<< 16-02-2024 >>
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00:17:15NimEventerNew thread by guzba: Default object values behavior, see https://forum.nim-lang.org/t/11013
00:19:11FromDiscord<makoren> downloading the zip file for x64 windows binaries seems suspicious, windows defender says its a trojan
00:19:49FromDiscord<makoren> also cant run certutil on it without it breaking and saying it's found a virus
00:20:50FromDiscord<guzba8> huge efforts have gone into trying to get that not to happen for some time now, however in the end windows defender seems to be unwilling to not do these things to nim
00:21:14FromDiscord<guzba8> sadly there is no "im not malware" flag to add to the download
00:38:31FromDiscord<soup> sent a code paste, see https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=CqgQIUtnHYPX
00:40:32FromDiscord<soup> when i try to print to terminal second object always undefined but it is defined in javscript
00:41:29FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Did you just disregard what I said?
00:41:38FromDiscord<soup> it did not work
00:43:23FromDiscord<soup> Error\: undeclared identifier\: 'Type
00:43:55FromDiscord<soup> if i put `ref object` i get Error\: undeclared field\: 'relatesTo'
01:03:32FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @leorize "the logic should be": Yeah, makes sense to me!
01:05:46FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> soup the `Type` in my example was for you to replace with the actual type
01:06:21FromDiscord<soup> i tried replacing with ref object but it not work
01:10:29FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> I guess you cannot wrap the `m.relateTo` without a getter/setter
01:10:30FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> It's a dumb field name anyway
01:10:46FromDiscord<soup> that is how the library does it
01:13:23FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> You can do `type MyType = distinct JsObject` from JsFFI to wrap this
01:13:45FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> But Nim does field access properly so it's `a.b` not `a[b]`
01:18:07FromDiscord<soup> thank you i try now
01:28:42FromDiscord<soup> i try `type Content = distinct JsObject`but this `var a = event.content.`"m.relates\_to"\`\` give error undeclared field
01:29:00FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Right you'll want to use properties if you want it statically typed
01:29:11FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> If you don't care about static typing just use `JsObject`
01:29:23FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> https://nim-lang.org/docs/manual.html#procedures-properties
01:35:49FromDiscord<soup> i give up now
01:35:51FromDiscord<soup> thank you
01:35:53FromDiscord<soup> i try later
01:37:28FromDiscord<soup> 再见 朋友
01:50:51FromDiscord<girvo> the nim-lang.org VSCode extension + nimlangserver is so much nicer. I'm impressed
02:03:25FromDiscord<sirius_3x> is there a specific pragma to tell the compiler to unwrap/unroll a loop?
02:03:35FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Nope
02:03:50FromDiscord<sirius_3x> probably have to use templates for something like that?
02:04:03FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Macros, but yea
02:04:14FromDiscord<sirius_3x> In reply to @Elegantbeef "Macros, but yea": oh right, yea. ok thanks
02:04:17FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> https://stackoverflow.com/a/74077789/15200657
02:08:48FromDiscord<girvo> sent a code paste, see https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=luJBvafIxMPA
02:10:08FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> False errors are quite common
02:24:23FromDiscord<girvo> Oh goody
02:24:46FromDiscord<girvo> Is there a `# nimsuggest ignore-errors` comment hint thing?
02:24:54FromDiscord<girvo> (I couldn't find one, I did look)
02:25:08FromDiscord<odexine> False errors can pop up and disappear on any part of code
02:25:19FromDiscord<girvo> cool lol
02:25:32FromDiscord<girvo> Are they from nimsuggest or from nimlangserver?
02:25:38FromDiscord<girvo> The error suggest (lel) the former
02:25:40FromDiscord<odexine> Suggest
02:25:42FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Closest you get is `when not defined(nimsuggest)`
02:26:27FromDiscord<girvo> We didn't have these false errors previously, I'm guessing because we were running an older version or something? nimsuggest would mostly just shit the bed and die lol
02:38:41FromDiscord<girvo> sent a code paste, see https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=keuQnYzPwOYK
02:54:14FromDiscord<zumi.dxy> lmao
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03:52:48FromDiscord<user2m> sent a code paste, see https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=ICfLPImwSHAX
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03:57:45FromDiscord<user2m> sent a code paste, see https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=TabgYarXVESb
04:02:03FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> The answer is you cannot
04:03:04FromDiscord<user2m> In reply to @Elegantbeef "The answer is you": hmm bit of an odd qurik then
04:35:31FromDiscord<janakali> sent a code paste, see https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=OogbBrCmwvMf
04:35:46FromDiscord<janakali> (edit) "https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=AihWMArCUCav" => "https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=uNHnVxrMnpcn"
04:36:17FromDiscord<janakali> (edit) "https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=cmIIXaAjrlsa" => "https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=uBXgeUWHRhYW"
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04:38:50FromDiscord<user2m> sent a code paste, see https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=JsITFEbQiESt
04:51:15FromDiscord<janakali> In reply to @user2m "lol a surprisingly ugly": If you're not allergic to macros you can use this instead: https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/issues/21327#issuecomment-1416489029
04:55:27FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> A weapon for a more civilized time
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05:03:52FromDiscord<jviega> Eh, Nim has plenty of ugly edges that are pretty well hidden by the pythonesque facade 🙂
05:04:56FromDiscord<user2m> sent a code paste, see https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=vUZdWTZqqBpQ
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05:34:01FromDiscord<user2m> sent a code paste, see https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=RAbIMVeAhJsw
05:44:14FromDiscord<aryzen> Hello! I just discovered Nim a couple days ago and now I'm trying it out! I hope to get to know everyone and see if the language is a good fit for me!
06:16:59FromDiscord<ayex> welcome [aryzen](https://matrix.to/#/%40_discord_298392862305812480%3At2bot.io) , enjoy! 🙂
06:38:26NimEventerNew thread by undefined: Resources for Web Authentication, see https://forum.nim-lang.org/t/11015
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07:09:25FromDiscord<Phil> In reply to @aryzen "Hello! I just discovered": cheers!
07:10:50FromDiscord<penguinite> In reply to @aryzen "Hello! I just discovered": Good luck, and remember that you can always ask for help here if you need to.
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07:30:51FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Nim can output JSON for docs, right?
07:31:49FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Found it!
07:46:07PMunchIt's not perfect, but it is pretty good
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08:01:17FromDiscord<aryzen> Thank you for the welcome! I’ll turn up tomorrow to ask some questions while I work on something simple to get acquainted
08:01:39FromDiscord<aryzen> (A question, how do discord users appear to IRC users?)
08:03:33FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> https://irclogs.nim-lang.org/
08:08:50PMunch(Unless you have a script running in your IRC client which does something else)
08:09:11PMunchI have one which strips nicknames from the FromDiscord part for example
08:09:17PMunchSo you appear like normal users
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08:10:54FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> I find it hard to believe I appear normal
08:22:34Amun-Rabut from what I know we see here different names that they are displayed on discord, right?
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08:55:53PMunchAh yes, I think we see the actual nick and not the display name
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08:55:56PMunchOr something like that
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09:09:07FromDiscord<nnsee> yeah, username vs display name
09:09:16FromDiscord<nnsee> they're usually different
09:10:04PMunchLuckily pinging still works, but that might be a bridge thing @nnsee
09:10:41PMunchSorry for highlighting you, just wanted to show that it worked
09:11:14FromDiscord<nnsee> yeah, I think the bridge corrects the mentions to point to the actual user
09:11:42FromDiscord<nnsee> generally just doing @whateverusername, if you're sending a raw message, won't trigger the mention and is just printed as text
09:11:50FromDiscord<nnsee> so the bridge must be doing _something_
09:13:26PMunchAh right, makes sense
09:13:43Amun-Ranice
09:13:47PMunchOn IRC you're highlighted as long as your name appears, even in a link like a GitHub link
09:14:26Amun-Rathat depends on the client
09:14:30PMunchAnd nicks auto-complete with tab in my HexChat client. So I've set up my Discord-nick-fixer script to add a @ before all usernames
09:14:40PMunchOf course, everything in IRC depends on the client
09:14:43Amun-Ra;)
09:15:06Amun-Rahttps://local.host/PMunch/text.txt
09:15:17Amun-RaPMunch: did that triggered?
09:15:23PMunchYup
09:15:26Amun-Rahmm
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09:19:58FromDiscord<nnsee> yeah I used to spend most of my day on IRC
09:20:23FromDiscord<nnsee> these days, especially on mobile, discord and whatever chats are just more comfortable to use unfortunately
09:20:42Amun-Raif only I could connect to discord from cli
09:21:00FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> There is probably a third party cli client
09:21:08Amun-Rathere were 3rd party discord clients but the discord said nah-ah
09:21:41FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Insert inane ramblings about matrix here
09:21:46Amun-Ra;)
09:22:00PMunchMy Element/Matrix is so slow though..
09:22:07PMunchI think it might be my home server..
09:22:25FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> There is that whole sliding sync that'll be rolling out
09:22:59Amun-Ramy aruba vps is lagging since a few months, they really want me to migrate from that cheap plan… ;)
09:23:33Amun-Ra…to a point it often eats letters I type
09:24:57FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @Amun-Ra "there were 3rd party": Iirc Discordo is one that still works
09:25:41FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> https://github.com/ayn2op/discordo @Amun-Ra
09:26:09FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Bleh no point using any of these third party clients if discord can just say "No"
09:27:09Amun-RaRobyn: yes, but it's agains tos and they may activate that ban hammer that's hanging above your head ;)
09:27:27FromDiscord<zumi.dxy> man that client looks like a dream
09:27:52PMunchYeah the single company being able to ban you threat isn't great
09:29:08FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> This just in "Centralisation is bad" 😛
09:29:24FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @Amun-Ra "Robyn: yes, but it's": True
09:29:33PMunchOn the other hand it means spamming is harder
09:29:36FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @Elegantbeef "This just in "Centralisation": It isn't :P
09:29:42PMunchSo it's a double edged sword..
09:29:49FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> It very much is bad
09:29:56FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @PMunch "On the other hand": Matrix had a moderator's guilt type thing
09:30:02FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @Elegantbeef "It very much is": I meant it is, sorry
09:30:10FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> I need to read over what I type better
09:30:20FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @chronos.vitaqua "Matrix had a moderator's": Guild
09:30:27PMunch@Robyn_[She/Her], moderators guilt thing?
09:30:31PMunchAh :P
09:30:43FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Yeah, I make a lot of typos
09:30:53FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> You say it has less spam but discord still has a fair bit of spam
09:30:59FromDiscord<nnsee> moderator's guilt. where all of the faces you ban during the day come back to haunt you
09:31:08FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> So it's just a side effect of public servers
09:31:12FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @Elegantbeef "You say it has": Oh it definitely does, it's not moderated enough
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09:32:00FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> I do think one could add a spam protection feature on a homeserver
09:32:03PMunch@Elegantbeef, I'd say 98% of the spam in the Nim community comes from Matrix
09:32:21FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Sure but discord tends towards DM spam
09:32:21FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @Elegantbeef "So it's just a": Hence why something like a shared ban list is a good idea, though I think that someone should need to either do something very heinous or be banned in multiple servers for the ban to be globally banned on all servers that use the system
09:32:25FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> ^^^
09:32:28PMunchAnd that is *after* we added the Mjolnir antispam thing
09:32:36FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @Elegantbeef "Sure but discord tends": Used to have a problem with that a while ago
09:32:41PMunchAh right, for some reason I never get those..
09:33:04FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> It's odd :p
09:33:20PMunchI might not be active enough
09:33:45FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Well a shared ban list is a bit of a joke
09:33:46FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> The homeserver can just cool down/ban people for sending spam
09:33:46FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> If I send a message that is 99% similar in a large number of matrix rooms I'm probably not a human
09:34:21PMunchFair
09:34:38PMunchAt least if the message is longer than some set of characters, or sent very quickly
09:34:43FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> This falls apart if you run your own spam homeserver
09:34:50FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> But that's an easy block
09:36:12FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> We can always look at email though for whether centralisation stops spam 😛
09:36:38FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> There are like what 4 email services being used nowadays, and spam is still prevalent
09:38:12FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @Elegantbeef "Well a shared ban": Eh, imo it'd work well for communities specifically made for groups that are discriminated against commonly
09:39:03FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> I mean sure any cesspools generally should be blocked from a homeserver
09:39:20FromDiscord<nnsee> In reply to @Elegantbeef "There are like what": i mean
09:39:23FromDiscord<nnsee> to be fair here
09:39:39FromDiscord<nnsee> my hmail accounts pretty much never get spam in inbox
09:39:45FromDiscord<nnsee> gmail even
09:40:08FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Yea depends on how dumbly you were with your email 😄
09:40:34FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> If your email finds it's way on a spam list, you're done!
09:41:04FromDiscord<nnsee> the one i've had for ages now (literally my first gmail account) gets quite a lot of spam, 10-20 emails a day, but it almost always ends up in my spambox
09:41:32FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> After saying that cesspool think I'm sorta surprised fourthrie.ch is not a registered domain 😛
09:41:38FromDiscord<nnsee> the one exception i can think of is when someone used google's own services to trigger an email sent to me with spam content
09:41:51FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Someone needs to pick that up and make it the most anti-nazi website
09:41:54FromDiscord<nnsee> i think it was via google sheets edit requests or something?
09:42:11FromDiscord<nnsee> probably because it's reich not riech
09:42:39FromDiscord<nnsee> but that doesn't seem Alice either
09:42:41FromDiscord<nnsee> Alice, even
09:42:42FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Hey it's 2\:30 and you expect me to spell words properly
09:42:49FromDiscord<nnsee> god damn it autocorrect
09:43:02FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Damn wonderland
09:44:03Amun-RaAlice?
09:44:21FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> I was just going to jokingly say I don't think any users with `@fourthrei.ch` in their name would be worth talking to, but had to make sure that wasn't a real domain
09:44:35Amun-Ra;)
09:44:53FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Yea I do not know what word fits where Alice sits
09:45:05FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> alive?
09:45:58FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Oh wait it is registered
09:46:50ZevvPMunch: how did our session sink in overnight for you
09:47:12Amun-Raspeaking of these kinds of domains: the chemistry institute of jagiellonian university in cracow had domain ch.uj.edu.pl (ch - chemistry, uj - jagiellonian university); the problem is ch.ujk in polish is di.ck (in the most derogatory form)
09:47:28Amun-Rach.uj*
09:47:33FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @Elegantbeef "I mean sure any": Oh definitely, but abuse prevention is needed
09:48:18FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> I don't see how you can do prevention in a decentralised platform
09:48:28FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Ostensibly everything should be whitelisted at the start
09:48:50FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @Elegantbeef "I don't see how": Was referencing a shared banlist type thing
09:48:56FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> As time goes on you do create a blacklist of servers
09:49:21Amun-Raif I have a proc with static bool and when statement inside its body, amd I right thinking nim actually creates two separate C functions?
09:49:24FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Well that's more intervention than prevention, but tomato potato
09:49:30FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Yes
09:49:49FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Static parameters are monomorphically instantiated just as generic parameters
09:49:49Amun-Rathanks
09:50:48FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> https://github.com/nim-lang/Nim/blob/91efa49550b377e677cb0ff0d10e0c1192955b63/tests/statictypes/tstaticprocparams.nim
09:50:53FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> It's a fun example of the rabbit hole you can go
09:50:58FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Atleast in devel 😉
09:52:36Amun-Ra;)
09:54:50FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @Elegantbeef "Well that's more intervention": Fair, but yeah that's how it should ideally be done
09:57:11FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> Sure we don't disagree but when talking about spammers a banlist does not work, the homeserver needs to just prevent repeat events in different rooms
09:57:12FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> The commenting about it being a joke was in response to spammers
09:57:12FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> You don't need a ban list if you get banned on your own homeserver 😄
09:57:46PMunchZevv, well I was working until 11PM last night, so haven't had a ton of time to think about it.
09:58:01PMunchBut one thought struck me, this could replace something like FreeRTOS right?
09:58:10FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @Elegantbeef "Sure we don't disagree": Yeah I understand that
09:58:30FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Hm, I wonder if that would be better as something integrated into the server or as an appservice
09:58:33PMunchI mean these RTOSes are basically your typical OS task scheduling, but with the ISR based CPS stuff you showed me none of that would be necessary
09:58:37FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Or a bot
09:58:38PMunchNo more guessing stack sizes
09:59:11FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> I don't know if Bots or AppServices get full access to public server events
09:59:21FromDiscord<Elegantbeef> I also don't know why I capitalised how I did
09:59:27ZevvPMunch: well, 'replace' is quite a thing.
09:59:37Zevvbut it's a viable alterantive for a lot of cases I think
10:00:03Zevvyou know, under the hood the stuff that runs is not different from a handful of small ISR handlers
10:00:11Zevvit's just that you don't have to write the spaghetti yourself
10:00:38Zevvbut it will not bring you things like process priorities and paralellism just like that
10:00:57Zevvalthough this would be pretty much "trivial" to add.
10:01:17Zevvand like I said, the nice thing is that there is no magic scheduling CPU architectural specific stuff under the hood. It's just Nim.
10:01:25Zevvso it's hyper portable.
10:03:28Zevvalso, the way I built the demo to be strictly ISR driven might not be the right model of course. you might as well run this safely from normal CPU context instead.
10:04:24Zevva model i sometimes use is to put the CPU to sleep the normal way, and have interrupts enable. My main loop does a quick poll of the global interrupt status registers to see which ISRs fired and then runs what needs to be done to service that, and go back to sleep. So it's interrupt driven, but without ISRs
10:05:29PMunchYeah of course not, you'd still need to implement some kind of scheduler
10:05:43Zevvexactly.
10:06:11PMunchBut you could build all that on top of CPS, instead of having to use ISR to do context switching the old fashioned way
10:07:12PMunchZevv, right with that architecture you could easily decide which task has the highest priority
10:10:20PMunchJust a thing about the limitations though, how do you know if you violate any of them?
10:10:38PMunchAre there errors thrown at compile-time, or do you just get sub-optimal behaviour
10:11:18Zevvgood questions.
10:11:43Zevvand of course, you can prioritize. If there are X tasks suspended and Y is happening, it's up to your scheduler to figure out which one to resume first
10:12:08Zevvthe real-time behavior will never be as strict as old fashion ISRs of course
10:12:15Zevvsince there is no reentrancy.
10:12:34Zevvbut it's not black and white. You can easily mix and match. No reason *not* to have ISRs and tasks
10:12:35PMunchHmm, what do you mean by that?
10:12:53Zevvwith normal ISRs your main code is interrupted whatever it's doing and your ISR runs
10:13:04PMunchYeah
10:13:11Zevvso you have hard real time semantics - you can guarentee your code runs withing 1 uS of the event happening
10:13:14Zevvthat's what interrupts do
10:13:24PMunchSure
10:13:36Zevvbut like I said, one does by no means exclude the other
10:13:54Zevvit's all small and very non-intrusive
10:13:57PMunchBut what did you mean by reentrancy?
10:14:12Zevvlike true multitastking
10:14:24Zevvtask A is doing something stupid and spins but B still gets to run
10:15:19PMunchAh right
10:15:24Zevvwhich is a nice feature but a pain to deal with because you get into all the normal problems with exclusion and locking and data races and what more
10:15:32PMunchYeah I guess this is slightly more cooperative
10:15:53PMunchAlthough with the control-flow slicing you'd have to do something really stupid to not trigger a CPS breakpoint
10:16:43Zevvwell, beware that CPS will only slice when there is a CPS call in your code
10:16:56Zevvso if you make a tight loop for(volatile int i =0; i <1e9; i++)
10:17:00ZevvCPS will not break that for you
10:17:09Zevvfor those cases it's trivial to make a yield() though
10:17:27Zevvwhich is basically a cpsMagic that will stash the task in the pool
10:17:31Zevvwhere it will be picked up "later"
10:17:56PMunchWait, only when there is a CPS call?
10:18:03Zevvright. that's by design.
10:18:15Zevvyou are in control of where you suspend
10:18:23PMunchRight, the graphic you shared made it seem like it sliced on every control flow boundary
10:18:42Zevvgood point, maybe we need to make that more explicit.
10:18:51Zevvit *used* to be like that tho
10:18:59PMunchAah, right
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11:13:35FromDiscord<arnetheduck> for anyone contributing to impactful open source projects on github, you're eligible to participate in launch of one of the more serious zkvm projects of this year: https://provisions.starknet.io/
11:27:14FromDiscord<odexine> Not sure what this means for us
11:44:31PMunch@odexine, I think it was more of a "if you contribute to other projects" kind of notice
11:44:42PMunchThe last category: "You made at least three commits to a repository that is one of the top 5,000 repositories worldwide, ranked by number of stars, before November 15th, 2023. At least one of these commits occurred during 2018 or later."
11:45:23FromDiscord<odexine> I mean more of “yeah, and?” kind of question but put more nicely (I’m not that good at putting things nicely)
11:45:41PMunchHmm, apparently I'm eligible
11:45:48PMunchNot quite sure why :P
11:50:45Zevv"Congratulations!"
11:52:33ZevvPMunch: do you copilot
11:53:22PMunchNope, I prefer to get a normal seat when I'm out flying
11:53:55Zevvfair enough.
11:54:34PMunchBesides, I don't have a pilot license, so I doubt they'd allow me up there anyways
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11:59:07FromDiscord<nnsee> In reply to @arnetheduck "for anyone contributing to": what is a zkvm
12:04:38FromDiscord<arnetheduck> In reply to @nnsee "what is a zkvm": a zero-knowledge virtual machine - executes code and at the same time generates a zero-knowledge proof that the code was not manipulated and that execution carried out according to the code -> users can verify for example that a transaction was carried out correctly -> you can outsource code execution to others and trust that the result was not manipulated (and prove it to others without revealin
12:06:35FromDiscord<nnsee> interesting
12:19:11PMunchAnyone have a more elegant way of doing this? https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=EgwepUgOihtO
12:40:10FromDiscord<odexine> In reply to @arnetheduck "a zero-knowledge virtual machine": Is the proof generated using energy wastage?
12:40:57FromDiscord<odexine> Or rather just how is it made
12:41:31FromDiscord<odexine> Well actually duh never mind, zero knowledge so it’s different from usual
12:42:41Zevvi have zero knowledge
12:45:49FromDiscord<odexine> At least it’s just zero, I got it in the negatives…
12:49:01FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Underflow go brrrr
12:59:48PMunchLaughs in Ghandi nukes
13:00:32FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> That's actually just a meme that went viral, apparently dev of the game said that bug isn't even possible
13:05:02PMunchHaha, yeah I just read up on the Wikipedia article
13:05:17PMunchStill a very iconic example of integer underflow, true or otherwise
13:05:58FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Oh yeah definitely
13:06:08FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Look at pacman for the effects of integer overflow :P
13:06:13FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Level 256 go brrrr
13:06:33FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Also the original mario on the NES for the minus levels
13:06:45FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> And I thiiink Mario 3 for OOB memory access
13:28:53PMunchOr the Pokemon missingo
13:29:33PMunchNot technically an underflow situation though, but reading from memory that contains something else than what you expect
13:33:23FromDiscord<nnsee> iirc it was that certain regions didn't clear/overwrite the buffer for which types of pokemon can spawn in that region, and other regions or cutscenes? used the same memory location as a buffer for other things, I think for item names or the textbox or something
13:33:57FromDiscord<nnsee> going to the region which didn't clear the buffer started trying to spawn pokemon found in that buffer, but since it wasn't valid data, missingno spawned instead
13:34:01FromDiscord<nnsee> probably misremembering something
13:35:39PMunchSomething like that, yeah
13:36:53PMunchI think it was tied to a specific puzzle needing some extra memory which was placed somewhere no pokemon could spawn. So they re-used the memory for the spawn table for the puzzle. But if you timed it just right and flew from one place to another (which didn't trigger the reset of the spawn table) then it still had the puzzle in the spawn table.
13:36:59PMunchAt least that's how I remember it :P
13:54:51FromDiscord<odexine> From what I remember it involved a sequence-like data structure and a faulty size update, leading to invalid reads
14:03:59FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @PMunch "Not technically an underflow": Ooh, original mario + tennis game to manipulate the Mario level counter
14:04:15FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> It's a sheer coincidence that the tennis game works like that
14:04:24PMunchWait what?
14:04:31FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Yeah, for the NES
14:05:13PMunchFound a wiki article on the Pokemon missingo thing, apparently your name was briefly changed for a tutorial, and your actual name was stored in the spawn table location
14:05:53FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> There's a tennis game that uses a counter for tracking footsteps which is used for playing sounds, by sheer coincidence it doesn't clear the Mario level counter, and since Mario also doesn't clear it on reset, it can use the steps from the Tennis game to manipulate what level you spawn on
14:06:11FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Even spawning on levels using tiles as the name instead of the typical `3-1` for example
14:06:20FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> I found it pretty interesting, unfortunate it was before my time
14:06:33FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Would've loved the retro consoles, emulators aren't the same I'd imagine
14:06:51FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> That must be a stab to the heart for people here xD
14:07:08FromDiscord<nnsee> liveoverflow made a video analyzing the missingno bug (in terms of what you'd do if you were trying to figure it out yourself)
14:07:11FromDiscord<nnsee> it's pretty good
14:07:19FromDiscord<nnsee> https://youtu.be/p8OBktd42GI
14:07:23FromDiscord<nnsee> just watched it
14:08:51FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> I'm not interested in Pokemon much tbh, even on a technical level
14:09:09FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Oh, but Atari is pretty neat with how it worked for writing bytes to the screen
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14:31:24FromDiscord<66aaron23> Need help, trying to use nimx but when I import nimx/window it says cannot open the files https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/371759389889003532/1208058048900505690/image.png?ex=65e1e6bb&is=65cf71bb&hm=67ac068d6a4a3e707863fc90a223d1a437bae94487efdd8c60715731793fa0d4&
14:31:42FromDiscord<66aaron23> (edit) "Need help, trying to use nimx but when I import nimx/window ... it" added "and nimx/text_field"
14:41:22FromDiscord<nnsee> In reply to @chronos.vitaqua "I'm not interested in": it's less pokemon and more about memory debugging
14:41:31FromDiscord<nnsee> the concepts are pretty abstract and not just about pokemon
14:41:57FromDiscord<nnsee> In reply to @66aaron23 "Need help, trying to": have you tried actually compiling the code?
14:42:03FromDiscord<nnsee> nimsuggest gets confused sometimes
14:42:08FromDiscord<nnsee> and may need a restart
14:42:16FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @nnsee "the concepts are pretty": Fair
14:42:36FromDiscord<nnsee> the follow up video is interesting as well
14:50:55FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> I might take a look then! I usually only put videos on when eating lol
14:59:28FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Out of curiosity, does anyone think that the docs website generated by `nim doc` could be improved in any way? What are people's gripes about it?
15:03:05FromDiscord<zumi.dxy> needs table of contents in mobile view
15:03:37FromDiscord<odexine> In reply to @zumi.dxy "needs table of contents": This
15:03:37FromDiscord<zumi.dxy> i'm assuming it's hidden because it would be Too Damn Long to scroll through in mobile
15:03:59FromDiscord<leorize> it has horrible groupings
15:04:26FromDiscord<zumi.dxy> honestly a long ToC would probably be preferable than scrolling through blindly or guessing from ctrl+f
15:04:37FromDiscord<odexine> Or that a pop up side bar hasn’t been implemented yet
15:04:50FromDiscord<zumi.dxy> true
15:05:30PMunch@Robyn_[She/Her], I have plenty of ideas :P
15:05:41PMunchBasically why I put so much time into improving jsondoc
15:06:29FromDiscord<arnetheduck> In reply to @odexine "Or rather just how": a zk proof a cryptographic / mathematical primitive - in many ways, it's similar to a public key signature (often with an elliptic curve involved, just like signatures)
15:07:10PMunchMy idea was to generate jsondocs for all the standard library modules across versions, and all modules in Nim across their versions. Then insert all that information in a database and link it together based on the nimble package definition of which packages where required. So now you have a fully searchable, fully cross-linked version of the docs
15:07:32PMunchWant to get every procedure in the ecosystem which takes a Stream object as the first parameter, easy!
15:08:01FromDiscord<zumi.dxy> i'm kinda interested in having man pages for nim functions like C does↵found this thread which seems to imply that the formatting even in json heavily assumes something can parse HTML <https://forum.nim-lang.org/t/8798>
15:08:38FromDiscord<zumi.dxy> yes even if libc + everything else function manpages aren't a good idea, but it's very useful in a pinch
15:10:54PMunchYeah it still implies some HTML parsing
15:11:10PMunchBasically I gave up at some point while porting it to jsondoc
15:11:20PMunchI just wanted something to work for my Ratel documentation
15:12:49PMunchTo get it working properly I think the best bet is to first rip out the jsondoc and latex doc targets, then rewrite the HTML doc target to a JSON one and implement HTML and Latex as separate executables. Then allow nim doc to run these executables, similar to how `git log` runs `git-log` under the hood for example
15:13:26FromDiscord<zumi.dxy> i wonder how the latexgen one works
15:14:17PMunchPoorly is my best guess :P
15:17:04FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @leorize "it has horrible groupings": Oh? Elaborate by that?
15:17:43FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @PMunch "Basically why I put": I was actually looking into that and planning on potentially using that to generate comprehensive docs for the web (and also via a bot)
15:18:13FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @PMunch "To get it working": Ah hm
15:21:36PMunchIt's just a small subset of HTML though, so parsing it shouldn't be that hard if you want to use the existing output
15:22:49FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> If I get time for that, I could look into doing a rewrite? Seems like it'd be very useful for generating formats for other doc targets↵↵HTML, CSS and the appropriate JS is out of my scope completely though, so
15:22:59FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> And same with LaTeX, also out of my field
15:23:17FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> For generating docs, that's essentially just working with macros, right?
15:23:35FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> I'd imagine this would be a good and fairly decent contribution to a language I love to use :P
15:24:18PMunchNot really macros, it's built in directly in the compiler
15:30:21FromDiscord<leorize> basing the json output on whatever that LSP does might be a good idea
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15:34:36FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @PMunch "Not really macros, it's": std/macros-esque? Since the compiler AST seems similar from when I messed with it
15:34:49FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @leorize "basing the json output": Wdym by that? I don't understand
15:35:04FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Like, basing it on nimsuggest's codebase?
15:35:41FromDiscord<leorize> no, LSP can show docs, right? and they can distinguish parameters and types as well
15:36:05FromDiscord<leorize> so their output format must be doing something right
15:36:10FromDiscord<leorize> study it
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15:38:49PMunchIs it possible to put `{.compile:.}` pragmas in the config.nims file?
15:40:02FromDiscord<leorize> nope
15:40:07PMunchI think nimsuggest/the lsp clients just show the raw markdown/rst stuff
15:40:24PMunchAnd yeah @Robyn_[She/Her] the API is similar to macros
15:40:27FromDiscord<leorize> and you shouldn't use config.nims anyway, it's slow af
15:40:47PMunchBut much more versatile
15:42:06FromDiscord<leorize> I haven't seen a good use of it's extended capabilities, though
15:46:47PMunchI use it currently to recursively add passC:"-I" for each folder in a big folder
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15:57:24FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @PMunch "I think nimsuggest/the lsp": Yeah that's what I thought
15:57:53FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> I'd imagine if the docs generation was reworked, it'd be nicer to use it in the lsp unless it has it's own API
15:58:20FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> I'll take a look at what the LSP does, can't guarantee I'll even work on this anytime soon considering I'm finally able to focus on one project without immediately jumping ship-
15:58:37FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> This is much more than a short side project
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16:03:03FromDiscord<griffith1deadly> In reply to @leorize "and you shouldn't use": then use just .cfg?
16:07:11FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @griffith1deadly "then use just .cfg?": I think leorize meant mostly for when it comes to code execution
16:07:18FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Configuration is probably fine for the most parf?
16:07:22FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Part
16:08:05FromDiscord<leorize> for configuration is what I meant
16:08:17FromDiscord<leorize> if you can get away with .cfg, go for it
16:09:22PMunchI mean it takes an imperceptible amount of time to run my config.nims script..
16:09:28PMunchSo I don't worry about it too much
16:10:14FromDiscord<leorize> I thought so until we got rid of that in nimskull, sped the compiler up a bunch
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16:10:41FromDiscord<leorize> turns out not having to sem system.nim for nimscript speeds things up
16:10:47PMunchIs there a way to mark an import as used?
16:11:13FromDiscord<leorize> you can just add the used pragmas the last time I checked
16:12:10PMunchOn the import?
16:12:13PMunchI get an error..
16:12:31FromDiscord<leorize> I just checked what I did but looks like you have to modify the imported module
16:12:32FromDiscord<leorize> https://github.com/alaviss/nim-sys/blob/master/src/sys/private/syscall/posix.nim
16:13:14PMunchBut isnt' that for people importing that module?
16:13:22PMunchNot for the imports in that module
16:13:30FromDiscord<leorize> yea
16:13:31PMunchThe reason I need this is because I create modules via a macro
16:13:47PMunchAnd I lazily throw in some imports that the module might need
16:14:10FromDiscord<leorize> try some push pop for the warning then?
16:14:27FromDiscord<leorize> or you could just turn off that warning for the module
16:15:24FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @leorize "for configuration is what": Oh huh
16:16:14FromDiscord<onigirimental> How can I get C++ header for my nim library?
16:16:36FromDiscord<leorize> you write it yourself, pretty much
16:16:51FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @PMunch "The reason I need": I typically do something like `discard compiles(functionCall)`, with `functionCall` being a function from that library
16:18:37PMunchOh good idea
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16:25:42FromDiscord<jmgomez> In reply to @onigirimental "How can I get": Compile with `--header:YourCppHeader.h"`
16:27:41FromDiscord<maker_of_mischief> do you think i could jank nim into being able to work with this?↵https://ce-programming.github.io/toolchain/
16:29:28FromDiscord<leorize> should not be too hard
16:29:56FromDiscord<leorize> your main concern will be what is the target CPU architecture
16:30:11FromDiscord<leorize> and how programs start
16:37:53FromDiscord<ebahi> is it possible to have valueless keys using parsecfg?
16:38:32FromDiscord<ebahi> without tje equal sign also so something like this:
16:39:13FromDiscord<ebahi> (edit) "without tje equal sign also so something like this:" => "sent a long message, see https://pasty.ee/qKCiaOtDLJiG"
16:39:33FromDiscord<ebahi> (edit) "long message," => "code paste," | "https://pasty.ee/uzKBRtmvDoAU" => "https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=rrqQOIPcnFFg"
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16:50:54FromDiscord<leorize> I don't think you can, parsecfg parses an ini derivative and they're all key value pairs
16:58:07FromDiscord<ebahi> hmm
16:58:18FromDiscord<ebahi> arethere any resources to make custom file formats in nim?
16:58:23FromDiscord<ebahi> (edit) "arethere" => "are there"
17:02:04FromDiscord<leorize> reading the parser is an easy way to do it
17:02:54FromDiscord<odexine> you could basically make a derivative of parsecfg
17:03:09FromDiscord<nervecenter> In reply to @ebahi "are there any resources": If you're using binary formats, I've discovered all you really need is `std/streams` and `std/endians`, so that's a start. Writing bytes to a basic `FileStream` is pretty easy.
17:03:49FromDiscord<nervecenter> That would of course be the foundation of further structured formatting anyways.
17:04:17FromDiscord<odexine> in the context above, theyre making a config format
17:04:30FromDiscord<nervecenter> Oh I see
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17:04:59FromDiscord<ebahi> hmmm ill look into parsecfg
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17:08:40FromDiscord<odexine> checked
17:09:01FromDiscord<odexine> parsecfg supports key-only format
17:09:16FromDiscord<ebahi> how?
17:10:04FromDiscord<odexine> shows here https://nim-lang.org/docs/parsecfg.html#supported-ini-file-structure
17:10:40FromDiscord<odexine> sent a code paste, see https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=zlgcoXlnFBpq
17:11:12FromDiscord<odexine> value would be the empty string in such case
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17:11:53FromDiscord<ebahi> oh yea, thank you i'll try to see if it works how i want it
17:11:56FromDiscord<odexine> so when calling `getSectionValue` please set the third parameter to another string
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17:12:02FromDiscord<odexine> so that you can disambiguate
17:12:16FromDiscord<odexine> https://nim-lang.org/docs/parsecfg.html#getSectionValue%2CConfig%2Cstring%2Cstring%2Cstring↵sorry 4th parameter
17:12:44FromDiscord<odexine> sent a code paste, see https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=LxCoZxUoTTIG
17:13:22FromDiscord<ebahi> hmmm i see ill see how it works
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17:20:42johnjayeHow does Nim handle stuff like overflow compared to C?
17:21:33Amun-Ranim raises an error on overflow
17:22:36FromDiscord<djazz> for ints, not unsigned ints
17:22:40FromDiscord<djazz> i think
17:23:40johnjayeok. this is probably vague but you know how in C it feels like it's constantly making these weird decisions just so some really weird architecture could be supported?
17:23:46Amun-Raoverflow in C applies to signed ints only
17:23:55johnjayei think not reporting overflow and having -fwrapv is part of that. because not all hardware has overlfow
17:24:39Amun-RaC defined unsigned "overflows" as wrapping around
17:24:43Amun-Radefines*
17:26:27johnjayeas i understand it it will optimize assuming overflow doesn't happen
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17:26:50johnjayewhereas with -fwrapv it will allow signed overflow and not remove your code. e.g. int f(int i) { return i + 1 > i; }
17:27:11johnjayewithout -fwrapv i believe this would be optimized to always return 1
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17:27:38Amun-Rathere was no standard signed int format defined until C23, that's why overflow is undefined
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17:29:23Amun-RaC23 defined signed format as two's complement only; so no more ones' complement, sign-magnitude, etc.
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17:37:33johnjayethat's very strange.
17:37:41johnjayeso C goes so far as to not even assume two's complement?
17:38:11Amun-Ranope
17:38:31johnjayei guess that makes my point for me. i'm basically asking if nim tries to relax some of these pedantic assumptions of c.
17:38:39Amun-RaC was born in old times, were weird architectures roamed the world
17:38:43johnjayeright
17:38:50Amun-Rawhere*
17:40:09johnjayethere's 2 different things here though. there's running on outdated archs, then there's targeting embedded hardware with no FPU, MMU, etc.
17:40:21johnjayehow does nim approach those compared to c
17:40:59Amun-Rafpu is compiler's poblem
17:41:36Amun-Raand mmu is agnostic to the topic
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18:43:25FromDiscord<JJ> In reply to @Amun-Ra "overflow in C applies": that's very interesting. til
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18:47:05FromDiscord<fosster> hi guys, does the nim's stdlib have a Result type (value-or-error type)?
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19:02:03Amun-Ranope
19:02:33FromDiscord<nervecenter> In reply to @fosster "hi guys, does the": It has a rudimentary Option type: https://nim-lang.org/docs/options.html
19:03:09Amun-Rathe closest is ofc return+raise
19:03:11FromDiscord<nervecenter> Variants are probably the weakest part of Nim's type system and really could use some cleaning.
19:03:24FromDiscord<nervecenter> (edit) "cleaning." => "cleaning or re-imagining."
19:03:26Amun-Rafisster: https://github.com/arnetheduck/nim-results
19:03:33FromDiscord<leorize> nim-result and badresults exist
19:04:06FromDiscord<leorize> https://github.com/disruptek/badresults
19:22:25FromDiscord<fosster> thanks
19:22:55FromDiscord<fosster> I just hate exception-type error handling, but they chose it to be the standard in nim unfortunately
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19:24:21FromDiscord<whisperecean> Do we have some library for any message queue software?
19:24:54Amun-RaI wrote a very crude result implementation but finaly reverted back to raises, I mark all the exceptions explicitely (bc of having push raises: [] at the beginning of every file)
19:25:17FromDiscord<saint.___.> In reply to @fosster "I just hate exception-type": What do you prefer?
19:26:28Amun-Raresults are just exceptions in disguise
19:27:05FromDiscord<fosster> results↵(@saint._.)
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19:38:09FromDiscord<fosster> results are less ambiguos than exceptions, exceptions may happen in every moment and unexpectedly if you don't make it obvious in the code that something may fail↵(<@709044657232936960_=41mun-=52a=5b=49=52=43=5d>)
19:39:19FromDiscord<nnsee> but there are methods of making exceptions explicit in nim, forcing you to handle them as you would results
19:39:27FromDiscord<nnsee> ie with the `raises` pragma
19:39:46FromDiscord<saint.___.> In reply to @nnsee "but there are methods": I thought this was the opposite that exceptions forced you to handle them and results didn't
19:39:49FromDiscord<saint.___.> In languages in general
19:39:50Amun-Ra{.push raises: [].} is your friend:)
19:39:53FromDiscord<saint.___.> I guess I'm getting it mixed up?
19:40:03FromDiscord<saint.___.> Or is it lang dependent
19:40:23FromDiscord<saint.___.> I realize in nim with the discard thing results are sort of forced to be consumed or handled
19:40:33FromDiscord<saint.___.> Seems more of an anomaly for nim
19:41:11FromDiscord<leorize> results must be handled at the exact usage site, so it's a little more explicit
19:41:40FromDiscord<nnsee> sure
19:41:53FromDiscord<nnsee> mind you i prefer result types as well
19:42:26FromDiscord<nnsee> but you can get pretty far with exceptions and it doesn't have the same issues in nim than it does elsewhere
19:43:24FromDiscord<fosster> I thought raises was just an indication, I didn't think it would ensure that you handle the exception↵(@nnsee)
19:43:38FromDiscord<fosster> I thought `{.raises .}`was just an indication, I didn't think it would ensure that you handle the exception
19:44:37Amun-Raif you mark your func with raises: [] you must handle all the exceptions in the body
19:45:18Amun-Rathat's why I always have {.push raises: [].} at the top and mark all exceptions explicitely
19:45:31FromDiscord<leorize> nim exceptions isn't any more remarkable than the rest, other than a cheaper handling fees
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19:48:41FromDiscord<nnsee> why must we fight
19:49:00FromDiscord<fosster> you mean in the body of the function or where the function was called?↵(<@709044657232936960_=41mun-=52a=5b=49=52=43=5d>)
19:51:05Amun-Rafosster: https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=fpGiIKKPdTMA
19:53:38FromDiscord<leorize> i'd sell you my errors library if it worked well \:p I have an idea to build one on top of `union`, and error passthrough is simply an extension of the result `union` (ie. `int | ParseError | IOError`)
19:53:54FromDiscord<leorize> sum types ended up being too expensive to build properly outside of the compiler so that didn't fly
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20:02:11FromDiscord<fosster> thx↵(<@709044657232936960_=41mun-=52a=5b=49=52=43=5d>)
20:04:11Amun-Rafosster: https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=VisvVJEhFxGb
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20:34:39FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> In reply to @nnsee "but you can get": Like unrolling the stack? :p
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21:41:59FromDiscord<aryzen> What would be nice would be a beginners channel
21:42:31FromDiscord<aryzen> My skill level is far too low to really be clogging this channel up with constant easy questions
22:05:16FromDiscord<graveflo> In reply to @aryzen "My skill level is": You can ask them here. This channel typically is beginner questions
22:13:13FromDiscord<aryzen> alright then, I'll keep that in mind
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22:27:47FromDiscord<aryzen> How can an Echo have side effects?
22:28:08FromDiscord<aryzen> (edit) "Echo" => "echo"
22:28:34advesperacitit writes to stdout
22:29:01FromDiscord<aryzen> oh
22:29:22FromDiscord<aryzen> And is there anything like a dot operator? or does it just flatly import all exported symbols?
22:29:43FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Depends what you mean? I don't understand what you mean exactly
22:29:44advesperacityou can use debugEcho if you need to echo for debug purposes in a func or {.nosideeffects.}, but that should be removed once you're done with it
22:30:05FromDiscord<aryzen> Oh ok, that makes sense
22:30:18FromDiscord<Robyn [She/Her]> Nim uses UFCs for function calls and also always imports defined types in the thr global scope
22:30:29FromDiscord<aryzen> In reply to @chronos.vitaqua "Nim uses UFCs for": That answers it, thanks
22:31:01FromDiscord<that_dude.> https://nim-lang.org/docs/manual.html#lexical-analysis-operators You can also use any of the following for symbol operators
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22:58:23FromDiscord<aryzen> so, `doSomethingOn(thisThing)` is the same as `thisThing.doSomethingOn`?
22:58:43FromDiscord<aryzen> or am I misunderstanding?
23:00:20FromDiscord<that_dude.> Same thing
23:00:40FromDiscord<aryzen> and I'm guessing that's done just so people who come from other languages can feel comfortable?
23:01:34FromDiscord<that_dude.> sent a code paste, see https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=IZASECZsqViP
23:02:05FromDiscord<that_dude.> Yes, but also so that you can show intent on how you express things while only needing to define it once
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23:03:11FromDiscord<that_dude.> It's a simmilar thing with the case insensitivity. That way you can use code from any other code base and you can freely adapt it to your naming style.
23:03:20FromDiscord<that_dude.> (edit) "simmilar" => "similar"
23:04:46FromDiscord<that_dude.> I like using `a.b` when I'm grabbing a detail or doing some conversion `thing(a.asC)` for example while I like using `a.b()` when mutating a, `a.update()`
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23:12:45FromDiscord<aryzen> The fact that everything sits at the same level is a bit difficult for me, but I can see it’s versatility
23:13:58FromDiscord<aryzen> At least at this moment I can’t think of any issues from it either though
23:14:49FromDiscord<that_dude.> sent a code paste, see https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=ANIntrTdmEhV
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23:31:35FromDiscord<graveflo> In reply to @that_dude. "Speaking of help, what's": `array[3, cfloat]` is contiguous memory. You will have to daelloc anything you allocate to the heap that is not dealloced by something else
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23:37:18FromDiscord<graveflo> sent a code paste, see https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=GaNvUUSabree
23:39:30FromDiscord<graveflo> sent a code paste, see https://play.nim-lang.org/#pasty=kmgRNqisFkpZ