<< 25-09-2014 >>
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02:06:41NimBotVarriount/NimLime master 58e825c Erik O'Leary [+0 ±2 -0]: Added 'declared' keyword
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04:46:23fowlagreed <Onionhammer> Araq you should add an 'else' for for loops, where if the loop has nothing to iterate over it executes that
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18:23:11woodgiraffeI have a block inside a loop that potentiall throws a set of exceptions, now when an Exception is thrown I'd like to print the same error messages as if it wouldn't be consumed and proceed within the loop.
18:24:05woodgiraffeFrom my understandment I'd have to have separate except clauses for every potentially thrown exception and thus this wouldn't be possible. - Is this correct?
18:24:14EXetoCI don't know of a way to get the actual name of the type
18:24:20Araqwoodgiraffe: getCurrentException() ?
18:24:47Araqexcept EFoo, EBar, EBaz:
18:24:56Araq echo getCurrentExceptionMsg()
18:25:26woodgiraffeAraq: ahh nice, ty
18:26:06EXetoCthat is indeed the actual message, with the type name being just additional information
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18:27:37AraqEXetoC: dunno if that field is exported, but I'm sure you can access it via 'cast' and get the exception *type* as a cstring
18:27:55Araqbut how is that useful?
18:28:05Araqbtw the exception names all changed in bigbreak
18:28:17Araqso ... these names are kind of fragile anyway
18:32:13Araqbbl
18:32:44Araqwoodgiraffe: btw check out getStackTrace(e) and writeStackTrace()
18:32:55Araqthese are *really* useful :-)
18:32:55woodgiraffeAraq: ty will do
18:36:16woodgiraffeI also wondered: I'd like to, I guess at least, parse, a nim-project, resolve all its imports and get out a list of all the files that project depends on, including importcs. - Any rough pointers what parts I could use to achieve this?
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18:45:27Jehan_For what it's worth, I'm not a huge fan of using the type hierarchy as a way to model the exception hierarchy.
18:45:31Jehan_It is very limited.
18:46:16Jehan_You could model each exception as an integer and then have more flexible ways of categorizing them.
18:46:29Jehan_E.g. by membership in a bitset.
18:47:49Jehan_Using the type hierarchy as a poor man's partial order results in too much being hardcoded.
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19:27:59Araqwoodgiraffe: 'nimrod gendepend' generates a dependency graph
19:29:59AraqJehan_: I agree
19:30:14Araqbut
19:30:30Araq"extensible" distinct integers are hard
19:30:54Araqconst OverflowError = Error(8) # why 8?
19:31:09Jehan_Only if you want to define them at compile time.
19:31:25Araqconst FloatError = Error(succ(OverflowError)) # lets hope nobody else uses 9
19:31:43Jehan_Mind you, it's not entirely trivial at runtime, either (threads), but a lot more doable.
19:31:52Araqwell yes ofc I want to define them at compile time :-)
19:32:11Jehan_Why? It's not as though exceptions are cheap.
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19:34:17Araqsure but this problem is worth solving for lots of other use cases
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19:34:58Jehan_Speaking of threads, I may be willing to finish the useStackMaskHack implementation if you're interested. While still using the main thread, too.
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19:38:14Araqhrm please no. it's yet another version of the stdlib that we have to maintain
19:38:24EXetoCjust start at some relatively high, arbitrary number :>
19:38:45Araq--gc:X -d:release, -d:debug, stdlib as a DLL ...
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19:39:52Araqthe combinatorial explosion is a problem
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19:44:16AraqJehan_: what I consider more important is a new 'channel' type that is GC'ed
19:44:37Jehan_Araq: Yeah, but that would also be more work. :)
19:44:57Araqit is a 'ref' to a payload that is reference counted
19:45:31Araq'deepCopy' is overriden so the payload keeps reference semantics
19:45:48Jehan_Exactly, I'd have to dig into those semantics first.
19:45:50Araqand deepcopy + a finalizer maintain the RC
19:46:07Jehan_The stackmask stuff is pretty trivial (it helps that I've done it several times by now).
19:46:26Jehan_I'm more asking if I'd be wasting my time if I did that.
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19:48:48Araqwell I'm torn
19:49:08Araqit's a nice hack to get more speed on barbaric OSes like macosX
19:49:19woodgiraffe:)
19:49:34Araqbut it's also yet another thing we need to maintain
19:50:19Araqbtw they found a new security hole in Bash ...
19:51:03woodgiraffepretty bad too
19:54:46Araqyeah and Nim's effect system would have caught it :-)
19:55:38EXetoCC isn't perfect? oh well
19:56:08AraqEXetoC: well to be fair, it's not another buffer overflow
19:56:21Araqit's a feature that can be misused
19:57:11Araqif Microsoft had this bug, the net would be full of "windoze is the shit"
19:58:09Araqbut it's *nix, so it's like "yeah well, no system is perfect"
19:58:45Jehan_Hmm, I saw a lot of people saying rather not so complimentary things about bash.
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20:00:11Jehan_My own thoughts were along the lines of "oh dear, what were they thinking?"
20:00:42Araqmy thoughts were "yes, that is what you get for using *untyped* byte streams everywhere" :P
20:01:33Jehan_Honestly, there's just so many ways in which processes can communicate with other processes.
20:01:56Jehan_But, the environment is such a common attack vector already ...
20:02:39Jehan_I could accept them even parsing the environment variables to define functions. But executing any code in environment variables?
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20:06:19Mat3hello
20:06:40Araqparsing environment variables to define functions is already stupid, IMO
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20:07:31Araqand the underlying problem is that there are no APIs in Unix land, but a couple of byte streams for inter process communication
20:08:04AraqJehan_: well if you look for something easy to do, why not fix the exception handling bug? :-)
20:08:34Jehan_Not sure if that's easy, but I agree that it's high priority.
20:08:44woodgiraffeAraq: dbusdbusdbus :P
20:08:56Jehan_I had a look at the code, and I'm still not sure I fully understand the way it works now.
20:09:13Jehan_If I had a solution, I'd already have submitted a pull request.
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20:09:53Jehan_Unrelated question: are defines starting with "nim" reserved for the compiler and stdlib?
20:10:03Araqyes.
20:10:19AraqJehan_: well it's easy to patch sempass2 to do the analysis
20:10:36Araqit could set sfVolatile for locals that are assigned within a try
20:10:44Jehan_It's easy if you already have a deep understanding of what sempass2 does.
20:10:58Jehan_At times, I'm still trying to understand individual functions.
20:13:33Araqwell ok, it's as much effort for me to fix as it is to explain it ...
20:15:25Jehan_Umm, I don't mind investing the time myself.
20:15:40Jehan_I expect that understanding it will pay off later.
20:16:58EXetoCAraq: did you mean "is this" rather than "is the shit"?
20:17:01EXetoC*shit
20:17:52AraqEXetoC: "windows is shit"
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20:43:17Araqargh
20:43:40AraqI hate it when you think the compiler is wrong
20:43:44Araqbut it is correct
20:43:50Araqand your code really is wrong
20:44:42Jehan_Heh. :)
20:46:41EXetoCcompilers so strict
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21:17:39AraqJehan_: is it allowed to pass the empty string to a C macro?
21:17:52Araq#define f(a, b) a
21:17:57Araqf(34,)
21:18:05Araq<-- valid?
21:18:30Jehan_I believe so, why?
21:19:59Araqcause I'm gonna use it in the codegen
21:22:56EXetoCthe GCC manual seems to indicate that it's allowed
21:24:02EXetoC"If I understand correctly, empty macro argument is allowed since C99 and C++0x(11)." hm
21:24:49EXetoCthat's no good then, is it
21:25:03Mat3would it be a good idea to extend Nim(rod) supporting multible return values (like Go does for example) ?
21:25:52AraqMat3: proc foo(): tuple[a, b: int]
21:26:00Araqlet (x, y) = foo()
21:26:16Araqi.e. it already has them
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21:30:04Mat3hmm, nice example thanks (I think the documentation should be more detailed on these aspects)
21:33:32Jehan_The problem is that someone need to write a "Programming in Nim" book.
21:33:40Jehan_Which is not exactly a trivial endeavor.
21:33:45Jehan_needs*
21:35:02Jehan_Araq: I've tidied up the setjmp performance PR, but I think it's impossible to turn setjmp() into a compiler proc for the reasons we've discussed.
21:35:24Araqok
21:38:33EXetoCslightly slower than an asm impl, right?
21:38:48Jehan_EXetoC: What is?
21:39:28EXetoCnevermind
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22:29:48Mat3ciao
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