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| 00:56:56 | ryu0 | very strange... |
| 00:57:21 | ryu0 | a sample C program is faster than nim... hm... |
| 00:57:49 | def- | ryu0: source code? |
| 00:57:58 | ryu0 | def-: sec. let me upload it. |
| 00:58:13 | ryu0 | 350 ms runtime... |
| 01:01:51 | ryu0 | https://gist.github.com/ryuo/d2cfee89a22c1e72ecb4 |
| 01:02:08 | ryu0 | maybe i'm writing it wrong in nim, but... the runtime is much slower in nim for these nested loops. |
| 01:03:00 | ryu0 | 350 ms vs 4700 ms or so. |
| 01:03:22 | def- | i would assume it's the echo that's slower |
| 01:03:28 | ryu0 | perhaps so. |
| 01:03:40 | ryu0 | i even redirect to /dev/null |
| 01:03:45 | ryu0 | just to see what happens |
| 01:03:56 | ryu0 | i'll try w/o doing that. |
| 01:04:27 | def- | are you compiling the nim code with -d:release? |
| 01:04:38 | def- | i get about the same time |
| 01:04:46 | def- | C is twice as fast with > /dev/null though |
| 01:05:00 | ryu0 | 9s vs 16s |
| 01:05:03 | ryu0 | i'll try using release. |
| 01:05:24 | def- | stdout.writeln instead of echo should be a bit faster |
| 01:05:52 | def- | just making a string of fixed size and setting the characters and then printing the entire thing should be much faster |
| 01:07:08 | ryu0 | i was testing code i used to use for generating digit sequences. |
| 01:07:15 | def- | also faster: stdout.writeln(a & b & c & d & e & f) |
| 01:07:18 | ryu0 | C was the fastest language i tested. |
| 01:07:35 | Xe | dom96: https://github.com/dom96/jester/issues/46#issuecomment-143168120 <-- this doesn't parse |
| 01:07:40 | ryu0 | is '&' a concatenation operator? |
| 01:07:45 | def- | ryu0: right |
| 01:07:56 | ryu0 | strange choice. but okay. |
| 01:08:11 | ryu0 | only characters? only strings? or both? |
| 01:08:52 | def- | both, and seqs |
| 01:08:55 | ryu0 | k. |
| 01:09:04 | def- | http://nim-lang.org/docs/system.html#&,string,char |
| 01:09:47 | ryu0 | Holy. |
| 01:09:52 | ryu0 | It's even faster than C now. |
| 01:10:29 | ryu0 | @_@ |
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| 01:10:54 | ryu0 | okay, i'm going to rewrite the C code to try something. |
| 01:11:04 | ryu0 | use an array instead. |
| 01:12:18 | ryu0 | now C is faster. XD |
| 01:12:38 | ryu0 | using puts instead of printf. |
| 01:13:24 | ryu0 | well, this is a decent lesson in optimizing code at least. :) |
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| 01:15:55 | def- | ryu0: https://gist.github.com/def-/5606bad11983ebb85b29 |
| 01:16:39 | ryu0 | \1? |
| 01:16:45 | ryu0 | meaning? |
| 01:16:49 | def- | \l, newline |
| 01:17:02 | def- | \n is platform dependent, may not be a single character (windows) |
| 01:17:04 | ryu0 | oh. used to it being \n. |
| 01:17:41 | def- | or if memory doesn't matter, make a bigger string |
| 01:18:29 | ryu0 | about the same speed as C now. |
| 01:19:13 | ryu0 | i wonder why nim hates tabs... |
| 01:19:17 | ryu0 | huh. |
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| 01:20:23 | def- | ryu0: https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/wiki/Whitespace-FAQ#tabs-vs-spaces |
| 01:21:27 | ryu0 | ah, yes.. C/C++ problems... |
| 01:21:46 | ryu0 | i think it's talking about for, if, and such that will work w/o braces. |
| 01:22:07 | ryu0 | hm. |
| 01:22:22 | ryu0 | anyway. |
| 01:24:02 | ryu0 | it may be my imagination, but it seems like nim inherited some pascal syntax conventions. |
| 01:24:13 | ryu0 | such as type/const/var blocks... |
| 01:24:16 | def- | added the faster version with more memory: https://gist.github.com/def-/5606bad11983ebb85b29 |
| 01:25:01 | ryu0 | that's faster? i'll give it a try. |
| 01:25:23 | def- | sure, but needs 7 MB of memory |
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| 01:26:01 | ryu0 | holy. okay, so the reason is due to a larger buffer being more efficient for writes. |
| 01:26:33 | def- | also due to running the same simple write operations instead of jumping into the kernel with the write syscall |
| 01:27:27 | ryu0 | not bad. |
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| 01:28:16 | ryu0 | consider me impressed. i thought i'd be stuck with C if i wanted fast code. |
| 01:29:05 | ryu0 | def-: so nim doesn't require null-terminated strings? |
| 01:29:20 | def- | strings in nim have a length and are null-terminated |
| 01:29:27 | def- | for easy passing to c functions |
| 01:29:27 | ryu0 | oh, so it has both. |
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| 01:29:50 | ryu0 | i notice it resembles pascal syntax in some ways. |
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| 01:30:22 | ryu0 | the var/const/type blocks for example. |
| 01:30:54 | ryu0 | pascal: |
| 01:31:01 | ryu0 | var x : longint; |
| 01:31:07 | ryu0 | or such. it's been awhile. |
| 01:31:16 | ryu0 | hm. time to try something else. |
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| 01:31:36 | ryu0 | cool. it's not case insensitive. |
| 01:32:26 | ryu0 | 7_000? are these separators mandatory? |
| 01:32:41 | def- | nope, _ has no meaning in identifiers and numbers |
| 01:32:56 | def- | you can use it however you want, but it's nice to make numbers more human-readable |
| 01:33:15 | def- | for example newString could also be used as new_string |
| 01:33:41 | ryu0 | is it possible to force variables to a specific type? it appears type inferrence is used for things like: x = 0 |
| 01:34:01 | cazov | `var x : type = 0` |
| 01:34:01 | def- | var x: int8 = 0 or var x = 0'i8 |
| 01:34:07 | ryu0 | ah, k. |
| 01:34:23 | ryu0 | hm... |
| 01:34:38 | ryu0 | does 'int' default to some constant size? or is it platform specific like C int? |
| 01:35:40 | def- | ryu0: int is always the size of pointers on the architecture |
| 01:35:47 | def- | so 32bit on x86, 64bit on x86-64 |
| 01:35:52 | ryu0 | okay, then it varies. k |
| 01:36:37 | ryu0 | i must admit i do get sick of C and its like million different integer aliases. |
| 01:36:43 | def- | http://nim-lang.org/docs/tut1.html#basic-types-integers |
| 01:36:44 | ryu0 | size_t, ptrdiff_t, pid_t, ... |
| 01:37:08 | ryu0 | ._. |
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| 09:45:42 | NimBot | nim-lang/Nim devel c04ae96 Jakob Oesterling [+0 ±1 -0]: added examples in documenation for sizeof high low |
| 09:45:42 | NimBot | nim-lang/Nim devel e429810 Jakob Oesterling [+0 ±1 -0]: added examples in documenation for add del delete repr insert |
| 09:45:42 | NimBot | nim-lang/Nim devel 709c4f7 Jakob Oesterling [+0 ±1 -0]: Merge branch 'devel' of github.com:TheAnonymous/Nim into devel |
| 09:45:42 | NimBot | nim-lang/Nim devel ca9845d Jakob Oesterling [+0 ±1 -0]: fixed wrong examples |
| 09:45:42 | NimBot | 1 more commits. |
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| 16:53:05 | rpowers | is it possible to emit a macro error for a specific source location? |
| 16:55:03 | rpowers | like, if one statement is wrong in a statement macro, can you attach an error to that NimNode? |
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| 18:46:46 | Varriount | rpowers: I think so. You could throw an exception? |
| 18:47:10 | Varriount | dom96: What/how does the forum send email for missing passwords? |
| 18:47:42 | Varriount | dom96: I'm adding missing-buildslave email notification to the buildbot. |
| 18:50:40 | rpowers | Varriount: hmm ok, but I'd like the error source location to be at a specific point in the user's code |
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| 18:53:57 | Varriount | rpowers: There's the example for the `quote` procedure: http://nim-lang.org/docs/macros.html#quote,stmt,string |
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| 18:59:56 | rpowers | Varriount: Ok, but if I throw the exception, it's line info will be from the macro, right? |
| 19:00:56 | rpowers | Varriount: In Scala, when you error from a macro, you can give it an AST node and an error message, which creates a compiler error at the location of the AST node you passed in |
| 19:04:20 | rpowers | it's useful if you have a large class (or statment for Nim) -- the errors show up where they are most useful, rather than at the root of the class/statement |
| 19:08:59 | dom96 | Varriount: smtp |
| 19:09:26 | dom96 | https://github.com/nim-lang/nimforum/blob/master/utils.nim#L25 |
| 19:10:22 | Varriount | rpowers: I could have sworn there was a mechanism for this, used by templates... Hrm. |
| 19:10:50 | Varriount | dom96: Thanks. |
| 19:11:07 | Varriount | dom96: Do you want to be notified when builders go missing? |
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| 19:44:13 | dom96 | Varriount: nah. |
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| 20:05:25 | tmm1 | good afternoon |
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| 21:54:24 | Varriount | dom96: For the buildbot's test data and upload directory, should some sort of transparent compression be applied, to minimize disk usage? |
| 21:54:37 | dom96 | sure, couldn't hurt. |
| 21:58:08 | Varriount | dom96: Looks like ZFS supports transparent compression. |
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| 22:00:01 | dom96 | Varriount: just compress using tar |
| 22:00:27 | Varriount | dom96: Yes, but then you can't access individual files via the web interface. |
| 22:01:18 | dom96 | So you suggest I should repartition the VPS to use the Z File system? :P |
| 22:01:44 | Varriount | I don't know. I'm still looking. |
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| 22:03:52 | dom96 | Varriount: Would you have enough time to rewrite NimBuild? |
| 22:04:01 | Varriount | dom96: No. |
| 22:04:31 | dom96 | :/ |
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| 22:07:11 | Varriount | dom96: I'll have time next break and next semester, but I'd rather focus on updating NimLime and the Nim installer first. |
| 22:07:53 | dom96 | Even if you could create a webapp which builds an installer at the press of a button for a new release would be a huge help |
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| 22:19:31 | Varriount | Looking at the available tools, I think a workable and less risky solution would be to make X uncompressed versions available, and compress the rest into a single file. |
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| 22:28:56 | Varriount | So, dom96, Araq, do you think we should start signing the installers? |
| 22:29:13 | dom96 | I don't think that's worth the effort. |
| 22:29:22 | dom96 | Let's not make the installer generation process more complex |
| 22:29:34 | dom96 | Can you at least document how you generate the installers? |
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| 22:31:13 | Varriount | dom96: Copy the EnvVarUpdate.nsh script to the build directory, then run 'koch nsis' |
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| 22:57:15 | dom96 | Varriount: Nice. That sounds pretty easy to automate. |
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| 23:17:32 | Araq | uh oh |
| 23:18:09 | Araq | osproc.select: **Warning**: This function may give unexpected or completely wrong results on Windows. |
| 23:18:27 | Araq | can I get more specific information? |
| 23:19:12 | Araq | "may give completely wrong results" ... when? why? what if I only use it with 1 Process to asyncronously read from it? |
| 23:26:56 | ryu0 | https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/ms740141%28v=vs.85%29.aspx http://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/007908799/xsh/select.html |
| 23:26:59 | ryu0 | maybe some difference here? |
| 23:27:02 | Varriount | Araq: I believe it's because it uses the same method select does for sockets. |
| 23:27:44 | Varriount | Whereas on Linux sockets and file descripters are roughly the same things, on Windows they are not. |
| 23:28:45 | Araq | well proc select*(readfds: var seq[Process], timeout = 500): int does make it pretty obvious it only works on Processes |
| 23:29:12 | Varriount | Araq: Yes, but what underlying system call is used? |
| 23:29:40 | Araq | waitForMultipleObjects of course |
| 23:30:03 | Varriount | Huh? When was that changed? |
| 23:30:21 | Varriount | I could have sworn it used some other method last time I saw it. |
| 23:30:34 | Araq | dunno |
| 23:30:46 | Araq | 3 beer are minimum before touching osproc.nim |
| 23:31:15 | Varriount | Araq: Despite the fact that I don't drink, I agree with you. |
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| 23:36:49 | Varriount | Araq: I'm updating the buildmaster code, so there may be some downtime (minutes, depending on errors) |
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| 23:41:33 | ryu0 | Araq: osproc is a nim module for interfacing with C system API for managing processes? |
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| 23:43:35 | Araq | ryu0: yes |
| 23:44:26 | ryu0 | ah. |
| 23:47:13 | Araq | and one day I'll write a new module that uses openpty() instead |
| 23:47:49 | Araq | and that uses whatever windows' equivalent to that is |
| 23:48:26 | ryu0 | sounds like a complicated version of expect :) |
| 23:48:34 | ryu0 | or something. |
| 23:48:36 | ryu0 | lol |
| 23:48:40 | ryu0 | err simplified i guess. |
| 23:48:48 | Araq | there are lots of open source windows terminals around and nobody bothered to document how this can be done... |
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| 23:49:01 | ryu0 | Araq: did you look at libexpect before? |
| 23:49:06 | Araq | ryu0: expect module for Nim is spot on |
| 23:49:08 | ryu0 | not sure if it works on windows but... |
| 23:49:34 | ryu0 | ah. |
| 23:50:10 | ryu0 | haha. some of this nim stuff reminds me of ASM instructions. |
| 23:50:19 | ryu0 | inc for example. |
| 23:53:52 | Araq | yeah in some ways the old Turbo pascal influences are still visible |
| 23:54:07 | Araq | making the language even more charming ;-) |