<< 06-04-2019 >>
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00:11:45rayman22201Each is a separate implementation, but it is at the data structure level, not the procedure level. So, "owninghashSet", "nonOwningHashSet", "copyingHashSet".
00:12:56rayman22201I would not have a heterogeneous data structure. You could, but I think it be very messy.
00:27:48FromDiscord<exelotl> is it possible to define a custom type conversion?
00:29:01shashlickConverters?
00:29:57FromDiscord<exelotl> well, I don't want implicit conversion. e.g. I have `type Fixed* = distinct uint32` and I would like to be able to do `myFixed.int` to discard the fractional part and and get an integer
00:30:16FromDiscord<exelotl> right now I have to do `myFixed.toInt()`
00:31:24FromDiscord<exelotl> it's not too bad I guess
00:46:13FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Hello, would anyone be able to help me troubleshoot compiling nim on raspbian by any chance?
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00:48:41FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Currently I'm able to compile nim all the way up to the step that requires you to do `./koch tools` which is found on https://nim-lang.org/install_unix.html it throws an error that says `execution of an external program failed: 'gcc -c -w -pthread -O3 -fno-strict-aliasing -I/home/pi/nim│ -0.19.4/lib -o /root/.cache/nim/nimsuggest_r/linenoise.c.o /home/pi/nim-0.19.4/lib/wrappers/linenoise/linenoise.c`. In reality I'm just wondering
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00:55:23FromGitter<kaushalmodi> shashlick: yess! I confirm the fix. Many thanks!
00:55:58FromGitter<kaushalmodi> that bug was disallowing me from setting `nimterop#head` in my nimterop wrapper dependencies in the .nimble :)
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01:46:55shashlickWell there is no version yet so everything is head
01:47:24shashlickProblem with head is that nimble assumes it is up to date even if months old
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03:48:06FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Is there a way to have koch use a different compiler than gcc?
03:48:38shashlickconfigure it in nim.cfg
03:52:52FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Thank you 😃
03:53:12FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> I think that might've fixed my issue fingers crossed
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04:04:53shashlickawesome
04:05:19FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> yes it did 😄
04:05:39FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Alrighty note to self: clang is needed to compile nim 0.19.4 on raspbian
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04:12:21FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Alrighty so clang fixes most of my issues except `./koch tools` can't compile one of the things more debugging 😄
04:17:35FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Seems that nimble is failing to build, at least that's farther than I've gotten lul
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08:45:00PerkolHow can I use client functionality of this https://github.com/enthus1ast/nimSocks with httpclient?
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09:20:55FromGitter<mratsim> @narimiran, wasn't there a FFI label?
09:26:35FromGitter<mratsim> Happy that this is finally fixed: Yeah this is fixed: https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/issues/7632
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10:08:50FromGitter<liquid600pgm> shashlick: nimterop fails to install on 0.19.9 for some reason https://termbin.com/1ycd
10:11:11salewskiDo we have something like std::equal to compare seq1[a .. b] with seq2[a .. b] direct, without copying parts of both seq?
10:11:16salewskiSee http://www.cplusplus.com/reference/algorithm/equal/
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10:13:51salewskiI assume seq1 == seq2[0 .. seq1.high] will create a copy of seq2. But OK, I can use that for now.
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10:21:50clyybberZevv Is npeg a good fit for a parser?
10:21:55clyybberAlso can it handle streams?
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10:47:53ZevvI tried streams, but there were complications with performance and captures. For now it is strings only.
10:48:34ZevvI have ideas to get streaming back in, its next on my list.
10:49:14ZevvI also experimented with parsing mmap()ed files (memFile, in Nim), but that degraded my type safety so I droppde that for now
10:49:58Zevvfor the first question: parsing is what it does. If you have a spec or some examples I'm happy to get you started
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11:09:10clyybberI'm in the process of getting the complete EBNF done.
11:09:37clyybberA PEG accepts all context-free languages right?
11:10:32Zevvit breaks on left recursion, though
11:11:24Zevvusually you can rewrite to get rid of that, although the result is not always as readable or intuitive as the left recursive grammar
11:13:06ZevvThere is also Nimly, which might suit you as well: https://github.com/loloiccl/nimly
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11:19:08clyybberok, thanks I will check both out. I think I don't need left recursion.
11:19:29clyybberI have to go my people need me :)
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11:50:20FromGitter<liquid600pgm> is there any way to create destructors for `ref object`s?
11:50:43FromGitter<liquid600pgm> basically, some proc that will execute when the GC frees the object
11:52:42FromGitter<liquid600pgm> I guess using `new` is my only option?
11:53:36FromGitter<liquid600pgm> I heard something about `\`destroy=\`` but I can't get it to work
12:05:36FromGitter<liquid600pgm> I need this for interfacing with C
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12:25:33FromGitter<kayabaNerve> There's no way to disable the XDeclaredButNotUsed hint for a function, and everything in it, but still get notifications for its raises pragma, right?
12:26:21FromGitter<kayabaNerve> You have to use that pragma as a block; it can't be added to as a function pragma. I was hoping if I did that, the raises pragma wouldn't be caught by it.
12:26:38FromGitter<kayabaNerve> So that means the raises pragma is in the XDeclaredButNotUsed block :/
12:27:02FromGitter<kayabaNerve> Not asking for confirmation really, but if there's a workaround.
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12:42:34shashlick@liquid600pgm ya, some issues with strformat, hoping krux02 fixes it
12:43:32Zevvliquid600pgm: destructors is work in progress afaik; araq has been chewing on that for some time
12:43:58Zevvi believe destroy= only works for stack, not for heap
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12:53:45shashlickIs this what you are seeing https://travis-ci.org/nimterop/nimterop/jobs/516294339 - @liquid600pgm
12:54:32FromGitter<liquid600pgm> no, I sent you the stack trace
12:55:05FromGitter<liquid600pgm> it's an error in the regex library, somewhere in parseutils
12:55:12FromGitter<liquid600pgm> so it might not be related to nimterop at all
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13:46:16federico3https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19582922 mentions of Nim
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14:28:50leorizeZevv, liquid600pgm: see this https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/blob/devel/tests/destructor/turn_destroy_into_finalizer.nim for ref object destructor
14:29:38FromGitter<liquid600pgm> yeah, that's what I used in the end, it seems to be working fine
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14:42:41Zevvheu since when is that supposed to work?
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14:57:07shashlick@liquid600pgm are you on latest devel?
14:57:23FromGitter<kaushalmodi> @liquid600pgm `nimble install nimterop#@head` worked for me yesterday
14:57:43FromGitter<kaushalmodi> I'm on devel too (probably 4 days old devel)
14:58:08FromGitter<kaushalmodi> Well, not "4 days old", but I last built from devel 4 days back
14:59:00FromGitter<kaushalmodi> Typo: `nimble install nimterop@#head`
14:59:58shashlickNope it is still broken on latest head
15:00:01shashlickhttps://travis-ci.org/nimterop/nimterop/jobs/516416914
15:01:02shashlickBasically this issue https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/issues/10970#issuecomment-480510934
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15:16:05Zevvwhat's the easiest way to get a nimble package in CI, travis or azure or whatever? Idealy i'd like to test with both Nim latest stable and latest devel
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15:25:18shashlickJust use an existing yml file
15:25:35shashlickNimterop has both Travis and appveyor testing
15:25:50shashlickWindows Linux osx across stable and devel
15:25:55FromGitter<liquid600pgm> shashlick: yes, I'm on the latest devel
15:26:32shashlickYa it's been reported, hopefully fixed soon
15:31:55Araqshashlick, I think Nimble misuses the compiler API
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15:46:30stefantalpalaruIs it safe to assume that the C backend does not support versions older than C99? I see some unconditional definitions for 64-bit integers that were introduced in that standard: https://nim-lang.org/docs/system.html#culonglong
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15:48:43leorizeI believe so, as Haiku's gcc 2 compiler can't process Nim generated code
15:53:27clyybberkayabaNerve: Just use {.used.}
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16:00:32Calinouis there a built-in Nimble command to build and run automatically?
16:00:49Calinouif not, I guess I can just write a task :)
16:07:00shashlickNimble build
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16:12:39Calinouit only builds the package, it doesn't run the compiled program
16:13:03CalinouI wrote a task anyway, but it's not portable as it depends on the OS-specific binary name
16:13:14Calinou(could be fixed with `when`, maybe)
16:14:56shashlickThere's exeext or something
16:15:27CalinouI know Windows allows you to omit the .exe extension, but I don't think it's going to work due to the binary name being prefixed with "./"
16:15:31Calinou(as . is not part of the PATH on Linux/macOS)
16:19:10shashlickhttps://nim-lang.org/0.19.0/ospaths.html#ExeExt
16:25:50Calinouhow do I fetch the number of CPU threads on the system from Nim?
16:26:15Calinou(my DuckDuckGoing is failing here :P)
16:26:28FromGitter<liquid600pgm> Calinou: https://nim-lang.org/docs/cpuinfo.html
16:26:45Calinouthanks :)
16:26:50FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Just a question, has anyone had any luck compiling `koch tools` on raspbian?
16:27:19FromGitter<liquid600pgm> Avatarfigher: I compiled it successfully, what's your issue?
16:28:24FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> One of my major issues atm is that gcc isn't able to compile 0.19.4 on raspbian and when I switch to clang it fails building nimble with the error of `Error: execution of an external program failed: 'clang -c -w -O3 -I/home/pi/nim-0.19.4/lib -o /root/.cache/nim/nimble_r/linenoise.c.o /home/pi/nim-0.19.4/lib/wrappers/linenoise/linenoise.c`
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16:29:02FromGitter<liquid600pgm> strange, for me the process went pretty smoothly without any major issues
16:29:05FromGitter<liquid600pgm> just plug and play
16:29:09FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> rip
16:29:32FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> this is my third time flashing raspbian hoping that it'll magically fix itself lmao
16:30:16disruptekAvatarfighter: try clang for nim and gcc for nimble.
16:31:00FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> alrighty will do, fingers crossed this works lol
16:35:03BaldEagleX02I deleted ##nim-iot since it was useless and inactive
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16:56:21FromGitter<liquid600pgm> is it possible to capture variables from outside of {.cdecl.} anonymous procs?
16:56:41FromGitter<liquid600pgm> without using globals, that is
17:03:52Calinouso there it is, https://github.com/Calinou/godot-size-benchmarks
17:04:04CalinouI decided to write the benchmark runner in Nim because I was fed up with arrays in Bash :P
17:08:16Araqliquid600pgm: that can't work
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17:11:52FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Yeah still no luck, gcc also fails to build nimble
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17:15:53anamokhello
17:16:31FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Hello 😄
17:17:01anamokI have a question about the future of Nim. Is it planned to remove the garbage collector and switch to a memory model similar to Rust?
17:18:28Araqyes but it's in the early phase and Nim v1 will ship with the GCs
17:19:54anamokBut for me the GC is a huge advantage. I come from Python, I love that Nim is so similar to Python. I don't want to fight with manual memory management. I'm sure I'm not alone with this.
17:20:41Araqthis has been discussed to death and you won't "fight manual memory management" moreso than people are fighting the GCs now
17:21:12Araqbut we'll see if it works out. As I said, when was the last time we made Nim worse? :P
17:21:58FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> im so hyped to successfully compile nim on raspbian rn, I've been at this for like a week now 😄
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17:23:08AraqAvatarfighter: try the -d:leanCompiler switch
17:23:15Araqthen it should take less RAM
17:24:18FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Will do 😃 I'm really close, I've just had issues with compiling nimble due to something called `linenoise.c`
17:24:35FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Nothing a bit of fiddling can't fix haha
17:24:45Araqanamok, if the model works out, it's still not "Rust like", Rust models the heap with a stack-like mechanism and we don't. We model the heap as a heap. It's different enough that we need to try it out.
17:25:59federico3Avatarfighter: why, what was the issue?
17:26:03AraqThe differences between Rust and Nim will still be bigger than between Python and Ruby.
17:26:24leorizeAvatarfighter: the stdlib bundles a version of linenoise with it. That might not be compatible with ARM (just a guess) :p
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17:34:31I_Right_Iyeah considering Rust code is harder to read than 'C'
17:36:56anamokI tried Rust but gave up because of its memory model. I love Nim and I hope it won't get too complicated.
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17:41:09FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> leorize: that's probably the issue lol but I have high hopes 😄
17:43:00leorizeactually you can just put your error output here and everyone can help with that :p
17:43:26FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> I'm awaiting the error atm, I'm compiling fresh rn
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17:44:38FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> the last error I got was `Error: execution of an external program failed: 'clang -c -w -O3 -I/home/pi/nim-0.19.4/lib -o /root/.cache/nim/nimble_r/linenoise.c.o /home/pi/nim-0.19.4/lib/wrappers/linenoise/linenoise.c`, I believe the error should be more verbose now so hopefully i'll be able to provide more details
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17:51:39leorizetry executing that command in terminal
17:53:06FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Will do 😃
17:53:26FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> I actually got a different error this time, but I'll see what the output of this one is lol
17:54:28FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Alright so I get the error `Error: execution of an external program failed: 'gcc -c -w -O3 -fno-strict-aliasing -I/home/pi/Nim/lib -o /home/pi/Nim/nimcache/r_linux_arm/stdlib_system.c.o /home/pi/Nim/nimcache/r_linux_arm/stdlib_system.c'` except when I run it manually in terminal it successfully runs
17:55:23leorizenice, execution failing for no apparant reason
17:55:29FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> yeah
17:55:41FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> This is the story of my life rn
17:55:57I_Right_Ianamok: I can see the merits of the memory model, I don't mind it(but I probably use unsafe way to much). But I can also see why so many people hate it. It sometimes feels like your jumping though loops to get things done.
17:56:26leorizeAvatarfighter: hmm there are countless reason for why execution fail...
17:56:34leorizetry looking at dmesg | tail
17:58:09FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> I don't see anything specifically related to gcc, I do have something about urandom getting ratelimited, but other than that there isn't much
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18:00:59leorizeyou are compiling nimble, right?
18:01:00FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> This is really, weird. I'm going to take a break and fiddle with it some more later, thanks for your help guys!
18:01:13leorizetry passing --genScript to the compiler
18:01:31leorizeit should generate a script that you can, uh, call multiple times until it succeed :p
18:01:41FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> I decided to compile nim from scratch again
18:01:57FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> I was following step 2 on https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/blob/devel/readme.md
18:02:12leorizegcc error should not be a nim problem imo
18:02:32ZevvAvatarfighter: I fired up a pi, let me see how far I get. Are you compiling devel from git?
18:02:54FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Zevv: Yes I am, I'm following the instructions linked on the readme line by line atm
18:03:21Zevvok; I just started with a build_all.sh, that will take some time but so far no problems
18:04:46leorizeZevv: you can use `make` to parallelize the bootstrap
18:05:01Zevvah good to know.
18:05:04FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Alrighty, hopefully we get the same error, I'm just baffled that I can run the command that failed and have it run successfully lol
18:05:20FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> but not when build_all does it :L
18:06:20Zevvleorize: just waiting for the build sh now, trying to follow Avatarfighters steps as close as possible
18:06:41FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> I'm going to be right back for a bit, lmk how it goes 😃
18:06:47Zevvneed to read to the kids in a minute, so I have time :)
18:07:18Zevvok, initial nim-from-c bootstrap worked, stage 1 is building
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18:11:31Zevvstage 2
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18:30:14Zevvsorry Avatarfighter, I just made myself a nim without issues
18:31:03Zevvif you trust a stranger I could login on your pi and try to help you out. I'm pretty handy at this stuff, porting and embedded is in my daytime job...
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18:35:11FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Zevv: I’d love for you to help, ill set something up 😃
18:37:59Zevvbb in about an hour or so
18:43:06FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Sounds good 😄
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19:08:48ryukopostingI made my first PR to the compiler aaaaaay
19:09:06ryukopostingit's braindead simple and really not particularly special but yknow
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19:13:58Araqryukoposting, nice
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19:23:50ryukopostingAraq just moved it to sequtils
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19:32:40ryukopostinganyone know where I should look in the compiler if I want to tackle this? https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/issues/10900
19:33:20ryukopostingI really want to make sure this gets fixed quick, since the AWS SDK is gonna be kinda nasty to use until it's fixed
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19:36:38WilhelmVonWeinerwould there be a speed difference between using an array[2, int] and a tuple (int, int)?
19:37:22ryukopostingWilhelmVonWeiner I'm not an expert, but I'm gonna guess that if there is a difference, it would be miniscule
19:37:43ryukopostingassuming the C backend, at least.
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19:38:57WilhelmVonWeinerhm
19:39:03WilhelmVonWeinertuples have named fields is all
19:39:21WilhelmVonWeinerwhich show up if you echo the data structure
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19:39:46ryukopostingI look at it as the difference between a C array and a C struct
19:40:36WilhelmVonWeinerwell the tuple field names are stored somewhere
19:41:08WilhelmVonWeinerI have to go but if someone has an affirmative answer do let me know I'm just afk
19:41:24ryukopostingI've had to dig through GCC's output when dealing with a bug a while back, so maybe I can draw from that
19:41:44ryukopostingnot for Nim, and also targeting ARMv7 not x86, but still
19:42:24ryukopostingInstead of keeping addresses for struct/object/whatever members, GCC usually keeps a single address, then uses offsets to get to different members
19:43:08ryukopostingthe fact that it does this with Thumb2, where offsets are very limited in size, tells me it probably would do the same thing in an architecture where the hard offsets in an instruction can be quite large, e.g. x86
19:44:30ryukopostingmy foundation for this is suuuuper hand-wavey, but I'd bet the difference would be nonexistent if using -d:release, and might be measurable (if still tiny) for a debug build, since the names of object/tuple members would be sitting somewhere in memory
19:46:02ryukopostingThe only thing I can be sure on is that differences wouldn't arise from accessing members of the tuple/array/whatever, but they could arise from differences in debug information that gets packed into the two different types
19:52:35FromDiscord<exelotl> I'm using the asm statement to embed a string into my executable, but it doesn't seem to escape quotes in the generated C code. Is this a bug?
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19:55:05ryukopostingpost code?
19:55:18FromDiscord<exelotl> e.g. the following nim code: asm """.string "SRAM_Vnnn" """
19:55:33FromDiscord<exelotl> generates the following C code: asm(" .string "SRAM_Vnnn" \n");
19:59:01ryukopostingI'm leaning towards no, but you should definitely talk to one of the devs
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20:07:25ZevvAvatarfighter: you still here?
20:07:37Zevvtook a bit longer then expected, sorry
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20:47:30ZevvAraq, I'm helping out Avatarfighter with his Pi-issues, which seem to be memory related - just simply running out of it.
20:48:01ZevvWhat we see happening is that Nim happily compiles all Nim to C, and then spawns the C compiler.
20:48:24ZevvWhile it is waiting for the C to compile, it is still sitting on several hundreds of MB of memory
20:48:38Zevvand basically doing nothing, it seems. How does that work?
20:54:42Araquse --compileOnly and then 'nim jsonbuild nim.json' or similiar
20:55:32Zevvthat makes sense
20:55:43Araq"How does that work?", the Nim compiler uses the RAM and doesn't free it for GCC.
20:56:13ZevvYeah, I kind of worded that question wrong, sorry for that :)
20:56:29AraqIn the 80ies there was this idea called "virtual memory" where you could have a swap file
20:56:39Araqunfortunately it didn't catch on
20:56:40Zevvyeah, I just added a fewhunderd MB's of swap, that works
20:56:46Araq:P
20:57:01Zevvthe only real issue is that his build failed with the message "an error occured"
20:57:28Zevvand there were no clear signs of why, so I'll see if I can find where gcc's complaints went
20:57:51Araqthat's pretty good, usually on Linux you get a segfault instead after the OS randomly killed your browser
20:58:07Zevvwith a very nice report of the OOM killer in the kernel
20:58:16Zevvtelling you exactly what happend, why, and who was the chosen victim
20:58:28Araqsure.
20:58:30Zevvbut now GCC decided on its own that it was probably better to stop before it got killed
20:58:41Zevvbut its output was eaten somewhere down the road
21:00:38Araqthere is also a "file descriptor killer" if program A opens too many files program B is killed instead
21:00:45Zevv
21:00:51Zevvno such thing
21:01:03Araqsee?
21:01:29Zevva bit of a difference there. What is 'too many file descriptors'
21:01:39Zevvis that a limited resource in your OS?
21:02:13Zevvwell, you either kill something, or you keep swapping until the user gets bored and decides a reboot would be bettery
21:02:21Zevv*if* he is able to reboot because the task switcher is swapped to disk
21:02:25Zevvand can't come out
21:02:39Araqmy point is that the OOM killer is worst idea in the history of computing
21:02:47ZevvSo, what's the alternative here
21:03:02Araqdon't overcommit memory, don't promise what you cannot keep.
21:03:58ZevvSo, *overcomitting* is your problem
21:04:16ZevvIt is actually nice to be able to fork() when using more then half my memory
21:04:30Zevvovercomitting is what you do when you COW
21:04:53Araqno, fork() is a design mistake because it leads to overcommit which leads to arbitrary process shutdowns
21:05:26ZevvThat's more like the source, I agree on that
21:05:40Zevvvfork() is underappreciated
21:06:32clyybberZevv: Linux has a file descriptor limit
21:06:45clyybberwhich you can raise in the limits file
21:06:46Zevvyeah, per process
21:06:49clyybberyeah
21:06:49Zevvand that's arbritary
21:06:58ZevvI can set that to MAX_UINT64
21:07:13ZevvI bet you a beer I can get an OOM by opening too many fd's :)
21:09:00clyybberAraq: You can disable overcommiting on linux.
21:09:07Zevvand you can disable OOM
21:09:13Zevvbut you can't disable fork :)
21:09:20Araqclyybber: I know, thank god
21:09:42Araqit's not the default though. the default is the un-operating system mode.
21:10:13clyybberIt's a beautiful hack
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21:16:01FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Dang that was a ride hah
21:16:02FromDiscord<Avatarfighter> Dang that was a ride haha
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21:42:01FromGitter<Varriount> Araq: How does fork() lead to overcommits?
21:42:20FromGitter<Varriount> And does CreateProcess have the same flaw?
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22:09:42FromDiscord<exelotl> I got saving working on the GBA: https://github.com/exelotl/nim-tonc/blob/master/examples/test_sram/main.nim
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23:09:59planetis[m]nice exelotl!
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23:16:44planetis[m]btw, i remember we once talked about an fsm macro. Have u seen what i made: https://github.com/b3liever/macromachining I though it might interest u
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23:43:01I_Right_Icoming from C to nim... Is using sequences as substitute for link list the preferred method where possible?
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23:59:52shashlickThere are lists and deques if you want that