<< 06-10-2015 >>
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03:33:37gmpreussner|workis it possible to inject documentation comments into an AST?
03:33:44gmpreussner|worki found nnkCommentStmt, but have no idea how to use it
03:34:09gmpreussner|workdoes it take an nnkStrLit as a child?
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12:15:55NimBotnim-lang/Nim devel 87a6268 JamesP [+0 ±1 -0]: bug fix #3416 add wrapper around `[]=` to account for... 1 more lines
12:15:55NimBotnim-lang/Nim devel 73821ad JamesP [+0 ±1 -0]: add assert test to end of module
12:15:55NimBotnim-lang/Nim devel 8f9438d Andreas Rumpf [+0 ±1 -0]: Merge pull request #3421 from jlp765/strtab1... 2 more lines
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12:42:54Araqcncl: sure report it please.
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14:16:47NimBotnim-lang/Nim devel 8e9c0db Araq [+0 ±1 -0]: strutils: wrap too long lines
14:16:47NimBotnim-lang/Nim devel 732bdd5 Araq [+0 ±1 -0]: added critbits.inc proc
14:16:47NimBotnim-lang/Nim devel 8507f95 Araq [+1 ±1 -0]: fixes #2637
14:16:47NimBotnim-lang/Nim devel 2e413d3 Araq [+0 ±1 -0]: fixes #3383
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14:51:37Araqxorbit: the GC hates malloc.
14:52:09Araqmalloc doesn't help. you could use it instead of mmap though I guess.
14:52:31Araqbut what kind of environment has malloc and no mmap?
14:53:11xorbitAraq: I'm trying to see if I can use Nim on small microcontrollers (16K flash, 4K RAM).
14:53:49Araqwhat's wrong with --os:standalone for that?
14:54:00xorbitAraq: What is useMalloc for? I notices the alloc functions are also disabled with --os:standalone.
14:54:26xorbitI'm trying to use --os:standalone, but there's no string functionality whatsoever.
14:54:53Araqactually there is: array [8, char], cstring ...
14:55:10Araqwith 4K of RAM what do you use strings for anyway?
14:55:33xorbitSerial interface (UART) console
14:56:40xorbitIn C my initial parser is ~2K of flash. I actually hacked all the hostOS != "standalone" restrictions until I got Nim to compile with strings on standalone, it generated ~8K code.
14:59:25Araqwell but what do you *use* strings for? 4K of RAM is crazy to manage with malloc too.
15:00:56AraqI'd use a fixed size buffer
15:01:27xorbitSending commands and logging data over virtual COM port. I know 4K is limited for malloc as well. This is just an experiment to see if Nim can be applicable in this context as it can still help prevent a load of common C bugs.
15:01:44Araqyou can of course simply use C's malloc in Nim.
15:02:07xorbitHow do you allocate a fixed buffer in Nim? That's what I was after now to reduce the code size of my Nim experiment.
15:02:51xorbitI'm new to Nim and don't know yet what allocates on the heap and what on stack or data section
15:02:55Araquse --os:standalone and proc malloc(x: int): pointer {.importc, header: "<stdlib.h>".} and hack away
15:03:26Araqvar buf: array[someSize, char] # allocated on the stack, just like in C
15:04:05xorbitOk, great! That's very helpful. I was assuming arrays were allocated on the heap as well.
15:04:39Araqwell at this point useMalloc should die I suppose.
15:04:57Araqit means to map Nim's alloc/dealloc/realloc to C's allocator
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15:05:38Araqperhaps it's useful. you can then use alloc instead of wrappig malloc on your own
15:05:51xorbitOk, sounds useful, but not if it can't be used with --os:standalone which is probably the only time you'd use it :)
15:06:20xorbitRight now it seems to be disabled with --os:standalone, not sure why.
15:06:32xorbitalloc I mean
15:06:48Araqwell it's weird to use it with os:standalone since standalone tries very hard to assume there is no C standard library available
15:07:38xorbitOh, I misunderstood. I thought it assumed there's a C stdlib but not an OS.
15:08:18xorbitSo maybe I can try my scenario without --os:standalone as well, since my microcontroller has a C library available.
15:09:19Araqfor some definiton of "C library" I assume. printf's format strings feature takes up lots of code
15:10:30Araqfyi alloc.nim has an implementation for Nim's alloc for embedded devices
15:10:33xorbitIndeed it does. Before I reduced my C code to 2K, it took 8K as well, because I was using printf. :-P From the memory map it looks like the Nim code is still using one of the printf variants
15:11:36Araqit uses a global array to act as the heap, take a look.
15:11:48Araqit's stupid, but an interesting idea.
15:12:32xorbitOk, thanks for the alloc.nim pointer, sounds awesome! Is it to be used with or without --os:standalone on a system like mine?
15:13:05Araqwell the heap's size is way too big for your system
15:13:25Araqbut it's in an elif hostOS == "standalone" section ;-)
15:14:36Araqah our news.txt says it best:
15:14:42Araq- There is now a clear distinction between ``--os:standalone``
15:14:44Araq and ``--gc:none``. So if you use ``--os:standalone`` ensure you also use
15:14:45Araq ``--gc:none``. ``--os:standalone`` without ``--gc:none`` is now a version
15:14:47Araq that doesn't depend on any OS but includes the GC. However this version
15:14:48Araq is currently untested!
15:15:45xorbitOk, good to know. I was wondering about the distinction since I saw different behaviour.
15:16:22xorbitI can't find alloc.nim, is it in the standard library or nimble?
15:19:02Araqlib/system/alloc.nim
15:21:47Araqdon't import it, it's part of system.nim
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15:22:25xorbitHmm, in my install, alloc.nim seems to only have a POSIX and Windows allocator and for all others throws "Port memory manager to your platform"
15:22:58xorbitIs this something new since the last release?
15:23:15Araquse nim devel
15:24:04xorbitOk. Like just clone it from Github?
15:25:20Araqclone it, build it, ensure it's actually used
15:25:27xorbitSo, with this allocator, I get alloc and friends, but I assume string operations will still not work because there is no GC, correct?
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15:25:59Araqno, it gives you the full GC. I think.
15:26:26Araqit won't run though cause your heap is too small
15:26:58xorbitCan I customize the heap size, or does it have a minimum requirement?
15:27:11Araqthe allocator simply wasn't designed to "manage" 4K of RAM.
15:27:58cncldon't use an allocator if you only have 4k of ram :)
15:28:02Araqyou can customize the heap size, but it won't work. there was a guy working on a new allocator/GC designed for 4K or 8K of RAM, but it's lots of work and pointless. ;-)
15:28:08Araqbbl
15:28:56xorbitSo, I should still implement some sort of "fixed length string" functionality on top of array or cstring.
15:29:05cnclthat's right
15:29:19cnclif you try to dynamically allocate strings with 4k of memory, you will run out of memory right away
15:29:30cnclif you only have 4k of ram, the problem you are trying to solve is probably very bounded in size
15:29:46cnclso you can analyze the problem you are trying to solve, figure out how much memory needs to be reserved to handle strings, and then just only use that much
15:29:54xorbitIt is, just parsing simple serial port commands and outputting data
15:31:18xorbitI was doing an experiment implementing the same parsing code in C and Nim. The Nim code was of course more beautiful because it was higher level. I now have to see how I can make it lower level and still be nice enough to be worth it to bother with Nim. :)
15:32:10Araqit is worth it. you get bounds checking and overflow checking and everything that is available at compile-time.
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15:35:18Araqyou get a real "bool" datatype, real enums, bitsets, real arrays that don't tumble down into pointers, a real 'case' statement where 'break' actually leaves the loop
15:35:56Araqetc etc. How anybody can be happy to use C remains the big mystery of our time. ;-)
15:37:48xorbitHaha, right. :) Believe me, there's a reason I'm interested in Nim! Embedded C is my bread and butter, but after doing enough high level code in Python I was getting spoiled. I would love Nim to be my "across the board" language, replacing both C and Python.
15:37:49cnclthe 5th and strongest force of nature
15:37:54cncl"historical reasons"
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15:39:24xorbitCan you clarify for me what string literals are like? I noticed for instance that with --os:standalone, I could compile `echo "test"` but not `let x = "test"`. So it looks like string literals are something different from string variables.
15:40:28Araqyou can also use let x: cstring = "test"
15:40:49Araqstring literals are special in that they are put in the static data section
15:41:13Araqthis is close to what C does with string literals
15:41:33Araqnote that the literal still contains the length information though
15:44:14xorbitSo when you do `let x: cstring = "test"`, it just updates the pointer to point to the static data section. What's the binary format with length info? <length><string data><zero termination> or something like that?
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15:56:19cnclAraq: https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/issues/3424 :)
15:56:31cnclhopefully i will get good enough soon to help fix things like this
15:56:39cnclbut i imagine that is one of the most difficult areas of the compiler
16:00:23cnclah, git supports nim via linguist, i updated the markdown
16:00:28cncler, github
16:02:01xorbitHmm, installing Nim devel from Github, get to the point where I'm doing `nim e install_nimble.nims` and I get: `lib/system/ansi_c.nim(38, 5) Error: cannot 'importc' variable at compile time`
16:03:36xorbitOh, wait, it's still using my old 0.11.2 Nim, my bad.
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16:28:14cnclactually it doesn't look that complicated
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16:41:22cnclis there a quick way to generate all permutations of an enum set?
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16:52:00cnclguess i'll try writing my first macro for it
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17:13:19xorbitcncl: Would the `nextPermutation` proc in the algorithm module be of any use to you?
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17:59:17cncli just ended up adapting this one for bitsets (i also needed powersets) https://github.com/def-/nim-unsorted/blob/master/powerset.nim
17:59:26cnclbut thanks :)
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18:07:50tmm1good morning
18:08:07Araqhey!
18:08:35cnclgreetings
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18:57:21softiniocan we only use varargs as parameters or can we use them everywhere else like and array or a seq
19:00:03def-softinio: only as parameters
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20:28:15cnclis there a way to list redundant import statements?
20:32:30Araqnot really
20:35:45cnclah ok
20:36:01Araqyou can implement this feature though
20:36:09Araqthere is some issue for it of course
20:36:33cncli'll take a look when i'm a bit more confident :)
20:36:51Araqdo you know our internal documentation already?
20:37:05cnclno
20:37:28Araqhrm I wonder why nobody can find it ...
20:38:17Araqhttp://nim-lang.org/docs/intern.html#debugging-the-compiler
20:38:30cnclah thanks
20:39:19xorbitAraq: Is there some special magic going on with the implementation of `echo`? When I try the same signature I get: `Error: invalid type: 'typed' in this context: 'proc (x: varargs[typed])'`
20:40:37Araqyes, but mere mortals can use it in a template
20:40:52xorbit:) OK
20:41:33Araqactually ... I think you need to use a macro.
20:41:54Araqcannot access varargs parameters reasonably in a template
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21:21:01Mat4hello
21:21:07Araqservus
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21:24:10AraqOnO: any downsides you can think of when we always flush after a writeLine in the compiler?
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21:25:49Araqthe compiler doesn't produce so much output that it would matter for performance
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21:52:48xorbitCool, got a working `echo` macro now using cstring, with a converter `$` from int to cstring. :) Happily surprised with how easy it is to get up to speed with this.
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21:56:07xorbitIs there an equivalent for C's 'static' when declaring a value in a function? Local scope but allocated in the data segment.
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22:00:21dom96xorbit: 'const'?
22:01:05xorbitdom96: No I need to be able to change it (var)
22:01:16Jehan_xorbit: {.global.} pragma
22:01:30xorbitThanks!
22:01:57reactormonkxorbit, so that's where static comes from in java - good to know.
22:02:06dom96i see
22:02:12Mat4ciao
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22:10:07xorbitHow do you get the number of possible values of an enum? .len doesn't seem to do it. For instance `type TestEnum = enum One, Two, Three, Four`, length would be 4.
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22:23:22tmm1high(TestEnum) == 3
22:23:34tmm1i'm not sure if there's a way to get the cardinality
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22:56:02xorbitThanks tmm1!
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23:00:59xorbitOTOH, it doesn't seem to work... `echo high(TestEnum) == 3` -> `Error: type mismatch: got (TestEnum, int literal(3))`
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23:12:24cnclin c++ and other languages i'm used to explicitly dealing with slack in resizable arrays (c++ STL "vectors", or whatever the project is using)
23:13:18cncloops hold on
23:14:23cnclsetLen on a seq does not reallocate it when the new size is smaller?
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23:20:35dom96xorbit: use `ord` to get the int value of TestEnum
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23:28:44xorbitCan a macro create a variable and pass a type cast of it out to the "calling" scope?
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23:33:28NimBotnim-lang/Nim devel 82a0405 Aman Gupta [+0 ±1 -0]: fix failure in tests/method/tmapper.nim... 8 more lines
23:33:28NimBotnim-lang/Nim devel 61ace9e Aman Gupta [+0 ±1 -0]: fix failure in lib/pure/ospaths.nim... 7 more lines
23:33:28NimBotnim-lang/Nim devel 18882d0 Aman Gupta [+0 ±1 -0]: fix test failures in subexes due to missing trailing whitespace... 14 more lines
23:33:28NimBotnim-lang/Nim devel f89c247 Aman Gupta [+1 ±0 -0]: fix test failure in coro.nim... 7 more lines
23:33:28NimBot18 more commits.
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