
17:32:41	FromGitter	<brechtm> What I pasted above: BracketExpr / Sym Sym
17:33:03	FromGitter	<brechtm> I was thinking getImpl() might be useful here
17:33:12	FromGitter	<brechtm> But I'm not getting at the Sym yet
17:34:17	krux02	echo typ.getTypeImpl[1].getTypeImpl.treeRepr
17:35:50	FromGitter	<brechtm> ah, got it
17:36:30	FromGitter	<brechtm> macro super(typ: typedesc): untyped = ⏎ ⏎ ``` var node = getTypeImpl(typ) ⏎ echo treeRepr(getImpl(node[1].symbol))``` [https://gitter.im/nim-lang/Nim?at=58d4079d01bcf42439a5c115]
17:37:10	FromGitter	<Varriount> Don't we already have a super() for methods?
17:37:25	FromGitter	<brechtm> ugh, your brackets didn't make it through the IRC-Gitter bridge
17:39:00	dom96	wow, that's weird. It turns it into a link to: https://github.com/sanctuary-js/sanctuary-def#NullaryType
17:39:03	dom96	BlaXpirit: ^
17:39:43	FromGitter	<brechtm> Running late... thanks for AST 101 krux02 ;-)
17:41:03	FromGitter	<brechtm> @Varriount no matches for "super" in the manual. Would love to hear about it though.
17:42:37	FromGitter	<Varriount> @brechtm Bah. Darn lack of documentation.
17:43:40	FromGitter	<Varriount> @Araq What's the Nim equivalent of 'super' for multi-methods?
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17:44:36	dom96	typeinfo.base I guess
17:45:10	dom96	I would suggest avoiding methods if at all possible
17:55:16	FromGitter	<brechtm> dom96 even if doing OOP? This isn't the first time I hear that recommendation. Why is the feature present?
17:57:40	FromGitter	<brechtm> @dom96 How would I use typeinfo.base in practise? Got an example?
17:59:01	FromGitter	<brechtm> Oh, nm, the base proc from the typeinfo module of course :-)
18:00:46	FromGitter	<Varriount> @brechtm Often, you can use templates/generics instead of the traditional OO mechanisms of inheritance and run-timte overloading.
18:00:50	FromGitter	<Varriount> *run-time
18:01:26	FromGitter	<Varriount> Also, the current typeinfo module has the defect that it gets the compile-time type of a value, not it's run-time type.
18:03:12	FromGitter	<Varriount> For example, if `ref Y` inherits from `ref X`, and you pass a `ref Y` value to a procedure expecting `ref X`, and that procedure uses typetraits to get the type of the parameter, the type will be `ref X`
18:03:52	FromGitter	<brechtm> I see. I'll have to explore templates/generics...
18:04:15	FromGitter	<Varriount> (Fixing/adding that to the typetraits module would probably be welcome)
18:07:02	jivank_	dom96: on jester's todo list, will sendFile be more efficient than readFile in terms of GC?
18:12:51	krux02	emacs nim-mode stoped working for me today, yay
18:13:18	krux02	I just created an issue about that, but can anybody help me to track that problem down?
18:13:40	krux02	https://github.com/nim-lang/nim-mode/issues/154
18:15:23	dom96	Varriount: brechtm: A more appropriate alternative would be object variants, not templates/generics.
18:15:37	FromGitter	<oprypin> gonna test this again
18:15:38	dom96	jivank_: I don't think so.
18:15:40	FromGitter	<oprypin> *<krux02>* echo typ.getTypeImpl[1].getTypeImpl.treeRepr
18:15:54	FromGitter	<oprypin> look, it's freakin gitter, not my bot
18:16:07	FromGitter	<oprypin> literally turns \[1\] into a random link
18:16:12	FromGitter	<oprypin> [1] [2] [3]
18:16:12	dom96	haha
18:16:29	dom96	Wait.
18:16:42	dom96	This seems oddly specific.
18:16:47	demi-	does gitter use markdown formatting?
18:16:51	FromGitter	<oprypin> yes
18:16:52	demi-	because that would do it
18:17:11	BlaXpirit	by the way i'm "oprypin" on github
18:17:14	zachcarter	is https://github.com/nim-lang/oldwinapi the windows API wrapper I should be using?
18:17:19	dom96	https://gist.github.com/dom96/f26a7c5ffacf10945449ab6d39060a71
18:17:25	dom96	GitHub doesn't turn it into a link
18:17:47	zachcarter	or is there a "newwinapi"
18:17:51	BlaXpirit	gitter has a totally different implementation
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18:18:04	dom96	Of course.
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18:19:16	dom96	Looks like all it needs is a dot before or after the [1]
18:19:28	krux02	demi-, I just checked it in my gitter to irc bridge, and there the [1] just works fine
18:19:45	krux02	so it is the representation of the text on gitter, no in the bridge
18:20:42	krux02	if the [1] would have been eaten on the bridge, then I would not be able to see it when I bridge gitter back to irc
18:20:43	FromGitter	<oprypin> testing[1]
18:21:30	FromGitter	<oprypin> look, basically gitter has a kind of a vulnerability where if you type something\[1\] you get a random link from some previous message. i just typed that example.org link in another gitter channel
18:21:33	dom96	jivank_: Well, maybe, I think Jester just does readFile which is pretty bad when serving large files.
18:22:03	jivank_	dom96: i just tested downloading a 45MB file via public folder, ram went to 200MB. then i called a route that has GC_fullCollect, the ram went to 3MB
18:22:22	dom96	BlaXpirit: I got the "https://github.com/sanctuary-js/sanctuary-def#NullaryType" link again in another channel when doing .1.
18:22:26	stisa	zachcarter : there's https://github.com/khchen/winim and I think winlean
18:22:37	zachcarter	ah thank you stisa
18:23:20	dom96	*.[1].
18:24:54	jivank_	is there a way to set a ceiling for the GC?
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18:25:08	dom96	BlaXpirit: Guess I beat you to it? :)
18:25:14	BlaXpirit	ye
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18:31:39	demi-	does anyone want to make a nim wrapper for the github api so i don't have to?
18:33:29	Tiberium	demi-, make it please, it will be an example for me
18:33:40	demi-	:|
18:33:40	Tiberium	I want to create a wrapper for social network API
18:34:00	demi-	if you want an example, i wrote one for influxdb already
18:34:21	Tiberium	demi-, link please?
18:34:35	demi-	https://github.com/samdmarshall/influx.nim
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18:42:03	flyx	so I heard demi- will make a nim wrapper for the github api
18:42:11	demi-	hahaha
18:42:29	demi-	it is so far down the list of things i have to do, but i want one
18:42:48	flyx	I am working on moving it further up your list right now.
18:43:01	dom96	lol
18:45:17	demi-	neat, so when do you want to sync up on taking over a bunch of my existing projects? :)
18:47:11	flyx	we can do it right now. you just read the priority list of your projects to me and then I convince you that each one is worthless of your precious time. then in the end, only the github api wrapper remains.
18:47:23	demi-	hahaha
18:49:20	rauss	:D
18:50:42	flyx	I call this macro social engineering. instead of executing my plan, I explain it to you and that makes you do what would be the conclusion of my plan's execution, even though I didn't actually execute it.
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19:07:06	chemist69	Hi, I use VS Code for my Nim coding. For the first time I am looking into threads. I noticed that components from e.g. the channels module (which is implicitly imported) is not recognized by the linter. Does someone have a solution for this?
19:09:44	dom96	chemist69: Maybe putting --threads:on into a yourproject.nim.cfg file
19:10:24	chemist69	ah yes, should have thought of that. Thanks, dom96.
19:12:22	Tiberium	chemist69, vscode uses nimsuggest under the hood
19:12:30	Tiberium	(for nim)
19:13:58	chemist69	yes, I know that. Linting works great for "normal" code. dom96 had the solution for the problem.
19:15:26	chemist69	on that occasion I also have to say that nimsuggest has greatly improved over the past weeks. Great job!
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19:24:18	Araq	chemist69: oh thanks :-)
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19:28:23	Salewski	Araq, when my testfile imports opengl and compiles fine, which name should I give to nimsuggest from command line for checking opengl module? See
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19:28:30	Salewski	last post in https://forum.nim-lang.org/t/2829/1#17979
19:29:07	Salewski	chk opengl.nim:0:0 does not work
19:29:51	Salewski	I think I also tried full path to opengl.nim, but was not working.
19:30:58	Salewski	This was related to issue https://github.com/nim-lang/nimsuggest/issues/55 -- I do not really use opengl currently, just testing nimsuggest.
19:32:46	Salewski	When testing from within my editor I got that wrong recursive import message
19:34:02	Araq	salewski: looking into it.
19:34:18	Araq	in theory you handle it the opengl module for checking the opengl module
19:34:33	Salewski	Thanks.
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19:45:58	jivank_	i dont know much about the subject, but would using https://nim-lang.org/docs/asyncnet.html#send,AsyncSocket,pointer,int (send method that takes pointer) be better than the send proc that takes string? memory wise?
19:46:53	jivank_	dom96
19:47:41	dom96	Not significantly.But your problem is that the memory never gets deallocated, correct?
19:48:16	jivank_	well for example if i wanted to use arduino yun that has 64mb of ram, it wouldn't be able to serve a 45mb file
19:50:25	demi-	Araq: fwiw, i tried out the llvm thread sanitizer library and that worked out of the box with nim, afaik.
19:50:46	jivank_	dom96: ideally, if jester could serve files without going over ~10MB of RAM that would be ideal.
19:51:29	dom96	jivank_: I'll see what I can do for you :)
19:51:55	jivank_	dom96 :D
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19:52:47	jivank_	i am working on a web filemanager, where you can easily share a folder from any device
19:53:48	jivank_	like python -m SimpleHTTPServer/http.server but little more fancier
19:57:29	demi-	having a lower memory footprint would be nice, my instance of jester is now at ~500MB after 4 days of serving content.
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19:59:50	def-	demi-: that sounds like a bug
20:00:01	def-	if you don't keep growing some seq or something
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20:00:31	demi-	i get a fair amount of traffic, right now it is only serving static content, so it shouldn't be doing anything like that
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20:09:24	jivank_	what frontend js framework do you guys recommend?
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20:09:51	jivank_	maybe that is somewhat inline with nim's values, if that exists
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20:33:10	dom96	Well, it still uses a rather large amount of RAM
20:33:18	dom96	But it is still much better
20:34:29	BlaXpirit	dom96, basically they know about that problem from earlier on gitter but haven't done anything about it in over a year[1]
20:36:06	jivank_	dom96, using buffer pointer instead of string?
20:36:16	dom96	no, using asyncfile
20:36:22	dom96	hrm, actually
20:36:33	dom96	I know why it still uses so much RAM
20:38:17	jivank_	:D why is that?
20:38:41	dom96	because the future stream buffer is being filled up faster than it is read from
20:38:57	def-	dom96: is that something new?
20:39:07	dom96	future streams? yeah
20:40:47	dom96	But unfortunately I don't have time to implement a storage limit mechanism for them
20:41:20	dom96	jivank_: If you want to try what I just implemented you will need jester (devel branch which I just created) and Nim (devel branch as well).
20:41:57	jivank_	alright ill give it a shot
20:42:39	dom96	But there is definitely a GC issue in here too
20:44:13	dom96	In case you or anybody else is interested in how I implemented it: https://github.com/dom96/jester/commit/6c6b49be2790816c4bde0042970974febacd6485
20:48:32	jivank_	nice i'm taking a look at it
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21:33:57	zachcarter	yay frag works with windows now!
21:34:16	zachcarter	so the game framework now can target osx, linux, windows and android
21:34:38	zachcarter	do I add iOS or go back to actually working on the game framework now :P
21:34:56	Tiberium	zachcarter, latter :)
21:35:19	zachcarter	:) I think so too, I need to add texture atlases
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21:39:15	Tiberium	wow, without any hassle - 12kb hello world, just used --opt:size -d:release, then strip -s test, and then upx test (without specifying level of compression)
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21:58:29	FromGitter	<brechtm> @dom96, @Varriount I'm of course biased since I'm new to the concepts of generics and object variants, but I have the impression that full OO using multi-methods is more powerful/versatile than those techniques. Why not use full OO if it's available. One reason could be performance, I assume. But I can't imagine dynamic dispatch ever being the bottleneck...
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22:02:17	demi-	not sure how you can have dynamic dispatch and type safety tho
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22:23:26	FromGitter	<brechtm> Are object variants also available in other languages?
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22:34:26	FromGitter	<brechtm> @demi- because types can't be checked at compile-time?
22:35:16	demi-	if you want dynamic dispatch that badly, you can use dynamic languages, or there is swift that does both
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22:41:06	dom96	While it's available it is not used as much. OO has its place but it often is overused because it's so prevalent.
22:41:49	FromGitter	<brechtm> @demi- it's just what I'm used to
22:42:05	dom96	Functional programming languages don't offer OO features and yet are pretty powerful and versatile.
22:42:24	ldlework	I've come to learn OO is just a method of convient cache storage
22:42:37	ldlework	take away the object and the automaticp passing of state
22:42:44	ldlework	well, doesn't mean you magically don't -need- to do that anymore
22:42:48	ldlework	you just have to do it manually now
22:43:05	FromGitter	<brechtm> I'll take this opportunity to learn about generics and object variants
22:43:15	FromGitter	<brechtm> I have used C++ templates before, but ... you know
22:43:55	dom96	Keep this in mind as well: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Composition_over_inheritance
22:44:43	FromGitter	<brechtm> @ldlework "you just have to do it manually" - I can just go back to C and do everything manually, no?
22:45:20	ldlework	I don't understand the question. Its phrased as if something I said is refuted by the idea that C doesn't have object services.
22:45:43	ldlework	Yes, you can use C and do manually the things that the C language does not do for you.
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22:47:56	FromGitter	<brechtm> @dom96 but it still makes sense using inheritance, no? It just depends on which problem you want to solve.
22:48:36	dom96	Sure. There are problems for which inheritance is a natural solution.
22:49:22	FromGitter	<brechtm> It is also often said that you should not use multiple inheritance. Yes, it can be very complex. But if used well it is very powerful.
22:49:39	dom96	Nim doesn't support multiple inheritance
22:49:51	FromGitter	<brechtm> I'm painfully aware :-)
22:50:01	demi-	neither does objective-c, and i can happily say i am very glad about this
22:50:31	FromGitter	<brechtm> @demo- you don't *have* to use it, if it had, you know :-)
22:52:15	demi-	i actually have a negative desire to even have it tbh
22:53:37	FromGitter	<brechtm> @demi- So you have bad experiences with it? In which language?
22:54:16	demi-	i have never experienced a time where i was solving a problem in code and said "you know what could have made this easier? multiple inheritance"
22:54:32	demi-	with that line of thought more often than not you are making things too complex
22:55:41	FromGitter	<brechtm> of course, the fact that you never use it may be a reason that you don't think of it...
22:57:20	FromGitter	<brechtm> I use it quite often in Python. Only now and then I do run into some confusion when using super().
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23:04:41	dom96	What do you use it for?
23:05:09	Araq	pathlib.
23:05:59	Araq	I used to think a path is maybe a distinct string or a list of path components or just a string. Now I know it's a specialization of PosixPathLike and PathLike
23:06:10	Araq	:P
23:07:49	Demos	multiple inheratance gets fairly complex to implement
23:08:54	ldlework	The only time I have used multiple inheritence on purpose is when a library provided a mixin
23:09:02	ldlework	And it worked as designed, etc
23:09:28	ldlework	I can conceive of its problems, but then again, Python despite its rounded corners is a language made for consenting adults as they say
23:09:51	ldlework	for better or worse!
23:10:43	Demos	it's different for python though
23:11:03	Demos	like everything is a hashtable so multiple inheratance is more straightforward
23:11:16	FromGitter	<brechtm> @dom96 One example: https://github.com/brechtm/rinohtype/blob/master/src/rinoh/paragraph.py#L339 - I use classes to collect style attributes. The style of Paragraph combines the style attributes of a Flowable and Text (and adds some extra attributes).
23:12:20	ldlework	Demos: interesting
23:12:54	FromGitter	<brechtm> The Style classes also make heavy use of metaclasses.
23:12:59	federico3	Demos: yet, the dynamic nature of Python tends to punish developers that abuse inheritane
23:13:52	Araq	once I knew why dynamically typed languages even have inheritance.
23:13:58	Araq	but I forgot it again.
23:15:01	Araq	any object can have any fields it needs already.
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23:24:48	FromGitter	<Varriount> Here's an interesting thought - inheritance could be simulated through use of a hook (called on inheritence) and a macro.
23:29:17	Araq	that's what Lua does.
23:29:26	Araq	or similar to what Lua does.
23:30:24	FromGitter	<Varriount> Araq: Did you ever consider using the same mechanism for Nim?
23:30:41	FromGitter	<Varriount> For one thing, it might allow insertion of things like vtables.
23:31:30	Demos	I don't see why you could'nt use macros to add vtbls to nim
23:31:53	Araq	multi methods will turn into ordinary methods as soon as we can do it.
23:32:01	Demos	:(
23:32:04	FromGitter	<Varriount> Araq: how so?
23:32:05	Demos	why
23:32:19	Demos	I think multi-methods work nicely with UFCS
23:32:22	Araq	I have yet to see a use case for MM in practice
23:32:33	Demos	although tbh I don't use methods much at all in nim
23:32:48	Araq	UFCS is not affected by this change.
23:32:53	Araq	hardly anything is affected.
23:33:09	Araq	it's just that only the first param will be used for the dynamic dispatching
23:33:26	FromGitter	<brechtm> Why does this fail? https://glot.io/snippets/eo9rvc338f
23:33:48	FromGitter	<Varriount> Araq: Then will typetraits gain the ability to get the runtime type on an object?
23:33:54	Demos	I think MM is conceptually simpler, but then again I don't seem to reach for methods much in nim anyway
23:35:14	FromGitter	<Varriount> I'm in favor of keeping multimethods. Macros can't really replace them (at least, not without some sort of hook system)
23:37:47	FromGitter	<Varriount> Nim doesn't yet have a way of deferring custom generation of procedure/type implementations
23:38:35	Demos	do you need that?
23:38:54	FromGitter	<brechtm> oops, that sample code is not complete
23:39:06	Araq	MM doesn't work well with generics
23:40:23	Demos	imo methods are only interseting with some kind of type erasure
23:40:36	FromGitter	<brechtm> https://glot.io/snippets/eo9s2glvoe
23:53:22	FromGitter	<Varriount> Araq: MM tends to be used quite a bit in places like GUI frameworks, and places where the user of the library supplies functionality to extend things.
23:53:51	Araq	how so? no common programming language offers it.
23:55:26	FromGitter	<Varriount> Qt
23:55:36	Demos	does Qt have multimethods?
23:55:42	FromGitter	<Varriount> C++ has methods
23:55:52	Demos	c++ does not have multimethods
23:56:09	FromGitter	<Varriount> I'm not talking multimethods, so much as methods that dispatch on the true type of a reference/pointer
23:56:44	Demos	yeah I don't think anyone wants to get rid of those
23:57:43	FromGitter	<Varriount> Demos: Yes, but the only convenient/compact way to have runtime dispatch in Nim is through multimethods.
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23:58:16	FromGitter	<Varriount> Yes you can use procedure members or vtables, but the former takes up space in each object, and the latter is difficult to construct, even with macrosl.
23:59:15	Demos	procedure members and vtables are pretty much the same thing
23:59:23	Demos	sans closure