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| 04:24:38 | Varriount | Araq: Ok. |
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| 04:42:54 | Varriount | Araq: Do you want the build process to be run for every single commit, or is it ok to clump them together based on time? |
| 04:43:27 | fowl | run it once an hour on the hour |
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| 07:06:56 | Araq | Varriount: run it for every commit for now |
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| 08:51:18 | NimBot | Araq/Nimrod devel c1930f1 Araq [+0 ±1 -0]: fixes #1672 |
| 08:51:18 | NimBot | Araq/Nimrod devel 7edf6fc Araq [+1 ±2 -0]: fixes #1547 |
| 08:51:18 | NimBot | Araq/Nimrod devel b4e38cb Araq [+1 ±1 -0]: fixes #1657 |
| 08:51:18 | NimBot | Araq/Nimrod devel eb69b81 Araq [+0 ±2 -0]: doc improvements |
| 08:51:18 | NimBot | 2 more commits. |
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| 08:58:24 | gokr | Morning folks |
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| 09:00:28 | Varriount | gokr: Morning! |
| 09:02:23 | Araq | Varriount: bug #1601 still relevant? |
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| 09:09:47 | Varriount | Araq: I don't know. I'm testing to see if it still applies at the moment. |
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| 09:27:30 | gour | morning all users of soon-to-conquer-the-world programming language |
| 09:29:43 | ekarlso- | hah :p |
| 09:29:52 | ekarlso- | anyone made anything cool in nimrod ? |
| 09:30:17 | Varriount | ekarlso-: You mean, besides Nimrod itself? :p |
| 09:30:26 | Varriount | Er, I mean, 'Nim' |
| 09:30:35 | ekarlso- | Varriount: yeah, any server software or so ;) |
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| 09:30:47 | Varriount | ekarlso-: Well, look at babel, jester, and a bunch of other stuff |
| 09:31:18 | ekarlso- | Varriount: where ? :) |
| 09:33:07 | gokr | If you want to see some sample code of a threaded fast socket server, see http://goran.krampe.se/2014/10/25/nim-socketserver |
| 09:33:58 | Varriount | Hrm. pegs.nim is broken |
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| 09:35:21 | gokr | A cool lib to port to Nim is PetitParser. |
| 09:35:38 | Varriount | Or CodeTalker |
| 09:35:53 | Varriount | Or Qt |
| 09:36:06 | gokr | ? |
| 09:36:36 | * | gour would be happy even with wx |
| 09:36:39 | gokr | I meant port, not wrap. |
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| 09:38:15 | bombsite | hello!, anyone alive |
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| 09:38:46 | bombsite | have a few questions |
| 09:40:35 | Varriount | Yep |
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| 09:43:04 | gour | gokr: aren't such libs too big to be ported? |
| 09:43:33 | gokr | I didn't mention Qt, Varriount did. |
| 09:45:52 | gokr | Also, its not only a size problem - for Qt (and most substantial libraries) you want to "tap in" to that line of development. If you port, you have basically forked and are on your own maintaining it. |
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| 09:46:49 | gokr | But PetitParser is a beautiful parsing library that combines a series of cool mechanisms (Pegs, pack rat parsers, parser combinators etc) into something very slick. |
| 09:47:12 | gokr | Its also already been ported from Smalltalk to both Dart and... js I think. |
| 09:48:00 | gour | heh, you like smalltalk stuff ;) |
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| 09:50:21 | bombsite | I just graduated in June and started a SWE job |
| 09:50:48 | bombsite | I've been looking for a OS project to work on on weekends to keep my skills sharp, does nimrod need any help? :) |
| 09:52:12 | gour | bombsite: probably not. it's well established language with big corporate support and large team of paid devs |
| 09:53:45 | bombsite | gour: understood. I'll look for another one then. |
| 09:54:06 | gour | bombsite: ok. try with java ;) |
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| 09:56:29 | Araq0 | bombsite: welcome! yes please help |
| 09:56:39 | Araq0 | don't listen to gour he's not serious |
| 09:57:14 | Araq0 | you can start with fixing bugs marked as "easy" |
| 09:59:00 | bombsite | Do you use github issues as your primary tracker? |
| 09:59:10 | bombsite | no bugzilla or jira or anything like that? |
| 10:02:06 | Araq0 | yes |
| 10:02:25 | Araq0 | we use github's issue tracker which I like quite a bit |
| 10:06:01 | bombsite | Araq0: coolio :). do you have any wikis or design docs that I can read to try to understand the codebase better? |
| 10:06:41 | Araq0 | there's the internal documentation |
| 10:07:08 | Araq0 | http://nim-lang.org/intern.html |
| 10:07:18 | Araq0 | but it's a bit out of date |
| 10:07:58 | gokr | bombsite: Welcome! |
| 10:08:44 | gokr | bombsite: You could start with reading some articles I have written. |
| 10:08:53 | gokr | The bootstrapping article may be of interest. |
| 10:09:03 | gokr | http://goran.krampe.se/category/nim |
| 10:10:35 | gokr | Araq: I just wrote down some thoughts on ... interactive coding. Will make it a small article, but the gist of it is "I want dynamic module reloading and a tether module so that I can inspect data over a socket" :) |
| 10:10:51 | bombsite | cool thanks. I'll read it and get back in here tomorrow with questions <3 |
| 10:11:00 | bombsite | g'night yall |
| 10:11:08 | gokr | gnite! |
| 10:11:17 | gour | 'night |
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| 10:15:08 | Araq0 | gokr: we can patch ENDB to provide that |
| 10:15:20 | gokr | Cool :) |
| 10:16:17 | Araq0 | but we better find a way to always enable it or something, otherwise the difference between -d:debug and -d:release is really annoyingly big |
| 10:16:28 | gokr | If we could make a simple protocol for inspecting data (listing vars in various scopes, asking Nim to marshal vars) then we can easily make an external tree widget tool thingy to drill. |
| 10:16:45 | gokr | mmm |
| 10:17:26 | gokr | Combining such a "driller" tool alongside with a GDB based debugger like KDevelop - then I am a happy clam. |
| 10:17:47 | gokr | I can gladly write such a visual explorer - if we can get a simple protocol in place. |
| 10:18:00 | Araq0 | or maybe we should just patch GDB |
| 10:18:10 | Araq0 | I heard it now has python scripting |
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| 10:18:27 | gokr | Yes, I read a bit about that and also dug out several articles on it. |
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| 10:18:42 | gokr | You can make "pretty printers" etc |
| 10:18:50 | Araq0 | yeah |
| 10:19:10 | Araq0 | it also supports remote debugging iirc |
| 10:20:08 | gokr | yeah, just ... wonder if ... it may be smarter to make our own "out of band". |
| 10:20:23 | gokr | Or at least simpler. |
| 10:20:37 | gokr | Do we have introspection capabilities? |
| 10:21:01 | Araq0 | we have RTTI and ENDB uses it to display stuff |
| 10:21:57 | gokr | Right, cool. And why ... didn't we want to pursue ENDB? |
| 10:22:07 | Araq0 | however, my opinion is that we're better off patching GDB's debug info and script GDB |
| 10:23:06 | Araq0 | ENDB is slower, has never been tested with multi threading, and affects the code generation too much |
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| 10:30:14 | gokr | Just glanced through endb, neat. |
| 10:30:48 | gokr | So I can "only" access globals and locals in a frame? |
| 10:31:32 | Araq0 | you can go up a frame and then inspect that frame |
| 10:31:42 | gokr | Any way to reach the rest of variables? Like inside modules? |
| 10:32:05 | Araq0 | iirc globals lists every global there is, prefixed with 'module.' |
| 10:32:25 | gokr | So all exported variables |
| 10:32:37 | Araq0 | no. all variables. |
| 10:32:40 | gokr | Oh, aha |
| 10:32:47 | gokr | good :) |
| 10:32:55 | * | gokr itching... |
| 10:33:35 | Araq0 | I stole the technology from SmartEiffel btw |
| 10:33:58 | gokr | The RTTI stuff? |
| 10:36:10 | Araq0 | the idea of how ENDB can work |
| 10:36:17 | gokr | ok |
| 10:36:48 | gokr | The Smalltalk Debugger is pretty cool btw. I always thought it was "magical", before I one day read its code and ... hey, it was just Smalltalk. |
| 10:37:34 | gokr | So I added a menu entry in it where you can - if you like - return from a method returning the value of an expression you type in. |
| 10:38:15 | gokr | Like... "ooh, this method is going to fail or return the wrong value... but I just want to debug further so... let's return 5." |
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| 10:42:00 | gokr | Araq0: http://www.yosoygames.com.ar/wp/2013/12/gdb-pretty-printers-for-ogre-simd-datatypes/ |
| 10:50:47 | Araq0 | well the official docs don't look too bad at first sight: https://sourceware.org/gdb/onlinedocs/gdb/Writing-a-Pretty_002dPrinter.html |
| 10:52:26 | gokr | No, I scanned them too a bit. |
| 10:52:33 | gokr | Looked fairly well documented. |
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| 11:27:17 | matkuki | Hi, can I use the Nimrod logo (the crown) in my editor, to indicate when editing a nimrod file? |
| 11:27:56 | matkuki | The image would appear on the editing tab and when selecting the Nimrod lexer. |
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| 11:32:07 | Araq0 | matkuki: pretty sure you can do that |
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| 15:02:19 | * | gokr had no idea less works on tar balls and zips... |
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| 15:27:52 | EXetoC | it doesn't need to care about the contents |
| 15:32:11 | EXetoC | I mean, it just reads bytes |
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| 16:39:10 | gokr | Well... it seems to list contents :) |
| 16:40:28 | gokr | In fact, it seems to do various smart tricks. I just tried to do less on an rpm file, and... I think it tried to do some query (but failed since this is on Ubuntu) |
| 16:41:13 | gokr | hehe, yeah, it works for debs too. |
| 16:41:30 | EXetoC | the archives are compressed? |
| 16:41:47 | gokr | The zip and tar.gz? sure |
| 16:42:31 | gokr | So obviously it uses some various commands to produce reasonable output based on extension. |
| 16:42:38 | gokr | I just didn't know |
| 16:42:48 | EXetoC | I don't know which variation of less that is |
| 16:43:18 | gokr | Its on my Ubuntu |
| 16:44:26 | EXetoC | right, lesspipe |
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| 18:53:20 | flaviu | Anyone have any idea where filwit disappeared? |
| 18:53:43 | flaviu | Did he put up the sources for the new docs anywhere? |
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| 18:58:11 | Araq | I don't think so |
| 18:58:21 | Araq | no idea where he hides |
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| 19:02:51 | Araq | ping Varriount |
| 19:04:19 | flaviu | I got his email out of git, lets see if he checks that. |
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| 19:08:48 | Araq | well I have his skype address but he is offline |
| 19:09:25 | Araq | gokr: what did we decide? builtin named "procCall" to prevent dynamic binding? |
| 19:14:59 | gokr | Hum? |
| 19:15:21 | gokr | Ah... the exact name of it - I am not sure we decided. |
| 19:15:29 | gokr | You said static_all IIRC |
| 19:15:42 | gokr | I am putting Lilly to bed, back later |
| 19:15:49 | gokr | static_call I mean |
| 19:16:47 | Araq | what about meth(a, b).asProc ? |
| 19:20:16 | gokr | Yeah... but it looks like you are calling asProc on the result of meth? |
| 19:20:52 | gokr | "resolve"? |
| 19:21:59 | gokr | later |
| 19:23:52 | Araq | asProc m(a, b) |
| 19:25:18 | Araq | m.asProc a, b |
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| 19:32:02 | Mat4 | hello |
| 19:41:12 | Araq | Mat4: hi. read the logs. any opinion? |
| 19:41:29 | Mat4 | hi Araq, one moment please |
| 19:42:15 | flaviu | I'm not sure I understand the type of a closure.. |
| 19:42:15 | flaviu | Is there any way to avoid having to deal with typemismatch {.gcsafe, locks: 0.}, {.closure.}? |
| 19:43:06 | flaviu | or perhaps there's a type mismatch somewhere else in there, let me look harder |
| 19:44:32 | flaviu | Looks like if I remove the explicit type signature it works |
| 19:45:24 | Mat4 | Araq: do you mean the current log file ? |
| 19:45:35 | dom96_ | flaviu: Do you want to get the new docs working with the docgen? |
| 19:45:50 | dom96_ | I have his email, I can ask him for his design. |
| 19:46:07 | Araq | Mat4: the very recent stuff |
| 19:46:09 | flaviu | dom96_: I already got the email and sent him a message |
| 19:46:54 | flaviu | dom96_: witte2008@... ? |
| 19:47:44 | dom96_ | yep |
| 19:47:55 | dom96_ | It would be awesome if you could get that working. |
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| 19:50:18 | Mat4 | Araq: In case you refer to the naming convention preventing dynamic linking, why not simply label it "static" ? |
| 19:50:54 | Araq | Mat4: static is already a keyword and means something different |
| 19:51:11 | EXetoC | static2 \o/ |
| 19:51:17 | Mat4 | *g* |
| 19:52:58 | flaviu | `__static`! |
| 19:54:21 | flaviu | Or, how about `ｓｔａｔｉｃ`? |
| 19:54:48 | EXetoC | or just µ |
| 19:55:02 | Araq | __sttc # proper unix style :P |
| 19:55:24 | Araq | vowels are expensive |
| 19:55:42 | Mat4 | statCall |
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| 19:55:55 | flaviu | pcSTATIC <- windows style! |
| 19:56:10 | Araq | that would be LPSTATIC |
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| 19:57:33 | EXetoC | the proper kind of hungarian at least |
| 19:57:37 | Araq | well for now I prefer procCall |
| 19:57:57 | Joe_knock | python style : __static__ |
| 19:58:07 | Joe_knock | I kid, dont use that, it's horrible |
| 19:58:24 | Mat4 | in Algol related language procedures would be simply marked as constant -> 'constCall' |
| 19:59:04 | * | Boscop quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
| 19:59:20 | Mat4 | (personally preferred camelCase) |
| 19:59:41 | Mat4 | ^languages |
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| 20:00:57 | Araq | Mat4: constCall reminds me too much of c++'s const_cast |
| 20:01:15 | Mat4 | eh, all right |
| 20:08:27 | Mat4 | DEF STATIC SUB label p1..pN RETURN r1..rN ... subEND -> 'statProcCall' |
| 20:17:26 | EXetoC | dom96_: what did you dislike about gtk? other than the scrolling issue |
| 20:17:55 | EXetoC | I had some difficult with scrolling the bottom. I think it was the type names that weren't obvious |
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| 20:34:36 | dom96_ | EXetoC: It's just not flexible enough. There is no documentation about how things work at the low level. |
| 20:35:07 | dom96_ | I wanted to get scrolling past bottom in Aporia working but doing so is not trivial. |
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| 20:39:07 | flaviu | `(try: ... except:)` fails for some reason |
| 20:39:12 | flaviu | something about invalid ast. |
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| 20:42:57 | Araq | flaviu: report it |
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| 20:59:12 | Mat4 | I have nine instructions left. Have someone ideas for special opcodes which should be part of common processors ? |
| 20:59:23 | EXetoC | dom96_: I'll ask for specifics when I've created bindings for EFL, just to compare |
| 20:59:30 | EXetoC | I mean, Elementary |
| 20:59:39 | dom96_ | I doubt that's any better. |
| 20:59:47 | dom96_ | It's not even cross-platform is it? |
| 20:59:55 | EXetoC | you don't think so? |
| 20:59:58 | EXetoC | it is apparently |
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| 21:03:49 | Mat4 | ok, I add some MIMD intrinsics |
| 21:04:32 | dom96_ | Mat4: What are you working on at the minute? |
| 21:05:57 | Mat4 | FPGA efficient ISA |
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| 21:14:44 | EXetoC | dom96_: why do you doubt it? do most widget toolkits have similar issues? |
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| 21:15:13 | dom96_ | EXetoC: Yes. EFL does not look particularly impressive. |
| 21:15:43 | EXetoC | Elementary |
| 21:16:02 | EXetoC | I guess you can use various EFL components to reinvent the whell |
| 21:16:05 | EXetoC | wheel |
| 21:16:51 | EXetoC | I guess it's a part of EFL, just that it's not a core component |
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| 21:21:07 | flaviu | Is there some way to get nim to not have any output? |
| 21:27:02 | Mat4 | hmm, what's EFL ? Enlightement Foundation Library probably... |
| 21:27:27 | Araq | flaviu: "nim check", "nim c --compileOnly" |
| 21:28:37 | flaviu | Doesn't seem to work, it still outputs lots of stuff |
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| 21:31:15 | Araq | --verbosity:0 --hints:off ? |
| 21:31:24 | Araq | what do you mean by "output"? |
| 21:32:18 | flaviu | output on stdout |
| 21:33:14 | flaviu | Anyway, that's good enough. I can manually fix the warnings, thanks! |
| 21:33:56 | flaviu | I didn't notice that verbosity could be set to 0 to signify quiet, usually there is a separate --quiet switch |
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| 22:02:41 | EXetoC | Mat4: yes (Libraries) |
| 22:03:01 | EXetoC | dom96__: I can ask about it now if you have an example |
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| 23:12:54 | flaviu | hrm, I can't use a macro pragma on a type |
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| 23:15:53 | t4nk581 | heyyyy |
| 23:16:08 | Araq | hi t4nk581 |
| 23:16:54 | t4nk581 | rlly like your lang, gotta say |
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| 23:20:00 | Araq | thanks |
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