| 00:01:28 | FromDiscord | <ShalokShalom> https://dev.to/vtrpldn/vs-code-shortcuts-that-i-would-teach-myself-if-i-had-a-time-machine-with-limited-fuel-36md |
| 00:04:34 | FromGitter | <awr1> for a given enum is there an easy way to generate a set containing all possible enum values of the enum in question? I'm thinking `{EnumType.low .. EnumType.high}` but I wondered if there was anything else |
| 00:04:47 | Yardanico | for enums with holes your way will work just fine |
| 00:04:54 | disruptek | nah. |
| 00:05:01 | Yardanico | you can also do EnumType.firstValue .. EnumType.lastValue |
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| 00:06:37 | Yardanico | disruptek: why? it works for enums without holes just fine |
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| 00:07:27 | disruptek | sure, but that's not what you said. |
| 00:07:37 | Yardanico | well I meant *without holes] |
| 00:07:38 | Yardanico | lol |
| 00:07:47 | Yardanico | i only woke up a few hours ago |
| 00:07:54 | disruptek | not my problem. |
| 00:08:05 | Yardanico | you could've corrected me instead of just saying "no" :P |
| 00:08:20 | Yardanico | @awr1 - in short, for enums without holes it'll work fine |
| 00:08:34 | Yardanico | either Enum.low .. Enum.high or Enum.firstValue .. Enum.lastValue |
| 00:08:37 | Yardanico | both work |
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| 00:12:00 | FromGitter | <awr1> this is for an enum without holes |
| 00:12:03 | Yardanico | yes |
| 00:12:19 | FromGitter | <awr1> sets don't really work well with holed enums in general |
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| 00:20:24 | disruptek | clyybber: when will my prototypes work correctly? |
| 00:20:38 | Yardanico | disruptek: when the PR is merged |
| 00:20:46 | disruptek | WHEN WHEN WHEN |
| 00:20:58 | Yardanico | disruptek: https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/pull/15098 |
| 00:21:03 | Yardanico | sorry wrong one |
| 00:21:11 | disbot | ➥ Fix #15097 Compiler crashes when referring to an undeclared gensymmed… |
| 00:21:12 | Yardanico | https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/pull/15091 |
| 00:21:13 | disbot | ➥ Fix forward declaration issues in template/macro context |
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| 02:40:04 | FromDiscord | <treeform> Hey, is there a way to get `dumpHeapInstances()` style info from `--gc:arc`? It looks like `dumpHeapInstances()` does not work with `--gc:arc`. |
| 02:42:32 | FromDiscord | <treeform> I think my memory should be 700mb, but its 20GB instead. Not sure what is taking up the space. I would like to figure it out. |
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| 02:53:09 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> I think dumpHeapInstances relies on RTTI, arc doesn't have it. Did you try with orc first to see if it changes anything (on latest devel of course)? |
| 02:53:37 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> You can -d:useMalloc --debugger:native with arc/orc and then see where the leaks originate |
| 02:53:49 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> You can e.g. use massif for that |
| 02:53:56 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> Or just valgrind itself |
| 02:57:01 | shashlick | yardanico - you ready to try out `nimble --gc:arc test` |
| 02:59:21 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> Not right now, sorry :( |
| 03:03:41 | shashlick | no problem - see the changelog for the behavior changes - https://github.com/nim-lang/nimble/pull/829/files#diff-60bcbdc1b388b125a81c01bb5f659025 |
| 03:03:41 | disbot | ➥ Fix #757 - compile flags for test |
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| 03:10:33 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> Oh, neat |
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| 03:19:10 | FromDiscord | <treeform> @Yardanico I switched back --gc:refc and dumpHeapInstances() and I was able to quickly find my problem. I have not used massif or valgrind ... do they work with VC++ and Windows? I wich --gc:arc had quick way to see what is most of my memory. |
| 03:19:25 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> Oh, Windows |
| 03:19:46 | FromDiscord | <impbox> ooh need to try this dumpHeapInstances thing, is it documented anywhere? |
| 03:19:55 | FromDiscord | <impbox> lack of valgrind on windows really sucks D: |
| 03:20:09 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> I don't think there's something like dumpHeapInstances currently, mainly because there's no RTTI in ARC, maybe Araq can think of something :D |
| 03:20:24 | FromDiscord | <treeform> @impbox https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/blob/da29222f86f7689227ffe12605842d18c9bf0fc1/lib/system/gc_common.nim#L40 just here I think |
| 03:20:48 | FromDiscord | <impbox> thx |
| 03:20:50 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> @impbox it is documented |
| 03:20:52 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> https://nim-lang.org/docs/gc.html |
| 03:20:55 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> The last section |
| 03:21:22 | FromDiscord | <treeform> I wrote a little heapDiff, it tells me where the memory grew from last time I ran it. https://github.com/treeform/fidget/blob/master/src/fidget/opengl/perf.nim#L157 |
| 03:21:36 | FromDiscord | <impbox> @Yardanico seems to be missing from there, just dumpNumberOfInstances |
| 03:21:49 | FromDiscord | <impbox> nice |
| 03:21:57 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> Wdym missing? |
| 03:22:14 | FromDiscord | <impbox> @Yardanico no mention of `dumpHeapInstances` in your link |
| 03:22:23 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> There is |
| 03:22:25 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> Last section |
| 03:22:40 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> Ah no dumpHeapInstances ok |
| 03:23:11 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> dumpNumberOfInstances uses dumpHeapInstances internally anyway |
| 03:23:51 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> It's just that with dumpNumberOfInstances you get a formatted string with info, but with dumpHeapInstances it's an iterator |
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| 03:34:24 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> Not sure how hard it would be to bring RTTI (or something just for tracking memory usage by types) for ARC |
| 03:34:44 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> But aren't there any tools like that for C to track memory usage of specific types? |
| 03:56:24 | FromDiscord | <Varriount> Valgrind? |
| 03:56:31 | FromDiscord | <treeform> well nim knows all of the types right? can you just walk each ref and see what it points to? |
| 03:56:44 | FromDiscord | <treeform> In theory a big macro could do it. |
| 03:57:06 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> Well Nim doesn't really know the types at runtime currently :) |
| 03:57:22 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> @Varriount I don't think there's a way for valgrind to actually track types |
| 03:57:23 | FromDiscord | <treeform> with -d:nimTypeNames it does? |
| 03:57:26 | FromDiscord | <Varriount> Treeform: without rtti information, you can't know what the underlying type of a reference might be. It could be an extended type |
| 03:57:28 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> Like which structs and stuff |
| 03:57:33 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> @treeform even for arc? |
| 03:57:44 | FromDiscord | <treeform> I don't know about arc |
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| 04:30:01 | Yardanico | shashlick: I guess I'll try #829 rn |
| 04:31:44 | Yardanico | yeah seems to work for --gc:arc :P |
| 04:37:22 | shashlick | neat |
| 04:37:34 | shashlick | you agree with the changes? slight behavioral differences |
| 04:37:42 | Yardanico | I don't use nimble a lot honestly :P |
| 04:37:48 | Yardanico | it's better to ask people who do |
| 04:41:05 | shashlick | well you better start, and if you don't want to yet, i want to know why 😉 |
| 04:42:01 | Yardanico | well, maybe I'll use it more with your changes, but anyway, the F6 in vscode is bound to "nim c -r file.nim" by default :P |
| 04:42:02 | FromDiscord | <impbox> I generally prefer using Makefiles to nimble, though I've been trying to force myself to use nimble instead... but most of the time makefiles do what I want better with less work |
| 04:42:23 | FromDiscord | <impbox> but if nimble could work as a nice cross-platform makefile that'd be rad |
| 04:42:31 | Yardanico | that's nake :D |
| 04:43:13 | FromDiscord | <impbox> https://forum.nim-lang.org/t/3131#19708 |
| 04:43:18 | Yardanico | shashlick: so if I understood correctly, even if there's a custom "test" task defined, I can still pass --gc:arc with "nimble --gc:arc test" ? |
| 04:43:45 | Yardanico | of course if that custom test tast is not too custom |
| 04:43:46 | FromDiscord | <impbox> according to dom nimble is supposed to obsolete nake |
| 04:44:27 | FromDiscord | <impbox> makes sense for nimble to not have to rely on external build tools |
| 04:44:36 | Yardanico | because since I did the pkgraph thing eariler, I might just go ahead and try "nimble test" with refc on each package in nimble |
| 04:44:41 | Yardanico | and same for "nimble --gc:arc test" |
| 04:44:44 | Yardanico | and see the difference :P |
| 04:45:54 | Yardanico | need to clone them again now though |
| 04:47:22 | shashlick | So custom test task it won't work out of the box cause no idea how you will call Nim |
| 04:47:35 | Yardanico | yeah that's what I meant |
| 04:47:49 | shashlick | You can get the flags from commandLineParams and pass it manually |
| 04:47:58 | Yardanico | I guess I can check each .nimble file and see if it has a custom test task |
| 04:48:00 | shashlick | Yep |
| 04:48:03 | Yardanico | and only test packages without those |
| 04:48:22 | shashlick | Open to feedback so let me know |
| 04:48:32 | shashlick | Gotta bed, thanks for trying! |
| 04:48:37 | Yardanico | good night |
| 04:48:37 | FromDiscord | <impbox> nini |
| 04:50:47 | Yardanico | git go brr https://i.imgur.com/fqckqxZ.png |
| 04:51:04 | bung | am confusing , the httpclient.nim if Content-Length present it will call client.close ,shoudn't check Connection header before? |
| 04:51:55 | FromDiscord | <Varriount> Yardanico: what are you doing to your poor computer? |
| 04:52:02 | Yardanico | @Varriount well this is the third time |
| 04:52:10 | Yardanico | it's the pkgraph thing I have to clone all packages from nimble |
| 04:52:16 | Yardanico | but this time I'm doing it to test packages with arc |
| 04:52:26 | Yardanico | it's already done btw |
| 04:52:36 | Yardanico | 1339 folders of 2.9gb total size |
| 04:52:43 | Yardanico | (I pulled with --depth 1 of course) |
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| 04:52:49 | FromDiscord | <Varriount> bung: What information is in the Connection header? |
| 04:53:18 | bung | close or keep-alive |
| 04:55:15 | bung | also recvFull calls client.close after no more data |
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| 04:57:03 | Yardanico | so I guess I should try to test packages only if they're with a .nimble file (not .babel) and don't contain "task test" |
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| 04:58:33 | Yardanico | seems like 248 packages have a "task test," in .nimble |
| 04:58:36 | Yardanico | that's excluding treesitter |
| 05:00:35 | FromDiscord | <Varriount> If I recall, Keep-Alive is a suggestion, not something that has to be followed. |
| 05:02:42 | FromGitter | <bung87> that's more weird , if no content length present it will check connection header |
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| 05:05:33 | FromGitter | <bung87> does content length related to connection? I dont think so |
| 05:11:14 | Yardanico | mwamhahaha |
| 05:11:19 | Yardanico | https://i.imgur.com/mDv3LlA.png |
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| 05:11:59 | Yardanico | hm why failed though |
| 05:12:44 | Yardanico | ah typo |
| 05:13:26 | Yardanico | damn there are "trap" tests though :P |
| 05:13:31 | Yardanico | like "nio" - has a test which runs forever |
| 05:13:36 | Yardanico | basically serves a hello world page forever |
| 05:15:41 | Yardanico | https://i.imgur.com/d5kVhsK.png |
| 05:17:27 | Yardanico | i don't really care if something fails, I would mostly care about refc vs arc difference |
| 05:19:38 | Yardanico | imap package does the same (serves an imap client forever) |
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| 05:25:12 | Yardanico | lol I got spooked |
| 05:25:19 | Yardanico | "openal" test played a small sound :P |
| 05:26:11 | Yardanico | I'm just running all of this with refc first, then I'll run it with arc and do a simple |
| 05:26:17 | Yardanico | "diff passed_refc passed_arc" |
| 05:26:27 | Yardanico | although I don't yet handle nimble deps :P |
| 05:27:54 | Zevv | disruptek: I have new insights again about stack frames en envs, but I'm not sure if you even want to know all that |
| 05:36:58 | Yardanico | lol |
| 05:37:02 | Yardanico | now slappy is playing music for me |
| 05:37:07 | Yardanico | while testing it XD |
| 05:37:26 | Yardanico | some nice melodies though |
| 05:37:46 | Yardanico | "ascension_short_by_ross_bugden.ogg" |
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| 06:16:45 | Zevv | disruptek: good work, we're only 6 times slower then closure iterators! |
| 06:20:12 | Zevv | I love your solution btw. when declaredInScope. It's pretty out-of-the-box |
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| 06:31:40 | Yardanico | lol https://i.imgur.com/OgJdker.png |
| 06:31:57 | Zevv | ? |
| 06:31:57 | Yardanico | nmi package |
| 06:32:03 | Yardanico | that's the test output |
| 06:32:11 | Yardanico | I want to test quite a lot of nimble packages with arc and refc |
| 06:32:14 | Yardanico | to find failing ones |
| 06:32:34 | Yardanico | https://github.com/jiro4989/nmi |
| 06:32:35 | Zevv | the fun : |
| 06:32:37 | narimiran | Yardanico: you know about the recent work from shashlick regarding `nimble test`? |
| 06:32:40 | Yardanico | yes |
| 06:32:44 | Yardanico | that's why I'm doing this |
| 06:32:53 | narimiran | :thumb_up: |
| 06:33:06 | Yardanico | in the end I'll just run "diff passed_refc passed_arc" |
| 06:33:11 | Yardanico | and manually re-check the difference |
| 06:33:17 | Zevv | good work dude |
| 06:33:24 | Yardanico | ah shoot |
| 06:33:27 | Yardanico | should've chosen orc |
| 06:33:33 | Yardanico | but it's too late :P |
| 06:40:03 | Zevv | I just filed a bug report on nmi |
| 06:40:06 | Zevv | it's broken |
| 06:40:08 | Yardanico | wdym |
| 06:40:20 | Zevv | I can interrupt with ^C |
| 06:40:28 | Yardanico | yeah thats bad |
| 07:00:30 | Yardanico | I didn't finish the tests with arc, but already saw a few SIGSEGVs |
| 07:00:56 | Yardanico | so |
| 07:01:10 | Yardanico | is "swap" with arc supposed to work for a case like "swap(result[i], result[j])" ? |
| 07:01:17 | Yardanico | where result is a string |
| 07:03:07 | Yardanico | https://github.com/jabbalaci/nimpykot/blob/master/src/pykot/strings.nim#L60 |
| 07:15:18 | Yardanico | nbaser, sequtils2, combparser, protobuf, macroutils (know about this one),. parsetoml (deepCopy, know about this one), fftw3 (arraymancer), rbtree (know about this one), ptrace, bencode, markdown (know about this one, reported already), cassette, ad, negamax, pykot, edn, nimfm, shared, envconfig, kdb, nimly (know about this one), tim_sort (know about this one, already reported) |
| 07:15:21 | Yardanico | will check them manually |
| 07:15:42 | Yardanico | well there's probably more, I only tested the ones without a test task in .nimble |
| 07:17:50 | Zevv | well, you could ask your tests to their nimble files, right? :) |
| 07:17:58 | Yardanico | ? |
| 07:18:06 | Yardanico | well yes, but that's manual work |
| 07:18:14 | Yardanico | because people structure their manual test tasks differently |
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| 07:20:21 | Yardanico | oh the nbaser one is an interesting one |
| 07:20:24 | Yardanico | it checks if an exception was raised |
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| 07:20:32 | Yardanico | and it is raised, but last char in the exceptioon message is stripped |
| 07:20:37 | Zevv | sure just trolling |
| 07:20:40 | Yardanico | so the assertion fails |
| 07:20:55 | Zevv | I do the trolling when disruptek is at sleep |
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| 07:28:02 | Yardanico | funny bug lol |
| 07:31:05 | Yardanico | oh not really funny |
| 07:31:16 | Yardanico | it just relies on "repr" which is implementation-specific and behaves differently for arc :) |
| 07:31:52 | Yardanico | it relies on the fact that there's address with @ before the repr'd seq itself |
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| 07:39:54 | Yardanico | https://github.com/D-Nice/nbaser/issues/6 |
| 07:39:57 | disbot | ➥ ARC compatibility ; snippet at 12https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2szV |
| 07:41:14 | Yardanico | oh well, sequtils2 fails because there's no deepCopy for arc |
| 07:42:08 | Yardanico | if I replace it with just "sCopy = s", everything works |
| 07:42:22 | Yardanico | I suppose the author made it that way so the "unique" proc (that's where that deepCopy is) returned new data? |
| 07:42:40 | Yardanico | not sure why though |
| 07:42:50 | Yardanico | we already have a deduplicate proc in stdlibn |
| 07:52:04 | Yardanico | in combparser I get a SIGSEGV |
| 07:52:07 | Yardanico | noice |
| 07:53:48 | bung | nim repos github ci pkg:1 pkg:2 what'S the differiences ? |
| 07:53:53 | Yardanico | bung: batching |
| 07:54:03 | Yardanico | for faster CI full important package list is separated into two |
| 07:54:12 | Yardanico | which are tested in parallel so it's twice as fast :) |
| 07:54:57 | bung | that's great idea! |
| 07:55:04 | Yardanico | bung: see https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/blob/devel/testament/important_packages.nim |
| 07:55:09 | Yardanico | pkg1 and pkg2 |
| 08:11:46 | Yardanico | the combparser one seems like a closure arc bug |
| 08:13:46 | Yardanico | 1.0.8 soon yay |
| 08:14:20 | narimiran | Yardanico: spoiler alert! |
| 08:14:26 | Yardanico | well I saw the commit :P |
| 08:14:31 | narimiran | ssssh |
| 08:14:37 | Yardanico | how2delet in irc |
| 08:14:58 | narimiran | :D |
| 08:15:41 | Yardanico | this looks.. interesting https://i.imgur.com/ZT9LsMO.png |
| 08:16:20 | Yardanico | oh it actually fails earlier than here, maybe a cursorifier bug even |
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| 08:18:09 | Araq | fixed the showstopper bug for 1.2.x already |
| 08:18:25 | Yardanico | wait which one? |
| 08:18:33 | Araq | #14616 |
| 08:18:35 | disbot | https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/issues/14616 -- 3Constructing a uint64 range on a 32-bit machine leads to incorrect codegen ; snippet at 12https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2sA1 |
| 08:18:39 | Yardanico | oh |
| 08:24:57 | Yardanico | wow, with -d:useMalloc I an interesting malloc error |
| 08:24:58 | Yardanico | "malloc(): unsorted double linked list corrupted" |
| 08:25:07 | Yardanico | get* |
| 08:25:49 | Yardanico | I'll check if it's a cursor inference bug |
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| 08:27:30 | Yardanico | oh nice seems to be a cursorifier bug :) |
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| 08:32:53 | Yardanico | and yeah, combparser seem to do some kind of traversal with assignments |
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| 09:02:05 | FromGitter | <bung87> Yardanico when your pkg graph things done , it will seperate pkgs from pkg1-n automatically ? |
| 09:02:13 | Yardanico | wdym? |
| 09:02:27 | Yardanico | If you mean about testing with arc - I don't take packages from important packages, no |
| 09:02:38 | Yardanico | I parse packages.json from nimble and clone ALL repos |
| 09:02:47 | Yardanico | I did the same to make graphs of all nimble packages |
| 09:02:51 | FromGitter | <bung87> I mean important_packages.nim manually edit |
| 09:03:02 | Yardanico | well for that I just edited it |
| 09:03:06 | Yardanico | i didn't change pkg1 and pkg2 |
| 09:03:09 | Yardanico | and then manually ran it |
| 09:03:17 | FromGitter | <bung87> with graph can be automatically |
| 09:03:25 | Yardanico | wdym? |
| 09:03:42 | Yardanico | it's ./koch tests c nimble-packages-1 |
| 09:03:46 | Yardanico | and ./koch tests c nimble-packages-2 |
| 09:03:55 | Yardanico | that's what I mean by "manual" |
| 09:04:31 | FromGitter | <bung87> analyze the dependencies seperate it to n packages test , that would be even faster I think |
| 09:05:10 | Yardanico | that wouldn't help me |
| 09:05:21 | Yardanico | for arc testing which I did today I tested all packages from nimble |
| 09:05:24 | Yardanico | with my own small nim program |
| 09:05:28 | Yardanico | and with nimble test |
| 09:06:37 | Yardanico | Araq: this time I managed to make a much much simpler repro for (not sure if the same) cursor inference bug from combparser lib |
| 09:06:50 | Yardanico | https://gist.github.com/Yardanico/0769304d711d106989276eccec54d750 |
| 09:06:56 | FromGitter | <bung87> you take so much energy into arg things |
| 09:07:45 | FromGitter | <bung87> arc |
| 09:07:57 | Yardanico | I'm just spending my free time on something useful to other people :P |
| 09:10:51 | FromGitter | <bung87> that's cool |
| 09:15:41 | alehander92 | https://blog.repl.it/langjam |
| 09:15:55 | alehander92 | i am wondering if I should try |
| 09:16:02 | Yardanico | https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/issues/15110 |
| 09:16:04 | disbot | ➥ [ARC] SIGSEGV caused by cursor inference with a case object ; snippet at 12https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2sAc |
| 09:16:40 | alehander92 | does someone else have an idea? repl.it supports nim (if i do it alone, i'd probably try haskell tho) |
| 09:18:40 | Yardanico | oh seems like rresult is getting destroyed inside the if |
| 09:19:08 | Yardanico | but then a cursor to rresult.errors is being assigned into the error object |
| 09:19:13 | Yardanico | boom |
| 09:31:01 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Araq: Currently evalTempl only takes the ConfigRef as an arg and not the whole PContext (its getting called in the VM too, where there is no PContext) |
| 09:31:25 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Should I maybe use the procInstCache for storing the counter? |
| 09:31:30 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Or the ConfigRef? |
| 09:33:55 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> dumb question, so duno if i should use websockts or pure POST , i need to update data aprox evry 5 seconds |
| 09:34:10 | Yardanico | use UPDATE :P |
| 09:34:21 | Yardanico | ah sorry that doesn't exist |
| 09:34:27 | alehander92 | every 5 seconds doesn't seem so often |
| 09:34:30 | alehander92 | there is PATCH |
| 09:34:31 | alehander92 | iirc |
| 09:34:32 | Yardanico | oh |
| 09:34:38 | Yardanico | yeah you're right |
| 09:34:44 | Yardanico | "The HTTP PATCH request method applies partial modifications to a resource." |
| 09:34:54 | alehander92 | and PUT |
| 09:34:58 | alehander92 | but PATCH sounds better |
| 09:35:01 | Yardanico | well PUT is a bit different than PATCH |
| 09:35:10 | Yardanico | if we're talking about updating :P |
| 09:35:17 | Yardanico | @kodkuce just use http(s) |
| 09:35:18 | alehander92 | yeah! |
| 09:35:27 | alehander92 | but best to check the REST guidelines |
| 09:35:57 | alehander92 | i mean websockets won't hurt but i think rest might be fine |
| 09:36:01 | alehander92 | for once in 5 seconds |
| 09:36:29 | alehander92 | i honestly think of chats/games when i think sockets |
| 09:36:36 | alehander92 | or maybe maps |
| 09:37:34 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> i am making a dumb matchmaking server, so my GameInstances need to send to matchmaking serwer when they are free so can run new game |
| 09:38:11 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> and serwer send them Hi GI, here this 2 player want to play 🙂 |
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| 09:39:44 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> and then send to players this is IP/port to join your game, for players i am using websockts, tough now when i think i could use http too |
| 09:41:08 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> only reason i end up using webscokets for MM to Players is to keep count of atm players, but now when i think it can just read it from atm GI |
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| 09:41:28 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> now am thinking of removing all websockts for MM serwer |
| 09:44:23 | Yardanico | what are you using for the game itself? |
| 09:44:26 | Yardanico | I mean for networking |
| 09:45:18 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> websockets cuz am making a dumb game to dip into multyplayer, next time will try webrtc |
| 09:45:26 | Yardanico | why not just use websockets for everything? |
| 09:45:31 | Yardanico | for MM and for the game itself then |
| 09:45:36 | Yardanico | reusing same connection :P |
| 09:47:56 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> cuz i am tard ofc, i want to make it scalable for some unknow reason so i have 1 app(process) AuthRegSerwer(JWT), 1app MatchmakingServer, and then 10 GameInstanceServer, so i kinda cant reuse same connection 😛 |
| 09:48:04 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> (edit) '😛' => '😦' |
| 09:48:42 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> in reality i could have put all that in just one executable |
| 09:49:05 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> especialy cuz this game is tarded |
| 09:50:37 | FromDiscord | <Rika> isnt that even less scalable if you dont reuse resources |
| 09:50:59 | Yardanico | well it's "scalable" as in |
| 09:51:04 | Yardanico | you can put these 3 to different servers |
| 09:51:10 | Zevv | I love your solution btw. when declaredInScope. It's pretty out-of-the-box |
| 09:51:10 | Yardanico | to different locations, etc |
| 09:51:54 | FromDiscord | <dom96> I had to solve the same problem for Stardust |
| 09:52:22 | FromDiscord | <Rika> ah you mean microservice'd |
| 09:52:42 | FromDiscord | <dom96> The service that routes players to free servers simply polls each game server's /game/stats page, for example https://nyc1.stardust.dev/game/stats |
| 09:54:44 | FromDiscord | <Rika> sounds slow-ish but it probably isnt slow enough to be annoying |
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| 09:57:02 | FromDiscord | <dom96> Maybe but what you really want to optimise if the routing |
| 09:57:07 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> but this way when i have 50bilion players, i can just buy 10 servers , 1 hosting 1000auth executables, 1 hosting 1000MMs, and 8 hosting 10000GameInsances 🙂 |
| 09:57:09 | FromDiscord | <dom96> (edit) 'if' => 'is' |
| 09:57:53 | FromDiscord | <dom96> How are you going to get more players than people in the world? lol |
| 09:58:05 | FromDiscord | <Rika> its a joke i assume |
| 09:58:22 | FromDiscord | <Rika> or probably the long million vs short million problem |
| 09:58:47 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> i give evry player 50credits if he makes kid and gives him to play my game |
| 09:58:56 | alehander92 | wow |
| 09:59:08 | alehander92 | i'd like population increase |
| 09:59:12 | Yardanico | no |
| 09:59:16 | alehander92 | but i never expected scaling games to help |
| 09:59:31 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> after that i start brainwashing them all with inserted clips like from The Fight Club 🙂 |
| 09:59:42 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> easy world domination |
| 10:00:17 | alehander92 | *feels uneasy and secures west border* |
| 10:00:37 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> why would you want population increase? |
| 10:00:54 | Yardanico | exactly |
| 10:00:57 | Yardanico | we don't need that really :P |
| 10:00:59 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> to create criticall mass so they can implode |
| 10:01:03 | alehander92 | well, bulgaria is like very high in the shrinking population charts |
| 10:01:33 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> we need new oil reserves to be created from some bodys |
| 10:01:42 | alehander92 | and we're such cool people that it would be a shame for you to lose us |
| 10:02:09 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> evrybody ho has score ower 10000 is alowed to survive |
| 10:02:32 | alehander92 | kodkuce man, people would go to the army just to chill from playing the game |
| 10:03:08 | alehander92 | btw i read about galaxija |
| 10:03:15 | alehander92 | these days |
| 10:03:26 | alehander92 | seems as a cool tech, is it known there |
| 10:03:30 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> 10000score = natrual selection, i brinwash you all |
| 10:03:48 | alehander92 | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23971814 |
| 10:03:54 | alehander92 | (the article is actually ok) |
| 10:04:35 | alehander92 | i like error handling |
| 10:04:55 | alehander92 | Owing to this restriction, the system could only display three splendidly playful one-word error messages: users received a “WHAT?” if their BASIC code had a syntax error, a “HOW?” if their requested input was unrecognizable, and a “SORRY” if the machine exceeded its memory capacity. |
| 10:04:58 | FromDiscord | <kodkuce> nice i can use this to securly store all monerocoins i got mined by my brainwashed addicts |
| 10:05:03 | alehander92 | (quote from the article) |
| 10:05:17 | alehander92 | let's add such a mode for nim errors |
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| 10:20:20 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> is there a more efficient alternative to `card(b - a) > 0` for HashSets? |
| 10:20:35 | Yardanico | check if they have difference? |
| 10:20:45 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> no |
| 10:20:56 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> i need to check if set `a` contains all elements from `b` |
| 10:21:00 | Yardanico | ah |
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| 10:34:03 | FromDiscord | <exelotl> @alehander92 lol, reminds me of the 'PLEASE' keyword from intercal |
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| 10:35:11 | narimiran | @lqdev `card(b -a)` won't check that |
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| 10:38:07 | narimiran | @lqdev see this example for the fail in the logic: https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2sAv |
| 10:41:19 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> hm |
| 10:41:38 | FromGitter | <bung87> Araq how can I know where the empty array reach , Traceback doesn't show sigmatch |
| 10:41:51 | Yardanico | because traceback is only the end |
| 10:42:11 | Yardanico | it's only the direct traceback, not "what happened before" |
| 10:42:18 | Yardanico | you can try with some echoes and stuff :) |
| 10:42:23 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> well, the thing is I have a set of required components. eg. `Position, Size` and a set of specified components, eg. `Position, Size, PhysicsBody`, and I need to check whether the set of specified components contains all of the required components |
| 10:42:38 | Yardanico | you can try echoing stuff which gets passed to sigmatch.nim concreteType |
| 10:42:58 | FromGitter | <bung87> but echo in there too much outputs |
| 10:43:07 | Yardanico | see https://nim-lang.org/docs/intern.html |
| 10:43:14 | Yardanico | especially https://nim-lang.org/docs/intern.html#debugging-the-compiler |
| 10:43:21 | Yardanico | you can check if a node comes from specific nim file |
| 10:43:33 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> cc narimiran |
| 10:43:35 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> and |
| 10:43:46 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> if all the components aren't present, raise an error |
| 10:44:17 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> and that's effectively what `card(b - a)` does, it gives you the number of components that aren't in `a` but are in `b` |
| 10:44:36 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> so if that number > 0, there are some unimplemented components so I raise an error |
| 10:47:23 | narimiran | @lqdev, there is `<` to compare if one set is a subset of the other: https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2sAA |
| 10:47:57 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> yeah I saw that, but there's a problem |
| 10:48:02 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> > A strict or proper subset s has all of its members in t but t has more elements than s. |
| 10:48:17 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> in my case `t` doesn't necessarily have to have more elements than `s` |
| 10:48:49 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> nothing prevents you from adding just one system which requires a single component, and only implementing that single component |
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| 10:50:40 | narimiran | there is `<=` also |
| 10:51:08 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> `>=` doesn't do the thing I need though |
| 10:52:03 | narimiran | what do you need? don't you want to check if all the elements of one set are in the other? |
| 10:52:12 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> yeah *all* of them |
| 10:52:32 | narimiran | and how come `<=` doesn't do that for you? |
| 10:52:57 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> maybe I'm just misunderstanding |
| 10:53:21 | narimiran | if you want to check if all elements of `x` are in `y`, you need to do `x <= y` |
| 10:53:34 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> but somehow it doesn't work for me |
| 10:53:51 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> so for example |
| 10:53:52 | narimiran | you sure you use `<=` and not `>=`? (as you've written above) |
| 10:53:58 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> yes it's <= |
| 10:54:25 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> `x = {Position, PhysicsBody}` and `y = {Size, PhysicsBody, Gravity}`. `x <= y` returns true for some reason |
| 10:54:44 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> wait no |
| 10:54:57 | narimiran | :) |
| 10:55:13 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> ok i think i got it |
| 10:55:19 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> forgot a `not` there |
| 10:55:27 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> damn my brain is on airplane mode today |
| 10:56:20 | bung | hmm, give up |
| 10:59:09 | alehander92 | we don't give up |
| 11:01:12 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Araq: ping |
| 11:01:22 | Yardanico | marco polo |
| 11:01:39 | FromGitter | <bung87> it's slow for compile compiler then compile file that only echo variable or modify one line |
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| 11:02:07 | Yardanico | well depends on your hardware really |
| 11:02:13 | Yardanico | you use ./koch temp c right ? |
| 11:02:24 | alehander92 | we need IC for that |
| 11:02:32 | Yardanico | and btw, it's still miles better than for most of other languages :) |
| 11:02:35 | alehander92 | we can't all buy gaming hardware |
| 11:02:58 | FromGitter | <bung87> no comoilrr/nim c comoiler/nim.nim |
| 11:03:04 | Yardanico | don't do that |
| 11:03:09 | Yardanico | or at least add -d:leanCompiler |
| 11:03:14 | Yardanico | but really you should use ./koch temp |
| 11:03:57 | FromGitter | <bung87> koch temo some time use old code |
| 11:04:04 | Yardanico | it never does that for me lol |
| 11:04:09 | Yardanico | maybe you forgot ctrl+s? |
| 11:04:18 | Yardanico | or try removing the "nimcache" dir |
| 11:04:24 | Yardanico | in the base directory of the nim repo |
| 11:05:20 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> bung87: Oh, you probably have your compiler built with koch boot right? |
| 11:05:37 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> koch temp times will go down drastically after you did a ./koch boot -d:danger |
| 11:05:55 | Yardanico | wow, ref int :P |
| 11:06:12 | FromGitter | <bung87> yes, that i did old time |
| 11:06:59 | FromGitter | <bung87> ./compiler/nim c ./compiler/nim.nim is only constant right way for me |
| 11:07:08 | Yardanico | that's very slow |
| 11:07:17 | Yardanico | because you're using the nim compiler built in FULL debug mode |
| 11:07:32 | Yardanico | you should at least do something like |
| 11:07:52 | Yardanico | well, just really, why koch doesn't work for you? |
| 11:08:22 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> bung87: If you want to force koch temp to recompile you can just pass -f along |
| 11:08:24 | FromGitter | <bung87> maybe like Clyybber said |
| 11:08:26 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> so ./koch temp -f |
| 11:08:44 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> bung87: Yeah, its much better after you ran ./koch boot -d:danger |
| 11:09:07 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Yardanico: Yeah ref int :p |
| 11:09:13 | Yardanico | hehe |
| 11:09:26 | Yardanico | it's been never used in the compiler it seems :P |
| 11:09:30 | Yardanico | before |
| 11:09:30 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Nope |
| 11:09:47 | Yardanico | I mean I understand why you would want it in your case |
| 11:09:55 | Yardanico | to not add another argument to a lot of procs I guess |
| 11:10:33 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> yeah, and also because I need it to be shared accross the contexts |
| 11:10:59 | FromGitter | <bung87> ok , I'll try pick some lib's issues, that make me forgot compiler things |
| 11:11:47 | alehander92 | ok |
| 11:12:01 | Yardanico | you can always improve nim's ecosystem :P |
| 11:12:06 | Yardanico | https://github.com/nim-lang/needed-libraries/issues\ |
| 11:12:08 | Yardanico | https://github.com/nim-lang/needed-libraries/issues |
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| 11:13:51 | bung | yeah, I read that multiple times |
| 11:14:56 | bung | I have 4 pendding PR in nim repo now |
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| 11:24:46 | FromDiscord | <Varriount> I use `koch boot -d:release --stacktrace:on --linetrace:on` |
| 11:25:40 | FromDiscord | <Varriount> Bah, why must you open to message from 5 minutes ago Discord |
| 11:26:07 | Yardanico | i use ./koch boot -d:danger :) |
| 11:26:12 | Yardanico | when I hit crashes I can always do koch temp |
| 11:26:16 | Yardanico | and I want speed go brrr |
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| 11:32:00 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> can somebody explain to me why does `typeDesc[T]` exist |
| 11:32:08 | Yardanico | to represent types |
| 11:32:09 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> when you pass a type to a macro |
| 11:32:21 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> why not just get the symbol that refers to the type |
| 11:32:23 | Yardanico | you need to have a type to represent a type :) |
| 11:32:31 | Yardanico | because typedesc isn't exclusive to macros |
| 11:33:13 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> painful. |
| 11:33:32 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> typeDesc[T] makes dealing with types in macros 100x harder than it needs to be |
| 11:33:34 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> change my mind |
| 11:33:39 | Yardanico | does it? |
| 11:33:52 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> oh trust me, it does. |
| 11:34:00 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> every type you get—you have to strip the typedesc off of it. |
| 11:34:19 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> i already made an `obliterateTypedesc` proc to deal with it, but it's not ideal. |
| 11:35:01 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> just because `typedesc[T]` exists, using `sameType` to directly compare two types you get passed via arguments is not possible |
| 11:35:26 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> because as far as `sameType` is concerned, `typedesc is typedesc`. |
| 11:35:34 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Araq: Can we remove optNimV019 by now? |
| 11:35:47 | Yardanico | ehm how do you pass types to a macro @lqdev ? |
| 11:35:55 | Yardanico | i'm confused because if I pass something untyped, it's just ident |
| 11:35:58 | Yardanico | if typed, it's a sym |
| 11:35:58 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> Yardanico: via `typed`? |
| 11:36:26 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> it's a sym, but calling `sameType(a, b)` on two typed params `a` and `b` will always yield `true` :) |
| 11:36:30 | Yardanico | even when importing the type from another module |
| 11:36:47 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> you have to work around it: `sameType(a.getImpl[1], b.getImpl[1]` |
| 11:36:48 | Araq | clyybber: yes |
| 11:37:40 | Araq | lqdev: I have an unwritten RFC regarding typedesc and static T |
| 11:37:59 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> Araq: what is it about? |
| 11:38:11 | Araq | fixing them for good |
| 11:38:34 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> nice |
| 11:41:41 | Araq | so ... I heard you all want me to fix my cursor inference optimization |
| 11:41:54 | Yardanico | it's only me for now :P |
| 11:44:00 | FromGitter | <sealmove> hey guys, how do I delete nim cache? I don't know exactly what I am talking about but I have a program that reads files from a folder and when I add a file it should crash, but it doesn't because it has the previous run cached and doesn't notice the added file. |
| 11:44:17 | Yardanico | you can force the compiler to do full recompile with "-f" |
| 11:44:22 | FromGitter | <sealmove> nice, thanks |
| 11:44:23 | Yardanico | and cache on linux is by default in ~/.cache/nim |
| 11:44:30 | Yardanico | on *nix |
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| 11:45:01 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> and on windows it's in C:/Users/<user>/nimcache |
| 11:45:07 | Yardanico | oh really |
| 11:45:09 | FromGitter | <sealmove> -f works |
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| 11:56:32 | Yardanico | @Clyybber should swap work for chars in strings? |
| 11:56:39 | Yardanico | I've had one package fail because of that |
| 11:56:40 | Yardanico | with arc |
| 11:57:17 | Araq | it should work |
| 11:57:26 | Yardanico | ah I know why it fails |
| 11:57:29 | Yardanico | because of static arc strings :P |
| 11:57:46 | Yardanico | if you do "stdin.readLine()" it works with arc |
| 11:58:37 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> ah, good catch |
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| 11:59:29 | Yardanico | just made an issue so we get more closed issues :P https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/issues/15112 |
| 11:59:31 | disbot | ➥ [ARC] SIGSEGV when trying to swap in a literal/const string ; snippet at 12https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2sB5 |
| 12:00:28 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Araq: #15091 is ready, I had to share the counter with the VM because getAst does template expansion. |
| 12:00:29 | disbot | https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/pull/15091 -- 3Fix forward declaration issues in template/macro context |
| 12:05:39 | Yardanico | wow I didn't know we had term-rewriting macros in system |
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| 12:06:13 | Yardanico | only one seems like |
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| 12:09:44 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> huh, that is a pretty cool one |
| 12:10:04 | Yardanico | yeah "swapRefsInArray" |
| 12:10:07 | Yardanico | not sure if it's needed with arc though |
| 12:11:23 | Yardanico | ah it's not activated |
| 12:11:44 | Yardanico | https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/commit/94a9688556ca3b26a28d41319eaa14ae55b9d9d7 |
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| 12:25:20 | FromDiscord | <Yardanico> By the way, what's the tool used to generate closed issues list? I mean in blog posts about new Nim versions |
| 13:01:54 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> what's nnkLambda used for? |
| 13:02:12 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> internal stuff, i guess? |
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| 13:27:26 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> where can i find nim artwork (official logos)? |
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| 13:27:51 | FromDiscord | <dom96> nim-lang/assets on github |
| 13:28:05 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> ah |
| 13:28:39 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> @lqdev lambdas obviously :p |
| 13:29:04 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> @Clyybber well, but the AST for `proc () =` uses nnkProcDef and not nnkLambda |
| 13:29:15 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> `a do ():` uses nnkDo |
| 13:29:45 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> nnkLambda is used in the parser stage |
| 13:30:12 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> right. so macros basically don't get to see it? |
| 13:30:25 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> yep |
| 13:30:47 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> oh actually |
| 13:31:11 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> hmm, I'm not sure, as there is logic in the compiler that checks for its presence in later stages |
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| 14:10:24 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Araq: ping https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/pull/15091 :) |
| 14:10:25 | disbot | ➥ Fix forward declaration issues in template/macro context |
| 14:13:39 | Zevv | Clyybber: is that ours? |
| 14:14:59 | Araq | Clyybber: do you read this ID from anywhere? |
| 14:15:02 | Araq | don't see it |
| 14:15:10 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> yeah, in evaltempl |
| 14:15:20 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Zevv: Yes |
| 14:15:38 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Araq: https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/pull/15091/files#diff-3ce95e3c7c0e557b0078aa72313b6a7eL183 |
| 14:15:40 | disbot | ➥ Fix forward declaration issues in template/macro context |
| 14:15:58 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> And use it there https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/pull/15091/files#diff-3ce95e3c7c0e557b0078aa72313b6a7eL57 |
| 14:16:00 | disbot | ➥ Fix forward declaration issues in template/macro context |
| 14:16:20 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> And after the evaluation is done I increment it here: https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/pull/15091/files#diff-3ce95e3c7c0e557b0078aa72313b6a7eR209 |
| 14:16:22 | disbot | ➥ Fix forward declaration issues in template/macro context |
| 14:16:47 | Araq | I was looking for line 58 but ok |
| 14:16:51 | Araq | now I got it |
| 14:17:09 | Araq | looks clean enough and all tests are green, merging |
| 14:17:48 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> nice |
| 14:22:43 | Zevv | Clyybber \o/ Was it a though one? |
| 14:23:29 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> the searching and the early fixes yeah |
| 14:23:40 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> but then it mostly boiled down to two changes |
| 14:23:59 | Zevv | cool |
| 14:24:00 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> one is making the compiler detect when the definitions own symbol is shared with the forward decl |
| 14:24:24 | disruptek | hmm we should fix that. |
| 14:24:32 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> and the other is making the gensym hashes consistent for each template invocation |
| 14:25:27 | Zevv | right'o. Currently fixing something for work, but will check after dinner if I throw out my workaround |
| 14:26:08 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> disruptek: Do we depend on devel? |
| 14:26:30 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> As in, can I push the commit that removes the workaround |
| 14:26:37 | Zevv | I think we need 1.3.5 I saw somwehere |
| 14:26:55 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> 1.4 is going to be released soon TM so I think its fair to depend on devel |
| 14:27:00 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> for now |
| 14:27:06 | Zevv | cool. |
| 14:27:21 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> oh this was just my opinion, disruptek has to decide |
| 14:28:28 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> oh wait, 1.3 is devel |
| 14:28:32 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> so yeah, lets go I guess |
| 14:31:45 | FromDiscord | <7815> sent a code paste, see https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2sBJ |
| 14:31:52 | FromDiscord | <7815> what do you guys think of this? |
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| 14:44:04 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Zevv: Can you retest #3 ? I adapted your testcase to {.cps: Cont.} , but get undeclared identifier errors |
| 14:46:14 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> @7815 dunno, seems to be very old. I think they *do* cause a lot of maintenance effort, as can be seen by the crazy amount of work that goes into maintaining a linux distro, but OTOH its O(n) vs O(1) |
| 14:46:29 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> in terms of consumption of hard drive space |
| 14:47:05 | FromDiscord | <7815> @Clyybber why do i get ridiculed when i try to statically compile anything in nim q-q |
| 14:47:24 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> who ridicules you? |
| 14:47:51 | FromDiscord | <Rika> statically compiling is great tho?? |
| 14:47:52 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> (edit) 'who ridicules you?' => 'why would you get ridiculed for that?' |
| 14:47:54 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> yeah |
| 14:51:41 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> @7815 what problems are you encountering? |
| 14:52:36 | FromDiscord | <7815> i don't remember anymore |
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| 14:52:43 | FromDiscord | <7815> i tried nim about half a year ago |
| 14:53:21 | FromDiscord | <7815> i'll hang my footsies in again when the native compiler starts emerging @Clyybber |
| 14:53:47 | Araq | static linking for *everything* is foolish. |
| 14:53:49 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> wdym native compiler? |
| 14:54:35 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> @7815 wdym native compiler? |
| 14:54:43 | Araq | proof: you don't link the kernel statically into your program. |
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| 14:55:03 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Araq: Heh, you are gonna love includeOS |
| 14:55:18 | Araq | yeah actually I do. |
| 14:55:52 | Araq | but if you target an existing traditional OS dynamic linking is fine |
| 14:57:23 | Araq | clyybber: I think he means nlvm because "no C transpiler please" |
| 14:57:55 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> ah I see |
| 14:58:13 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> *rika triggered* |
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| 15:01:10 | FromDiscord | <Rika> araq makes a good point |
| 15:01:18 | FromDiscord | <Rika> ah fuck, forgot how pinging worked in irc |
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| 15:05:25 | FromDiscord | <7815> araq, i have no idea what you mean by linking the kernel statically into your program. |
| 15:05:50 | Araq | see includeOS |
| 15:13:18 | Araq | but I can expand my point a bit: say you want to use libiconv in your program. Now that's pretty basic functionality, some people think it's part of the operating system. So you do want to link dynamically against it because whether libiconv is really in your kernel space or not is an irrelevant implementation detail. you want to target a *platform*, not a pure kernel. the kernel should be as slim as possible for security reasons |
| 15:13:48 | Araq | but the platform should have "batteries included" |
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| 16:03:53 | federico3 | ...not to mention the plethora of other tools and components that are needed on the host and are not part of your application |
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| 16:22:00 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Araq: Does this patch make sense: |
| 16:22:13 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> sent a code paste, see https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2sCp |
| 16:23:03 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> sent a long message, see http://ix.io/2sCr |
| 16:23:16 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> sent a long message, see http://ix.io/2sCs |
| 16:25:23 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> the second example doesnt need `block:` only `block` |
| 16:28:59 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> @Recruit_main707 No. `block` always needs a colon |
| 16:30:42 | FromDiscord | <Recruit_main707> then whats wrong? |
| 16:31:10 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> The first example doesn't work. |
| 16:31:30 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> I have a patch that makes it work, but I don't know if its correct. |
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| 16:44:30 | nimmer | HI fellow Nim programmers, |
| 16:44:46 | nimmer | is there a simple way to check if a sequence in empty? |
| 16:45:19 | nimmer | e.g. aSeq.isEmpty instead of len(aSeq) == 0 |
| 16:45:47 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> simply define your own isEmpty proc or template |
| 16:46:18 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> checking the len is idiomatic |
| 16:47:34 | nimmer | ok, thank you for your response. I just wanted to make sure I'm doing it the idiomatic way by using Nims build in procs/operators |
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| 16:49:55 | Zevv | !last disruptek |
| 16:49:55 | disbot | disruptek never seen. |
| 16:50:01 | Zevv | ha |
| 16:51:31 | FromDiscord | <Idefau> lemme check |
| 16:51:48 | FromDiscord | <Idefau> sorry wrong chat |
| 16:51:54 | FromDiscord | <Rika> 👀 |
| 16:53:14 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> !last Araq |
| 16:53:14 | disbot | Araq spoke in 12#nim 99 minutes ago 12https://irclogs.nim-lang.org/29-07-2020.html#15:13:48 |
| 16:56:30 | FromDiscord | <Rika> disbot: "who's disruptek? ive never met that man in my life" |
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| 17:19:01 | rockcavera | Wouldn't it be correct to print int? https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2sCL |
| 17:20:21 | FromDiscord | <Rika> i think its related to `-` being a proc |
| 17:20:35 | FromGitter | <deech> How do ast-dump the result of an evaluation? eg. `let x = @[1,2,3]; dumpTree(x)`, will print the ast of `x` not `@[1,2,3]`. |
| 17:21:29 | FromDiscord | <Rika> .repr? |
| 17:21:38 | FromDiscord | <Rika> uh |
| 17:21:38 | FromDiscord | <Rika> wait |
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| 17:22:07 | Zevv | deech: wait :) |
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| 17:22:19 | Zevv | Nothing has been evaluated |
| 17:22:21 | Zevv | there is only AST |
| 17:24:41 | FromDiscord | <Rika> yeah, i dont really understand |
| 17:24:56 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> @deech https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2sCO |
| 17:29:19 | FromGitter | <deech> Ah hah, I was missing `getImpl`. :) |
| 17:30:00 | FromDiscord | <lqdev> keep in mind it only works on `typed` AST! |
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| 17:35:54 | Zevv | "I have no internet". Sound more like "I don't feel like listening to Zevvs talk all afternoon" |
| 17:36:10 | Zevv | I know you're reading this disruptek. I do know |
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| 17:45:29 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> disbot has internet so theres that |
| 17:45:30 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> :p |
| 17:46:29 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Zevv: What prevents the cps macro from operating on typed AST? |
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| 17:48:30 | Zevv | That was exactly my question: https://github.com/disruptek/cps/issues/27#issuecomment-665801486 |
| 17:48:31 | disbot | ➥ Getting rid of reallocs ; snippet at 12https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2svX |
| 17:48:48 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> hah |
| 17:48:57 | Zevv | I'm not sure. I think I tried to get started typed in the Very Beginning, but then had to do untyped things |
| 17:49:05 | Zevv | and you can't do both, you have to choose |
| 17:49:16 | Zevv | disruptek then picked off when I gave up |
| 17:49:23 | Zevv | so maybe he just took that part for granted |
| 17:49:33 | Zevv | but I can't recall why I didn't get it to run fully typed |
| 17:49:50 | Zevv | but going typed might solve a lot |
| 17:50:19 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> yeah |
| 17:51:41 | Araq | just write a compiler plugin |
| 17:52:05 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> oi Araq |
| 17:52:09 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> did you see my message? |
| 17:52:24 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> https://irclogs.nim-lang.org/29-07-2020.html#16:22:00 |
| 17:55:53 | shashlick | Araq: do you want an env var for --nimExe or just the command line is sufficient |
| 17:56:22 | leorize | shouldn't that switch be called `--nim` instead? to match testament |
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| 17:57:46 | shashlick | yep that's what i'm doing |
| 17:57:52 | shashlick | but just to use his lingo |
| 17:58:48 | Zevv | did araq just say "plugin"? |
| 17:58:58 | leorize | yes |
| 17:59:20 | leorize | the mysterious compiler plugin system that practically only araq knows how to use |
| 17:59:54 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> We don't need a compiler plugin for CPS |
| 18:00:00 | leorize | now only if we can write compiler plugins in user code and the compiler just pick it up at compile time :P |
| 18:00:21 | Zevv | "there are few ways of killing your productivity in programming. A plugin system is one of them |
| 18:00:21 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> I don't think it will make the task much easier |
| 18:00:24 | Zevv | someone once said |
| 18:00:58 | leorize | compiler plugins got a leg up in that it can access all the cool compiler internals |
| 18:01:20 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> yeah, but thats not needed here |
| 18:01:32 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> and cps as a macro is a good stress test of macros |
| 18:01:35 | Zevv | I feel that one day we really have to go that way, but as long as stuff can be proof-of-concepted in macros, I'm all for that |
| 18:01:39 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> already uncovered a few bugs |
| 18:01:44 | Zevv | \o/ |
| 18:02:13 | FromGitter | <iffy> To make sure an object meets a concept's requirements, I'm doing `assert newMyObject() is MyConcept` and it's failing, but I can't figure out why. Is there a way to make it tell me what's missing? `{.explain.}` on the type def doesn't seem to help. |
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| 18:10:45 | dadada | hey people |
| 18:10:55 | dadada | I wish for there to be a Nim implementation of this |
| 18:11:00 | dadada | https://github.com/asciidoctor/asciidoctor |
| 18:11:13 | dadada | it looks to me like it is more useful than markdown |
| 18:12:24 | dadada | unlike markdown it is fully standardized, endorsed by Linus Torvalds, and has more features, like footnotes, colors, fonts |
| 18:12:42 | dadada | so the features are a superset of markdown (with different syntax) |
| 18:13:15 | dadada | but that it is implemented in ruby is a problem, waiting to be solved |
| 18:13:44 | Prestige | Do it dadada |
| 18:13:49 | apotheon | quick question: Does Nim allow non-ASCII characters in identifiers? It doesn't look like it does, from what I've read so far. |
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| 18:13:58 | Zevv | apotheon: sure it does |
| 18:13:59 | FromDiscord | <KingDarBoja> Do it |
| 18:14:22 | FromDiscord | <Idefau> a friend even use braille alphabet for variables in nim lmao |
| 18:14:24 | Zevv | dadada: go for it! |
| 18:14:24 | apotheon | Zevv: . . . so _foobar→ is an allowed function name or variable name? |
| 18:14:28 | FromDiscord | <Idefau> (edit) 'use' => 'used' |
| 18:14:34 | apotheon | cool, thanks |
| 18:15:05 | FromDiscord | <KingDarBoja> _insert Palpatine voiceline_ |
| 18:15:06 | Zevv | apotheon: well, only the underscore is biting you here |
| 18:15:15 | Zevv | but the arrow thingy is finy |
| 18:15:20 | Zevv | you can go full APL with nim |
| 18:16:26 | dadada | Prestige, Zevv, KingDarBoja, yes, I should, but I have issues that prevent me from getting much done, so if someone else goes ahead, they'll probably be done sooner than me |
| 18:16:51 | Zevv | dadada: story of my life |
| 18:17:05 | Prestige | I don't think anyone else is working on it so you'll be first |
| 18:17:31 | Zevv | just start off with nimdoc |
| 18:17:52 | apotheon | Zevv: Oh, are underscores not allowed as leading identifier characters? I must've missed that. |
| 18:17:59 | * | oriba quit (Quit: https://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.) |
| 18:18:23 | Zevv | yeah, it's part of nims style-insensitivity |
| 18:18:28 | apotheon | I see: "begins with a letter". |
| 18:18:28 | Zevv | which you are free to hate, if you mush |
| 18:18:29 | Zevv | must |
| 18:18:35 | apotheon | I totally overlooked that, somehow. |
| 18:18:39 | dadada | I think asciidoc could be useful in so many different places of the Nim ecosystem, for docs, for website content, for rendering on the terminal, as intermediate language between other markdown and other output (markdown -> asciidoc -> terminal | markdown -> asciidoc -> HTML), for rich text applications, even for writing books its interesting... definitely more versatile than markdown |
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| 18:19:07 | Zevv | apotheon: although that's not right either |
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| 18:19:27 | FromGitter | <bung87> what's asciidoc ? |
| 18:19:41 | Zevv | https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2sCY |
| 18:19:52 | apotheon | I do rather dislike the style-insensitivity, and have since it was just a suggestion that came up in this channel years ago, but I know someone who's looking for a language that does specific things and I thought that person might like Nim more than Raku, so . . . I figured I'd double-check that one allowable-characters feature before telling him this could be the language for him. |
| 18:20:13 | Zevv | right, fair enough |
| 18:20:38 | dadada | bung87: https://asciidoctor.org/ |
| 18:20:41 | apotheon | I also disliked the offside rule introduction to the language back then. |
| 18:20:48 | Zevv | It's a funny thing, and it keeps popping up. The interesting part is that I always hear people hate it, unless they really use nim |
| 18:20:58 | Zevv | And then they just stop caring about it and see the benefits |
| 18:21:02 | Zevv | it's just very alien I guess |
| 18:21:05 | apotheon | It's a pretty cool language in a variety of ways, though, so I'm happy to recommend it to someone who's looking for something it fits. |
| 18:21:34 | dadada | I also like the style insensitivity, it doesn't mean that you can't have a consistent style |
| 18:21:43 | Zevv | right. it's always ok to mention it to someone, and everyone should find out in the end if it is something the like or not |
| 18:22:30 | apotheon | I have technical reasons for disliking the offside rule for most languages. I could like it, but I haven't seen a language whose other grammatical characteristics don't introduce problems in combination with it -- except maybe Haskell, but I don't know the language well enough to be sure. |
| 18:22:48 | FromGitter | <bung87> hmm weird project name, asciiXXX |
| 18:23:20 | dadada | https://asciidoctor.org/docs/asciidoc-vs-markdown/ |
| 18:23:52 | Zevv | apotheon: I kind of hate it myself, for practical reasons. But then again, it is pretty compact which has its pros |
| 18:23:55 | apotheon | The problem I have with the style insensitivity is the need for special tooling or additionally habitual practices to ensure that reading and modifying others' code isn't going to be fraught with additional error. |
| 18:24:19 | Zevv | I have problems when editing my own code when falling down multiple indents. It's often hard to see where you end up |
| 18:24:27 | dadada | bung87: hopefully you can get past the name, it seems really cool to me |
| 18:24:29 | apotheon | If I didn't prefer to use as-close-to-the-exact-same-tooling-as-possible across a range of very different languages, it probably wouldn't bother me as much. |
| 18:24:40 | apotheon | different strokes for different folks |
| 18:24:40 | Zevv | but hey, I made a nim branch that fixed the parser and introduces curlies, so you can use that |
| 18:25:27 | apotheon | I actually liked the name Nimrod, too. Nim seems harder to search. |
| 18:25:35 | apotheon | I should stop complaining. Sorry. |
| 18:25:38 | FromDiscord | <Rika> i wouldnt mind braces if i never had to type them |
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| 18:26:00 | apotheon | Rika: That's fair. Typing them doesn't bother me. |
| 18:26:21 | FromDiscord | <Rika> then moving a piece of code into a block |
| 18:26:27 | FromDiscord | <Rika> copy paste reindent |
| 18:26:37 | FromDiscord | <Rika> indentation based is just reindent |
| 18:26:41 | apotheon | Anyway, thanks for the info about variable names. I'll get back out of your communications. |
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| 18:28:05 | Zevv | well, all we do is complain anyway |
| 18:28:11 | Zevv | basically why i'm here |
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| 18:38:01 | FromDiscord | <pan> trying to get a quick imgui test running with nimgl, to do that i need to compile using cpp backend, but when i do that it throws an error while running the program saying it cant find `libgcc_s_seh-1.dll` and `libstdc++-6.dll`, is there a way to just link these statically and fix the problem? |
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| 18:40:18 | FromDiscord | <Rika> you can use c w/ imgui, you need `cimgui.dll` though |
| 18:42:02 | FromDiscord | <pan> i plan on using the cpp backend for some other stuff too at some point, so id probably like to just fix this first, just unsure what to do exactly |
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| 18:44:17 | FromDiscord | <Rika> ah okay |
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| 18:45:42 | FromDiscord | <pan> oh, seems i just need to do --passL:"-static", though im unsure if that would cause unwanted side effects |
| 18:46:00 | FromDiscord | <Rika> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/6404636/libstdc-6-dll-not-found so `-l "-static-libgcc" -l "-static-libstdc++"` i think? |
| 18:47:07 | FromDiscord | <pan> is there a way i could just add that to my .nimble file so i dont need to add it onto every build command? |
| 18:47:56 | FromDiscord | <Rika> you make a config.nims i think and add it there |
| 18:48:02 | FromDiscord | <Rika> or was it nim.cfg? |
| 18:48:08 | FromDiscord | <Rika> i dont know honestly |
| 18:48:10 | FromDiscord | <Rika> forgot already |
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| 18:50:43 | FromDiscord | <pan> using `nim.cfg` seems to work, thanks |
| 18:52:34 | zacts | hello nim |
| 18:52:35 | zacts | #nim |
| 18:53:11 | Zevv | hello zacts |
| 18:53:24 | zacts | I'm interested in learning more about nim and what it might offer for my goals of a daily scripting language. |
| 18:53:46 | Zevv | that depends on what requirements you have for a daily scripting language I guess |
| 18:53:54 | Zevv | what do you use now? |
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| 18:54:47 | zacts | well, I like Perl. I've been looking at Raku as well for this. |
| 18:54:58 | Zevv | and what is your problem with perl |
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| 18:56:33 | zacts | well, I have a few fuzzy ideas that I want to tinker with. One is naming things and redefining syntax with UTF-8 characters. The other is to be able to modify the syntax of the language and kind of customize it for my wants and needs. |
| 18:56:42 | zacts | I also like the idea of interop with C and JavaScript. |
| 18:57:12 | zacts | this would be for scripting tasks on my computer. |
| 18:57:21 | Zevv | well, you will not be able to modify the *syntax*, but within the syntax you can do basically everything you can think of |
| 18:57:25 | zacts | I'm also curious as to how many libraries Nim has. |
| 18:57:41 | zacts | like in comparison to CPAN or Ruby gems. |
| 18:57:51 | Zevv | oh compared to CPAN or Ruby, there's about next to nothing |
| 18:57:57 | zacts | ah ok |
| 18:58:00 | Zevv | because cmon, CPAN is humongous |
| 18:58:04 | zacts | well, yeah. |
| 18:58:07 | zacts | :-) |
| 18:58:15 | Zevv | we have "nimble", which currently has 1366 packages |
| 18:58:20 | FromDiscord | <Rika> we barely have over a thousand |
| 18:58:35 | Araq | you can use completely custom syntax within triple string literals |
| 18:58:46 | Araq | but it's usually not necessary nor convenient for others |
| 18:58:52 | Zevv | yeah you can do that in any language :) |
| 18:59:08 | Araq | well you cannot parse the string at compiletime in other languages... |
| 18:59:13 | zacts | can I easily add a new operator to the language? |
| 18:59:21 | Zevv | trivial |
| 18:59:25 | zacts | cool |
| 19:00:00 | Zevv | also, keep in mind that nim is not a scripting language |
| 19:00:17 | Zevv | it is not duck typed. Often it *feels* like a scripting language, low friction, high density |
| 19:00:20 | Zevv | but it is not |
| 19:00:30 | Zevv | it does compile time execution and we have a subset of nim called nimscript |
| 19:00:35 | Zevv | but that's not the power of nim |
| 19:00:38 | zacts | oh I see |
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| 19:01:05 | Zevv | aw, this is always hard to explain. |
| 19:01:29 | Zevv | It is both a script language and a compiled language. Your program can do both, so part of it can run at compile time, part of it gets compiled and runs at run time |
| 19:01:43 | zacts | ok |
| 19:01:54 | dadada | has anyone ported ruby code to nim? experience? |
| 19:01:57 | Zevv | the compile time part can be used to pre-calculate stuff, slurp binary objects into variables, or - and that's the power - modifiy the programs AST itself |
| 19:03:35 | FromGitter | <alehander92> yes |
| 19:04:08 | FromGitter | <alehander92> dadada https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hlWCp210IIY |
| 19:04:17 | FromGitter | <alehander92> it's .. not a good example because it's about automatic stuff |
| 19:04:32 | FromGitter | <alehander92> but .. i guess one can say a bit |
| 19:05:17 | dadada | alehander92: how many minutes can I skip there? |
| 19:05:25 | FromGitter | <alehander92> overally as most things, just try to make your nim code nim-ic and adapt the ruby thing |
| 19:05:54 | Zevv | clyybber ping |
| 19:06:18 | FromGitter | <alehander92> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hlWCp210IIY |
| 19:06:22 | FromGitter | <alehander92> sorry |
| 19:06:23 | FromGitter | <alehander92> https://metacraft-labs.github.io/fast-rubocop/ruby-kaigi-2019/#/ |
| 19:06:33 | FromGitter | <alehander92> here are some slides just look at them if there is something |
| 19:07:47 | FromGitter | <alehander92> but just try to rewrite the more meta parts / see which libs are good matches for the ruby ones you used before and if there is code thats more obviously similar port it ltierally |
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| 19:14:14 | dadada | https://github.com/opal/opal <- I'd like to see a version of opal that translates to Nim instead of JS ... for this we would require an implementation of the stdlib and corelib of Ruby in Nim... reason why I want this, so I don't have to write the asciidoc implementation in Nim... :D |
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| 19:16:24 | alehander92 | hehe |
| 19:16:28 | alehander92 | it would be more fun to wrtie |
| 19:16:34 | alehander92 | your own asciidoc i think |
| 19:16:50 | alehander92 | i mean, on the other hand that's why we wanted to write languist |
| 19:17:04 | alehander92 | it is fun , but it depends on people writing replacments of libs |
| 19:17:16 | dadada | definitely easier, I agree... but think about all the libraries becoming available to nim developers, or think about all the libraries that aren't, at the moment |
| 19:17:18 | opal | there's my reminder that i share my name with some javascript project |
| 19:17:43 | alehander92 | much better to invest in some normal nim libs i think |
| 19:17:48 | alehander92 | opal haha |
| 19:17:51 | alehander92 | ruby / javascript |
| 19:19:24 | FromGitter | <bung87> I think which ruby libs have other language also have, compare to ruby , python's lib more easy |
| 19:20:36 | dadada | alehander92: it's not a small task to port asciidoc to nim, ... also it's a bit concerning that more and more libs are getting written in python/ruby/js, by which I mean non-compiled languages, and more specifically non-C-compatible languages, which means that writing wrappers isn't enough to satisfy the gap for a Nim project.... this is very bad for us as Nim developers. And those ruby/python/js projects |
| 19:20:42 | dadada | aren't always short 1000 line projects, asciidoc seems to have multiple thousand lines, and no I won't be able to quickly transform that ... :-( |
| 19:22:28 | FromGitter | <bung87> python cpp are good targets for porting things |
| 19:22:54 | dadada | bung87: for cpp you can also write a wrapper, so I would do that rather than porting |
| 19:23:24 | FromGitter | <bung87> that need you compile your full project to cpp right ? |
| 19:23:44 | dadada | bung_: not sure, even if, what's the problem with that? |
| 19:24:30 | FromGitter | <bung87> you may have dependecies that is c wrapper , or cpp wrapper , how does they work together? |
| 19:24:49 | dadada | bung87: should be without any issues |
| 19:25:13 | FromGitter | <alehander92> dadada well .. one can't have everything |
| 19:25:23 | FromGitter | <alehander92> rust / go / swift etc |
| 19:25:34 | FromGitter | <alehander92> also have the same problem, we just have to build an ecosystem |
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| 19:25:57 | FromGitter | <bung87> for 1k lines project , it's not hard to porting it manually I think |
| 19:27:14 | dadada | alehander92: that's why I think the collective Nim project should prioritize some libraries to port to Nim, for example find out what the top 20 libraries are that developers are missing from Nim now and that DON'T have wrappers or the possibility of wrappers (for example because they are ruby or go libs) |
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| 19:27:42 | dadada | and then make a competition with bounties from that list |
| 19:27:46 | disruptek | !last zevv |
| 19:27:47 | disbot | Zevv spoke in 12#nim 21 minutes ago 12https://irclogs.nim-lang.org/29-07-2020.html#19:05:54 |
| 19:28:15 | dadada | like 500$ per ported library, or another amount that the project can afford |
| 19:28:34 | dadada | Nim's overall worth would increase a lot with all those ports coming in |
| 19:28:38 | FromGitter | <alehander92> maybe |
| 19:28:46 | FromGitter | <alehander92> but i wouldn't want direct ports.. |
| 19:28:54 | FromGitter | <bung87> we just need more nimer, like how js ecosystem grows |
| 19:28:55 | FromGitter | <alehander92> for many, it's good to have a proper nim interface |
| 19:29:03 | FromGitter | <alehander92> not just copying foreign apis |
| 19:29:22 | FromGitter | <alehander92> but just making "a stuff lib" with capabilities of other |
| 19:29:24 | FromGitter | <alehander92> is good yeah |
| 19:29:34 | dadada | bung87: there's no even playing field with js ecosystem, js was part of the web ecosystem for decades, and this is maybe the biggest ecosystem now because the web is huge |
| 19:29:49 | FromGitter | <bung87> you search github with language:nim only show 476 users |
| 19:29:51 | FromGitter | <alehander92> but js is different |
| 19:29:59 | FromGitter | <alehander92> we dont need so much many of the visual libs etc |
| 19:30:04 | dadada | bung87: Nim has no advantage like that, so we can't just "hope" for more nimmers to magically appear and start writing libraries |
| 19:30:39 | FromGitter | <bung87> yeah we cant just hope that |
| 19:31:02 | FromGitter | <bung87> maybe some killer project will leading people here |
| 19:31:04 | FromGitter | <alehander92> i think libs help |
| 19:31:09 | FromGitter | <alehander92> like vim3d and nitter |
| 19:31:14 | dadada | the competition idea is sure to work, even if it fails, and we don't get the 20 ports, we'd at least get a fraction of it, and that's still better than 0 |
| 19:31:15 | FromGitter | <alehander92> are good posts to platforms |
| 19:31:19 | FromGitter | <alehander92> which make people think |
| 19:31:25 | FromGitter | <alehander92> ok i can write my project in nim |
| 19:32:16 | FromGitter | <bung87> or some project like vscode that's mostly about ts |
| 19:33:02 | FromGitter | <bung87> they get free good ide and try write extension, try ts |
| 19:33:31 | FromGitter | <alehander92> yeah |
| 19:33:35 | FromGitter | <alehander92> extensions are good too |
| 19:35:15 | dadada | or can one advanced elite Nim developer maybe make a YouTube series where he/or/she/or/it/or/they ports say asciidoc to Nim? |
| 19:35:37 | dadada | then less advanced nimmers can learn from that step by step commentary and port more libraries? |
| 19:36:28 | FromGitter | <bung87> on the other hand , should improve libs make existed nim users feel good |
| 19:37:14 | dadada | bung87: what do you mean? |
| 19:39:43 | dadada | since I found out about Nim it is clear to me that the biggest drawback to it is the small ecosystem, and nothing has changed there |
| 19:41:28 | dadada | without any concerted effort by the project leaders to port the most sought after libraries from other languages, that are missing in Nim, there'll always be people who think Nim is cool, but then will use Ruby/Python/Go for their projects, because they'll not want to go through the trouble of porting libraries as Nim newbies, understandably |
| 19:42:45 | dadada | so if the libraries with the most widespread use get ported to Nim, (and to alehander's point: yes this can be with adapted Nim-like APIs), this changes the whole dynamic |
| 19:43:14 | dadada | and all of a sudden Nim isn't a cool toy anymore, people talk about but then never use, and it becomes something that gets actually adopted |
| 19:43:47 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Araq: ping |
| 19:44:03 | FromGitter | <bung87> that happens |
| 19:44:50 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> @mratsim Hey, maybe https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/pull/15116 fixes that issue you showed me yesterday |
| 19:44:50 | disbot | ➥ fix overloading case with generic alias |
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| 19:48:43 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Zevv: ping |
| 19:54:56 | Zevv | yeah I already wrote at the issue; I kind of hoped that your fix also had to do with the funny gensym, but that's not solved yet |
| 19:55:22 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> can you give me a snippet I can compile |
| 19:55:34 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> because I get undeclared identifier issues with the old one |
| 19:55:36 | Zevv | yeah bit it goes through cps |
| 19:55:42 | Zevv | but |
| 19:56:03 | Zevv | and disruptek broke my test, so you have to send this snippet to an earlier cps version |
| 19:56:06 | Zevv | it's a bit of a pita |
| 19:56:11 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> ah |
| 19:56:14 | Zevv | take cps 0.0.11 |
| 19:56:20 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> k |
| 19:56:21 | Zevv | and I'll prepare you a snippet |
| 19:57:03 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> is it a "environment misses X" bug? |
| 19:57:28 | Zevv | right |
| 19:58:06 | Zevv | but it's not missing |
| 19:58:19 | Zevv | it seems that nim is messing up the different environments among each other |
| 19:58:30 | Zevv | altohough they are uniquely gensymmed |
| 19:58:52 | Zevv | I made that workaround by appending a global incrementing counter to the gensym labels |
| 19:58:57 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> huh |
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| 20:02:22 | FromDiscord | <Kiloneie> How do you tell VS Code to use other Nim version ? Been using 1.0.0 till now and i need 1.2.X for Nico, i can't find the settings to change the compiler location. |
| 20:02:42 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> dunno sorry |
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| 20:05:11 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Zevv: Huh, original snippet compiles and runs for me with cps 0.0.11 |
| 20:05:22 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> the one on ix.io that is |
| 20:08:19 | Zevv | yeah but 0.0.11 has the workaround |
| 20:08:43 | Zevv | 37f0063262cdc173f13a6b4871e410343a4dc775 |
| 20:09:41 | Zevv | lemme see if I can hack this up for you |
| 20:09:56 | FromDiscord | <Kiloneie> This is odd, i removed the old Nim version, then ran finish in the new one, it installed the compiler for mingw, added env variable, and path, then when i run my program with it it still referes to 1.0.0 folder... the hell... |
| 20:10:36 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Zevv: Hmm, I reverted that commit, can repro the invalid C code |
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| 20:18:57 | Zevv | ok got it |
| 20:19:00 | Zevv | take this |
| 20:19:01 | Zevv | http://ix.io/2sDd |
| 20:19:29 | Zevv | and compile it with 0.0.11 with 1 little change |
| 20:19:43 | Zevv | remove the "& c" at line 341 of cps/environment.nim |
| 20:19:46 | Zevv | that's the workaround |
| 20:19:54 | Zevv | I can also make you a branch if you like |
| 20:19:54 | * | andrew[43] quit (Quit: https://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.) |
| 20:19:59 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> thats what I did |
| 20:20:05 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> I get Cgen errors |
| 20:20:07 | Zevv | if you disable either of those blocks form the ix, it compiles |
| 20:20:08 | Zevv | right |
| 20:20:09 | Zevv | cgen errors |
| 20:20:44 | Zevv | if you look at the -d:cpsDEbug output, there are two environments defined |
| 20:20:48 | Zevv | one for the first part, one for the second |
| 20:20:52 | Zevv | they have unique id's |
| 20:20:57 | Zevv | one has a member 'a', the other a member 'b' |
| 20:21:19 | Zevv | but somehow the bottom part still uses the upper env with 'a', and can't find 'b' in it |
| 20:21:32 | Zevv | there is no C struct generated for the second env |
| 20:21:45 | Zevv | does that make sense? |
| 20:22:39 | Zevv | I get only one struct envcolongObject in the C code |
| 20:22:46 | Zevv | with NI a; |
| 20:22:59 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> huh, wtf |
| 20:23:02 | Zevv | right |
| 20:23:09 | Zevv | that was the whole point of issue #3 :) |
| 20:23:16 | Zevv | I probably didn't explain it that well |
| 20:23:21 | Zevv | can you repro? |
| 20:23:26 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> yep |
| 20:23:30 | Zevv | noice |
| 20:24:26 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> hmm, this is weird indeed |
| 20:24:33 | Zevv | it is |
| 20:25:43 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> oh, maybe not so weird |
| 20:25:51 | Zevv | tell me |
| 20:25:56 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> i'm gonna try a naive fix |
| 20:26:19 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> opcGenSym just says getIdent |
| 20:26:40 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> and somehow expects the generated ident to be unique |
| 20:26:50 | Zevv | uh |
| 20:26:56 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> but I guess thats intended |
| 20:28:48 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> but I don't think that holds necessarily true |
| 20:37:24 | Zevv | clearly not :) |
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| 20:39:01 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> looks like we already rely on it somewhere |
| 20:39:20 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> adding a stupid add $rand(0..int.high) doesn't solve it |
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| 20:41:07 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Well, it does, but now its failing in sequtils :D |
| 20:41:22 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> I'm not sure what is the intended behaviour here |
| 20:43:04 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> IMO genSym should give you a unique symbol, that acts like a symbol marked with {.gensym.} so it shouldn't be accessible outside of the template/macros scope |
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| 20:45:05 | Zevv | makes sense |
| 20:45:14 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> thats not the current behaviour :D |
| 20:45:35 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> which is very weird |
| 20:47:45 | Zevv | but kind of interesting how this stayed hidden so long |
| 20:47:49 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> yeah |
| 20:47:51 | Zevv | it feels like a pretty common thing to do |
| 20:48:02 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> I mean, it seems to work in some cases |
| 20:48:25 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> this for example works |
| 20:48:25 | Zevv | I actually just suspected CPSs AST to be borked |
| 20:48:26 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> sent a code paste, see https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2sDn |
| 20:48:36 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> that could be it too |
| 20:48:54 | Zevv | the repr of it compiles fine of course |
| 20:49:04 | Zevv | so maybe we should just repr and eval it :) |
| 20:49:05 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> yeah |
| 20:49:20 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> maybe print out the symbols of the env |
| 20:49:29 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> those *shouldn't* be the same |
| 20:49:35 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> since they even have different idents |
| 20:49:43 | Zevv | they arent in the repr anyway |
| 20:50:01 | Zevv | what makes a mangle? |
| 20:50:06 | Zevv | could it be happening there? |
| 20:50:09 | Zevv | something clashing? |
| 20:50:17 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> yeah |
| 20:50:19 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> ah damn |
| 20:50:23 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> you hit the nail on the head |
| 20:50:57 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> someone probably removed the logic that attaches the sym id to the C typedef |
| 20:51:04 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> if that logic ever existed |
| 20:51:23 | Zevv | what's a minimal reproduction for this, without going to cps |
| 20:51:26 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> since it got kinda redundant with the new gensym handling that simply appended `gensymXXX to the ident |
| 20:51:38 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Zevv: Probably generating two types with genSym |
| 20:51:47 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> with different fields |
| 20:52:15 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> and then creating an instance of the first type |
| 20:52:22 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> and trying to access the field |
| 20:52:52 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> .s/first/second |
| 20:54:11 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> and if genSym is fixed it should still be possible to do with manual symNode creation |
| 20:54:26 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> assuming we were right with our analysis |
| 20:54:31 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> I'll get something to eat |
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| 21:02:15 | Zevv | can't get it to reproduce with a plain macro |
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| 21:04:10 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> maybe it needs to be two type sections |
| 21:04:20 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> with a use of the first type in between |
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| 21:05:37 | Zevv | http://ix.io/2sDs |
| 21:06:40 | Zevv | that is just fine |
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| 21:12:32 | Zevv | think I have it clyybber |
| 21:12:35 | Zevv | it needs to be a ref obj |
| 21:12:57 | Zevv | this is my repro |
| 21:12:58 | Zevv | http://ix.io/2sDu |
| 21:15:18 | Zevv | I have no to clue what to put in the subject for the issue |
| 21:16:16 | Zevv | "genSym fails to make unique identifier for ref object types"? |
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| 21:17:38 | disruptek | put something in there about bad ast. araq loves that shit. |
| 21:17:47 | Zevv | will do |
| 21:18:01 | Zevv | let be honest dude. You are messing about seriously with nimnodes there |
| 21:18:21 | Zevv | not sure how your brain works, but I can't do that shit |
| 21:18:25 | Zevv | I just quote do my way around |
| 21:18:36 | Zevv | but fair enough |
| 21:18:44 | Zevv | you were wrong and I was right |
| 21:18:45 | Zevv | ooh no |
| 21:18:48 | Zevv | the other way around |
| 21:18:52 | Zevv | I was right and you were wrong |
| 21:18:54 | Zevv | daang no |
| 21:19:01 | Zevv | You were right and I was wrong |
| 21:19:05 | Zevv | (that hurt) |
| 21:19:13 | disruptek | what happened? |
| 21:19:30 | Zevv | well, your AST is probably fine, I reproduced it with a small snippet, see above the last ix |
| 21:20:13 | disruptek | i don't trust `quote do`. |
| 21:20:27 | Zevv | I recently threw all the 'do's' out |
| 21:20:29 | Zevv | and it still works |
| 21:20:31 | Zevv | I was lied to |
| 21:20:50 | Zevv | anyway, http://ix.io/2sDu shows the problem, but I can't file a nim issue for it |
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| 21:26:41 | Zevv | so disruptek, before I get my nap |
| 21:26:51 | Zevv | why again are we doing all of this untyped in the first place? |
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| 21:31:42 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> Why cant you file an issue for it? |
| 21:32:45 | Zevv | no clue what to put in the subject. total blocker of course |
| 21:33:13 | FromDiscord | <Clyybber> lol |
| 21:35:06 | Zevv | https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/issues/15118 |
| 21:35:08 | disbot | ➥ Cgen error: genSym fails to make unique identifier for ref object types ; snippet at 12https://play.nim-lang.org/#ix=2sDB |
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